Caster? new control arm bushings & rubbing

[jcboal]

So i redid the front suspension on my '86 325 es. New ball joints, control arm bushings strut bushings and tie rod ends. One side turned out great, on the other side however the wheel is way too far back and rubs when i turn. ( i should mention i have ground control coilovers & bilstiens).

not sure why the difference. i did notice on the bad side the control arm is further back in the control arm bushing. could this be the issue? is there a way to "push" it forward in the bushing and have it stay?

I did replace the control arm on the good side (it was cracked), but it was an oe replacement.

any ideas????

[KenC]

Post some pics and we can probably figure it out for you.

Bent CA maybe?

[jlevie]

The shoulder of the control arm should be against the bushing on both sides. The most likely explanation for the difference in wheel position is a bent control arm. Less likely, but possible, would be a bent strut or frame damage. Replace the control arms with new parts and see if that corrects the errors. Offset control arm bushings will push the wheel forward and can compensate for slight damage to the frame or strut.

[nrubenstein]

The shoulder of the control arm should be against the bushing on both sides. The most likely explanation for the difference in wheel position is a bent control arm. Less likely, but possible, would be a bent strut or frame damage. Replace the control arms with new parts and see if that corrects the errors. Offset control arm bushings will push the wheel forward and can compensate for slight damage to the frame or strut.

And offset control arm bushings installed backwards can pull it back.

[jlevie]

And offset control arm bushings installed backwards can pull it back.

Very true!

[jcboal]

Bad side: are the first two

Good Side (the rear part of the wheel well is damaged & pushed back, but the other side rubs further in any way):
second two

I dont have offset bushings. they are centered rubber (solid unlike the OE with gaps)

[jlevie]

Okay there is damage somewhere. Start by installing a new control arm and tie rod on the side that is off. If that doesn't fix it replace that strut housing. If that doesn't work, take the car to a good frame shop.

[jcboal]

What about the difference in how far back each control arm sits in the CAB? - That is my main question.

There wasn't any damage a month ago, before i replaced everything.

I hate replacing the control arm when i just spent $ on new ball joints & and getting them pressed in.

The tie rod end is new as well

I may try some offset CAB's as that is the cheapest option at this point to move the wheel forward a bit.

I am thinking the junk adjustable camber plates i took off must of adjusted the caster as well, and the new strut bushings pushed the wheel back.

[jlsr]

Your question is the same that I had after rebuilding my front suspension. I replaced my bushings with the M3 offset bushings which are known to increase the caster. My right front caster was slightly out of spec once I had the alignment done to correct the toe for the new tie rods. I haven't had the chance to crawl back under the car to measure the two control arms closely, but I suspect that the right control arm was not pushed into the bushing quite as far as the left side. I believe that this resulted in a greater length between the bushing and the middle ball joint on the control arm, resulting in my right caster being slightly larger (farther back) than the left side.

It's hard to tell exactly by the angle of your pictures, but the control arms in the bushings don't look that far off from each other to result in such a radical positioning difference between the two front wheels. My front wheels don't show any positional variation that yours does for it to be the bushings/control arm settings. my $0.02.

I wasn't aware that offset bushings had a front vs. back. How can you tell? And please don't say that it has 'front' written on one side.

[straight6pwr]

What about the difference in how far back each control arm sits in the CAB? - That is my main question.

if everything was straight and true they should sit the same.
something is bent, and jlevie has given you the best process for trying to find the bent piece from both a budget and ease point of view.

control arm could be bent
strut housing could be bent
front subframe could be bent
frame could be bent
time and space could be bent (do do do do)

[e30leigh]

from my experiance the lower arms are cast. they shouldnt bend much at all... they tend to crack instead. but thats my experiance with the controll arms but i spose it is possible.

are the grooves/lines on the bush and mounting/housing lining up? if not it will put the caster out. also the bushes needed to be exactly centred otherwise the same happens. i tend to alow 0.5mm difference.

if all apears well. then as mentioned replace the lower arm. or compare it with a new one first. i would recommend genuine parts as well. if that still doesnt work then like said id have the rails checked

[straight6pwr]

from my experiance the lower arms are cast. they shouldnt bend much at all... they tend to crack instead. but thats my experiance with the controll arms but i spose it is possible.

i hit a curb in a previous e30 once. the lower control arm twisted like a pretzel, no cracking at all.

[jcboal]

from my experiance the lower arms are cast. they shouldnt bend much at all... they tend to crack instead. but thats my experiance with the controll arms but i spose it is possible.

That has been my experience too, but i didn't want to open that can of worms.

are the grooves/lines on the bush and mounting/housing lining up? if not it will put the caster out. also the bushes needed to be exactly centred otherwise the same happens. i tend to alow 0.5mm difference.

I will have to double check, but they were solid bushings so i dont think they could be mis-aligned, but i need to check.

if all apears well. then as mentioned replace the lower arm. or compare it with a new one first. i would recommend genuine parts as well. if that still doesnt work then like said id have the rails checked

I figure this is what needs to happen. new control arm & offset bushings... I love redoing what i have just done!!

I am 99% sure the rails are okay. this car has not been wrecked, it is suuper clean & straight.

[e30leigh]

i would go back over those bushes. look carefully for the arrow on the bush itself. and then make sure it lines up with the raised line or arrow on the cast holder.

its odd that something like this would happen. it must be a misalighnment issue for it to happen now when it was fine before.

[jeffnhiscars]

I just replaced a bent CA (re&re'ed an offset CAB), bent strut housing and snapped tie rod (dont ask).

If they are not offset CAB's (ie concentric circles) I dont see how it matters how they are installed (rotation wise). If you used identical parts on both sides and something is off, the message is pretty clear...something is damaged.

Since you swapped ball joints, my 2c guess is a bad CA.

...and where the CAB sits on the CA I believe is governed by suspension geometry. Thats why its recommended that you load the suspension while the lube is still wet. The fact that the lollipops lined up with the CAB's in different positions only reinforces my opinion that something is out.

Just sayin'