Custom 5-Lug Conversion Questions

[Bimmerfreak87]

I have been researching :bow:tEh fiVe LugZ for some time now. This has been a very helpful guide so far (http://www.torque-bound.com/5-lug.htm) except I have a question, which I believe is not mentioned in the write up. What hubs do I need to use? I'm assuming 96-99 E36 M3 hubs, but can I use regular E36 hubs or is there even a difference? I just bought 96-99 E36 M3 spindles and I need to buy the hubs next.

Also, I was wondering if I can use regular E36/pre 96 E36 M3 control arms with the offset bushings, the eyeball arms from http://www.treehouseracing.com and caster/camber plates? Would this combination improve the caster enough to work correctly/center wheels? Anyone try this? I know people use regular E36 control arms with caster/camber plates to improve caster enough so wheels/tires don't rub, but with all this how close would wheels be to center? Thanks!

[Dagamus(NM)]

My caster is dead on with treehouse cabs, 98m3 ca's, 99m3 spindles with bilstein monotubes under h&r 50407's.

I tried regular e36 spindles and it sucked. Why go through all the hassle and not get the m brakes?

My rear end is all m-coupe with adjustable camber/toe plates on the subframe.

[Bimmerfreak87]

I definitely agree, but I have not been able to find 96+ E36 M3 ca's anywhere. Found M spindles, hubs, and everything, but the ca's. Thats why I was wondering if I can get away with regular E36 ca's or pre 96 M3 ca's. Sounds like not if you have all that stuff and it is right on. Guess I'll just keep looking for 96+ M3 ca's. Thanks.

[george graves]

My caster is dead on with treehouse cabs, 98m3 ca's, 99m3 spindles with bilstein monotubes under h&r 50407's.

Sorry to thread jack - but I'm going to anyways. Why is it that I get the impression that half the e36 5-lug set ups are all screwed up in one way or the other? How do you know that yours is all in spec and correct?

I'm not asking to be an ass - I'm asking cause I want to go 5-lug and I want the e36 m3 brakes. But it seems that a lot of people end up with a less than ideal set up. What gives?

[jahnaboi]

Sorry to thread jack - but I'm going to anyways. Why is it that I get the impression that half the e36 5-lug set ups are all screwed up in one way or the other? How do you know that yours is all in spec and correct?

I'm not asking to be an ass - I'm asking cause I want to go 5-lug and I want the e36 m3 brakes. But it seems that a lot of people end up with a less than ideal set up. What gives?

I know mine IS in spec of OE as I have access to an alignment rack (Just tires) at my leisure. Once I get my GC hybrid camber plates, I will be setting my camber up front back to stock to save my tires.

[HellzMindPlaya]

It isn't that people usually end up with a less than ideal set up, it just that if you think that you can do it on the cheap with regular e36 stuff that you will get a less than ideal set up... If you pay to play, as you have to do whenever you do anything, it all works out just fine. I am running e36 m3 front stuff (complete knuckle, control arms, struts) along with a set of tree house racing eyeball arms, and ground control Spec e30 camber/caster plates so I can continue to run my H&R sport e30 springs.

I have yet to get the car on a rack and have everything set where it should be, but I have been driving on it for going on like 10 months now, and all I did was after I got it on the floor and driving I used a set of race toe plates (what are they called again) to set the toe, and then we set camber somewhere around a degree. Drives beautifully. Toe is set at like 1/16 in if I remember correctly.

There was just a learning period that the 5-lug swap must have gone through or something, same as any swap really, we all had to learn what "just works", and what "works best." Those who went for the "works best" are most happy I would guess, followed by those who replaced their "just works" with the stuff to make it a "works best" setup... Those who still have their "just works" stuff on their car probably would tell you to stay away from the swap.

I read all that I could, asked a few questions, and did my swap using "works best" stuff the first time and I couldn't be happier with the outcome!

[Bimmerfreak87]

My question about the ca's was answered, but still looking to find out if there is any difference between the E36 M3 hubs and regular E36 hubs.

Also, looks like I need to find z3 I-6 rear suspension and brakes... What does the I-6 part of the z3 mean? International as in non-us z3??? Can someone clarify rear parts needed so I can figure out where to start looking and so I don't waste time looking at recyclers if it is non-us parts I need... Thanks

[Farbin Kaiber]

I6 = Inline, six cylinder.

[Bimmerfreak87]

I6 = Inline, six cylinder.

Thanks very much. So I need to find inline 6 z3 suspension and brakes... should hopefully be able to find that easy enough.

Still wondering if there is a difference between E36 M3 hubs and regular E36 hubs? Does it matter for 5 lug swap? Anyone know?

[Dagamus(NM)]

The computer printout of my last alignment showed that my caster is within spec of a stock e30. My camber is a bit off but that is because I haven't decided on plates yet. Plus I am not really feeling dealing with getting the fucking strut bearing off again. My socket that I ground down last time is paper thin and I can see it braking and me spending another two hours with the dremel.

As far as where to get the control arms, buy them new. They are a wear part and it makes no sense to skimp here as you will just end up replacing them anyways.

Be prepared for abs fun too. I spliced the sensors on the rear when is went from 318ti to mz3. I need to do the fronts and see if it works. Last I messed with it I tried all of the different methods of rotating the stock e30 sensor in the hole and it would just trigger the abs immediately with and pedal pressure. I pulled the relay from inside the abs module and called it good.

As far as the spindles or hubs as referred to above. I compared them side by side and the m spindle does put the wheel slightly farther forward. Some people claim great success ith the regular e36 stuff but my experience with a slammed vert was frustrating and expensive.

Good luck.

[Bimmerfreak87]

As far as where to get the control arms, buy them new. They are a wear part and it makes no sense to skimp here as you will just end up replacing them anyways.

I would like to, but where can I buy them new? $670 at the stealership :loco: so please don't say that...

As far as the spindles or hubs as referred to above. I compared them side by side and the m spindle does put the wheel slightly farther forward.

I know this and I have already ordered my M spindles. I am asking if there is a difference in the hubs? Will M hubs only work on M spindles or can I use reg E36 hubs on M spindles. M hubs=$95/each, reg E36 hubs=$50/each... this is the question I'm looking to get answered plz.

I pulled the relay from inside the abs module and called it good.

:rofl:

[Dagamus(NM)]

The hubs will cost more, but you get to run bigger brakes too. Calipers can be had cheap from car-part dot com. For the control arms, I'm pretty sure I got lemfoerder units from rmeuropen for about $175 each, not much more than stock e30 pieces. I tend to buy parts from pelicanparts with numbers from realoem dot com.

One of the questions to ask is what wheels do you plan on running? I have rondell 58's 17x8 with et35 and I had to run 5mm spacers with the m calipers to get the wheels to not hit the cooling fins. I could have grinded them down but decided (not an easy decision) to run the spacers instead. Next I get in there I may see of I have worn the brakes down enough to clear without spacers. No issues other than excessive splash on the rocker pneals when going through water. I wonder if there are any mudflaps that work with an mt2 kit.

What are you doing in the rear. This seems to be trickier. E30 m3 hubs are expensive, but when you consider what you can keep stock it really comes out to be the same. I have mcoupe rear($$$) and am pretty happy.

[Bimmerfreak87]

The hubs will cost more, but you get to run bigger brakes too. Calipers can be had cheap from car-part dot com. For the control arms, I'm pretty sure I got lemfoerder units from rmeuropen for about $175 each, not much more than stock e30 pieces. I tend to buy parts from pelicanparts with numbers from realoem dot com.

Ah, very helpful. Thanks. :mrgreen:

One of the questions to ask is what wheels do you plan on running?

Well, I want to run 18x8 et35 CSL wheels if possible... with spacers of course. Not sure how thick yet.

What are you doing in the rear. This seems to be trickier. E30 m3 hubs are expensive, but when you consider what you can keep stock it really comes out to be the same. I have mcoupe rear($$$) and am pretty happy.

Not sure... I have an 87 325i and I read that I needed trailing arms, brakes, hubs, etc. from a z3 with an inline 6cyl... Is this the only way I can go? Where to get rear setup parts would be a great help as I have no way how to tell if any z3 rear stuff I'm looking at is out of a 6cyl or 4cyl or what... Suggestions??? Best setup???

[Aptyp]

Ah, very helpful. Thanks.



Well, I want to run 18x8 et35 CSL wheels if possible... with spacers of course. Not sure how thick yet.

18x8 ET35 will fit without spacers pretty nicely

Not sure... I have an 87 325i and I read that I needed trailing arms, brakes, hubs, etc. from a z3 with an inline 6cyl... Is this the only way I can go? Where to get rear setup parts would be a great help as I have no way how to tell if any z3 rear stuff I'm looking at is out of a 6cyl or 4cyl or what... Suggestions??? Best setup???

You can bolt on 318ti trailing arms, you'll just have to live knowing that you replaced high performance porsche bearings with low performance tiny bearings.

[Dagamus(NM)]

What are you talking about? The porsche bearings/axles are the mcoupe stuff. The 318ti rear bearing fit the same size as the stock e30.

I have my 318ti rear end and you are welcome to it for cheap, I need garage space more. Brakes, axles, new pads, trailing arms and lines. I can toss in a subframe but you would want to modify it for adjustable camber and toe.

Other choices are to just get e30 m3 hubs for the rear and a big brake kit for the e30 m3. Your wheels may stick out farther in the front but you could take advantage of a staggered set of wheels. Wide rears.

I suggest getting a bbk for the rear if you go the e30m3 route as this will cost only a little more than stock and you will actually be able to find them. Stock e30 m3 calipers tend to be a little hard to find.