Best Track Setup

[Charlie]

Charlie, what are you using for a rear pad with HT-10's up front? When I planned to run HP+/HP+, I was disappointed to find that only HPS is available for the rear. If you're running HPS rear, how does the car feel under trailbraking?

If I were spending the $$ to do a 350hp S50, I would sure as hell do full E36 M3/Mcoupe 5-lug with floating rotors, track pads, and large ducting...and wide rubber. My $.02

I've been running HT10 up front with HPS in the rear. On cold tires it can get a little squirrely under hard braking, but it tends to go away as you get heat in the tires. Now that it looks like the HP+'s are showing up, I'll probably run those in the rear.

-Charlie

[Mike B.]

[quote=matt;544414]More rotor mass just means your brakes take longer to heat up.

{/quote]

This is exactly why rotor mass is very important. You don't have brake fade if your not boiling fluid. Rotor mass, pad size, pad compound, fluid and cooling are all important parts of a properly functioning system - neglect one and the whole system is compromised.

BBK's aren't necessarily going to stop your car more quickly, but they will allow you to make those same stops over and over again without brake fade.

Btw, my comparison of the E30 and the SC is an accurate based on the sizes of the vehicles, braking systems of each vehicles and the intended use of the vehicles (AX's / DE's).

As it was stated earlier, "Porsches have some of the best brakes around". What is so different from the SC to the E30? Pad and rotor size.

[Stu]

I have hp+ on all 4. Tirerack has them.

Excellent! Thanks.

CDOC and my local import parts shop only dealt HPS for the rear, though that was about a year ago. Thanks for the info

[IS]

I have hp+ on all 4. Tirerack has them.

[Stu]

Charlie, what are you using for a rear pad with HT-10's up front? When I planned to run HP+/HP+, I was disappointed to find that only HPS is available for the rear. If you're running HPS rear, how does the car feel under trailbraking?

If I were spending the $$ to do a 350hp S50, I would sure as hell do full E36 M3/Mcoupe 5-lug with floating rotors, track pads, and large ducting...and wide rubber. My $.02

[HalexH]

where is this BMW shop in SF that does turbo s50 swaps into e30's? name of shop?

Shop will not be doing swap. Just engine work. I am doing the swap in myself. They are just machining the block.

[golde30]

sorry about the misunderstanding for the engine output its a stock car. However I have already set aside about 9000 for making it into a good track car. I was quoted 350 from a BMW shop in San Francisco with a turbo s50.

where is this BMW shop in SF that does turbo s50 swaps into e30's? name of shop?

[Brian D]

Are you arguing for the sake of arguing? Next time, contribute to the matter at hand.

I'm not arguing at all, merely pointing out what I feel is a misleading statement. My point was, if you are tracking the car, it doesn't matter if it was designed as a certain type of car. Next time I'll contribute as you have, by regurgitating someone elses advice.

With a setup like charlie suggested (albeit there are tons of great pads out there) and sufficient brake cooling, the e30 will brake quite well and be adequately fade resistant.

[IS]

How does what type of car it is change the laws of physics? Maybe the brakes "know" that it's a sportier car?

Are you arguing for the sake of arguing? Next time, contribute to the matter at hand.

[Brian D]

The rotor mass and pad size are relatively small, especially when compared to a Porsche SC, which has similar hp/weight.

Mike, youre comparing a sports car to an sports sedan. Porsche has always had some of the best brakes out there.

How does what type of car it is change the laws of physics? Maybe the brakes "know" that it's a sportier car?

HalexH, you say "track car" like that's all that there is to it. What are you going to do on the track-HPDE, SpecE30, BMWCCA? What is your experience level? You will get better answers if you give these guys some info to work with.

[BrandC]

However I want to do all of the suspension and brake work before I do the engine conversion.

With 350hp, you might want to even think of upgrading to E36 5-lug parts. There is a guy on this board (lukasmotors.com IIRC) and he used the massive M-Coupe brakes and rear suspension on his E30 w/ an M50. I'm guessing if the M-coupe weighs more and it has an S52 or even an S54 powering it, a lighter E30 with the same equipment should stop pretty well, CONSIDERING that you have good gripping tires already.

With the 5-lug you can run larger wheels, brakes, and tires that can handle the power output adequately. Hope that helped a bit...

[HalexH]

sorry about the misunderstanding for the engine output its a stock car. However I have already set aside about 9000 for making it into a good track car. I was quoted 350 from a BMW shop in San Francisco with a turbo s50.

However I want to do all of the suspension and brake work before I do the engine conversion.

What do you guys think about the Ireland Engineering 330mm brakes

Or would something like wilwood or ap do a better job. I think the IE is 2 pot and the wilwood and ap are 4 pot. correct me if I am wrong.

[Dave]

SpecE30 uses stock parts. The only thing you can upgrade are the pads and the fluid. You cannot even use the brass bushing parts that some outlets sell.

Guess what, they stop their cars pretty well AFAIK.

[wazzu70]

Im sure the guy has never tracked a vehicle before or has any experience or he wouldnt have to ask.

PRO3 race class uses stock size rotors and stock calipers with upgraded pads and brake fluid, stianless lines ect. Im sure spece30 runs something similar.

These are race cars that only see track time. If its good enough for them its good enough for you. It never hurts to upgrade, but is it really worth it at your driving level? Thats what you have to ask yourself.

[matt]

Are you planning to just do DE's, Auto-x and time trials? Or, are you planning to race the vehicle?

With 350 rwhp, you will definitely need to upgrade to bigger brakes. I personally think the stock brakes are marginal at best for tracking a stock E30, even with upgraded pads and fluid. The rotor mass and pad size are relatively small, especially when compared to a Porsche SC, which has similar hp/weight.

If you are planning to race you will have to take a look at the rules for the class you wish to race in and see what you can take advantage of brake-wise.

Ironicaly, these two things are way the hell down at the bottom of the list of things that matter in brake systems. More rotor mass just means your brakes take longer to heat up.

The things that do matter to performance are how much friction force the pads can generate (coefficient of friction) how long the moment of the friction force is (rotor radius) and how quickly they can get rid of the heat they generate. The pad compound and fluid are important to preventing fade, along with proper brake cooling.

Mike, youre comparing a sports car to an sports sedan. Porsche has always had some of the best brakes out there.

With a setup like charlie suggested (albeit there are tons of great pads out there) and sufficient brake cooling, the e30 will brake quite well and be adequately fade resistant.