Coilovers vs. H&R race?

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  • gearheadE30
    No R3VLimiter
    • Jun 2007
    • 3734

    #1

    Coilovers vs. H&R race?

    I've got some APEX springs in my 318is now, and they are wayyy too soft for autocross. The car is still a daily driver, but I want some stiffer spring rates to reduce roll. The sways are staying the same for now, although I may eventually get a cabrio front bar and an iX rear bar.

    The M42, as most of you know, has a really low oil pan, and I'm afraid that races may be too low. The price is about equal, because I would just go witht he basic GC stuff-adjusters and springs.

    Any reccomendations on which way to go, or spring rates to get for mostly street driving and somewhat regular autocrossing. I'm currently running bilstein sports, so I'm not getting new shocks.
    Last edited by gearheadE30; 07-07-2008, 07:01 PM. Reason: update title

    Project M42 Turbo
  • DSP74
    E30 Enthusiast
    • Nov 2007
    • 1121

    #2
    See my PM on E30 tech.

    450 550 would be really nice, and a bigger front bar will help to control camber loss during body roll. There are cheaper alternatives than Ground Control
    sigpic


    88 325is

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    • gearheadE30
      No R3VLimiter
      • Jun 2007
      • 3734

      #3
      OK, after a day on the web, I have it narrowed down to there options:

      GC coilovers-$360
      Cosmo coilovers-$190
      Ireland Engineering front, Cosmo or GC rear-$???

      Opinions? I don't know if Cosmos could stand up to multiple winters, considering the bare metal. GCs are a bit pricey for what you get, even if the quality is much better and there is a greater range of adjustment. The IE combination seems like a good deal, and I could just pick up some GC/eibach springs. The price is in the middle, assuming I could find rear adjusters. I don't want the IE 1 7/8 inch spring limitation.

      Suggestions? Opinions? Snide remarks?

      Project M42 Turbo

      Comment

      • Danny
        Moderator
        • Feb 2008
        • 14217

        #4
        I have H&R race on my 318.

        I love them.

        Comment

        • etxxz
          R3VLimited
          • Feb 2006
          • 2085

          #5
          consider WHAT shocks just as much as what springs...

          lets start by the Cosmos being Aluminum construction (won't rust). They come with the same type of adjustable perch as GC AND have a very nice teflon addition that eliminates noises. They're springs are 2.8" vs 2.5" GC just in case you were wondering compatability. been rocking them two years. i rate 10/10 performance. ebay spring rates of 8/10 (450/560) but you can custom order. they are in UK i think so lead times may apply.
          No more e30s for me.
          88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
          88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
          91 BMW 325i [sold]
          86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
          http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

          Comment

          • Van Westervelt
            R3V OG
            • May 2006
            • 9365

            #6
            H&R/GC>IE all day long
            sigpic

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            • smonkbmw
              Professor
              • Jun 2006
              • 4549

              #7
              if youre speaking of roll as in what your car is doing in your sig, you need sway bars, not springs. springs will help but keeping the car flat is more of a swaybars job.

              on topic: i as always recommend the hr race over all. ive seen somewhere a adjustable "hat" for the rear, to adjust height. i wanna say bav auto, could be wrong though.

              Comment

              • 318isbmw
                Moderator
                • Nov 2005
                • 2841

                #8
                Daily drove IE3's on my e30 for 3 years so far, had no issues. Hate the reverse rake but they were cheap at the time and work great. Never had issues w/ them being too low w/ the m42 oilpan either.

                Don't worry about the drop w/ the h&r race's, similar to IE3's and it isn't bad if your careful what goes under your car.

                Comment

                • z31maniac
                  I waste 90% of my day here and all I got was this stupid title
                  • Dec 2007
                  • 17566

                  #9
                  Originally posted by gearheadE30
                  OK, after a day on the web, I have it narrowed down to there options:

                  GC coilovers-$360
                  Cosmo coilovers-$190
                  Ireland Engineering front, Cosmo or GC rear-$???

                  Opinions? I don't know if Cosmos could stand up to multiple winters, considering the bare metal. GCs are a bit pricey for what you get, even if the quality is much better and there is a greater range of adjustment. The IE combination seems like a good deal, and I could just pick up some GC/eibach springs. The price is in the middle, assuming I could find rear adjusters. I don't want the IE 1 7/8 inch spring limitation.

                  Suggestions? Opinions? Snide remarks?
                  As far as longevity is concerned I can give you some input on the GC E30 track/school kit.

                  The car I bought had this suspension already installed, he put it on the car about 5 years and 8000 miles ago. The collars and adjusters, plates, everything still look great (it was a FL car too) the only thing that looks a little ragged are the allen head screws that hold the camber adjustment. And GC just sent me some new ones to put in there.
                  Need parts now? Need them cheap? steve@blunttech.com
                  Chief Sales Officer, Midwest Division—Blunt Tech Industries

                  www.gutenparts.com
                  One stop shopping for NEW, USED and EURO PARTS!

                  Comment

                  • DSP74
                    E30 Enthusiast
                    • Nov 2007
                    • 1121

                    #10
                    My ground Control setup on my Camaro after similar useage, with probably several hundred miles of autox runs the threads were SHOT on the adjusters...From the springs rubbing them....Which isn't to say someone elses wouldn't do the same thing.....Probably would it's just aluminum.......
                    sigpic


                    88 325is

                    Comment

                    • DSP74
                      E30 Enthusiast
                      • Nov 2007
                      • 1121

                      #11
                      Originally posted by etxxz
                      lets start by the Cosmos being Aluminum construction (won't rust). They come with the same type of adjustable perch as GC AND have a very nice teflon addition that eliminates noises. They're springs are 2.8" vs 2.5" GC just in case you were wondering compatability..
                      Measure the spring's INSIDE diameter.....Not to be a dick but you guys using the Cosmo setup are fucking something up. I CONTINUE to here conficting information about the size of the springs.....From 2.5 to 2.8 to 3.5" springs......WTF is it??????


                      And while I've been on the Cosmo is fine band wagon lately, if they do not use 2.5" springs they are utterly useless
                      sigpic


                      88 325is

                      Comment

                      • gearheadE30
                        No R3VLimiter
                        • Jun 2007
                        • 3734

                        #12
                        Originally posted by DSP74
                        And while I've been on the Cosmo is fine band wagon lately, if they do not use 2.5" springs they are utterly useless
                        Yeah, no kidding. That's another topic that makes me a bit wary.

                        318isbmw and smonkbmw, I would go H&R races if they weren't about the same price as coilovers. At $350, I think coilovers offer a lot more for the money. I am also not much of a fan of progressive rate springs on an e30. All of the linearly-sprung cars I've driven were much more predictable on bumpy surfaces like the autox courses I drive on.

                        I have found many sources for rear adjusters; that isn't a problem. If I could get universal front adjusters, however, I would save between $50 and $100.

                        The reason I want the adjusters to be treated in some way is that aluminum corrodes easily. For some reason, this seems especially true in Indiana. The salt evenmade the aluminum lips on my rims start to corrode :(...

                        As for swaybars reducing roll, I konw, except the car also exhibits excessive dives and bottoms out too easily. Bars won't fix that ;). I will eventually go stiffer bars, though, probably with an iX bar in the rear and a cabrio bar front with M3 mounts if they are legal in STS.

                        Project M42 Turbo

                        Comment

                        • etxxz
                          R3VLimited
                          • Feb 2006
                          • 2085

                          #13
                          Originally posted by DSP74
                          Measure the spring's INSIDE diameter.....Not to be a dick but you guys using the Cosmo setup are fucking something up. I CONTINUE to here conficting information about the size of the springs.....From 2.5 to 2.8 to 3.5" springs......WTF is it??????


                          And while I've been on the Cosmo is fine band wagon lately, if they do not use 2.5" springs they are utterly useless
                          cosmo is 2.8" ID...if you could no figure that out from my post. Please explain why the different ID makes them utterly useless.
                          No more e30s for me.
                          88 black BMW OBDII 332is dedicated track [sold]
                          88 BMW OBDII bronzit 332is [RIP 03/08]
                          91 BMW 325i [sold]
                          86 Corolla 'Ae86' HB 20v trd [sold]
                          http://youtube.com/watch?v=pTj7Hn9v5Rs

                          Comment

                          • nando
                            Moderator
                            • Nov 2003
                            • 34827

                            #14
                            Originally posted by etxxz
                            consider WHAT shocks just as much as what springs...

                            lets start by the Cosmos being Aluminum construction (won't rust). They come with the same type of adjustable perch as GC AND have a very nice teflon addition that eliminates noises. They're springs are 2.8" vs 2.5" GC just in case you were wondering compatability. been rocking them two years. i rate 10/10 performance. ebay spring rates of 8/10 (450/560) but you can custom order. they are in UK i think so lead times may apply.
                            bare aluminum corrodes very easily actually - especially if it's exposed to salt/sand.

                            ditto on them being worthless if they don't use 2.5" springs. and is $360 for GC really that expensive?
                            Build thread

                            Bimmerlabs

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                            • nando
                              Moderator
                              • Nov 2003
                              • 34827

                              #15
                              Originally posted by etxxz
                              cosmo is 2.8" ID...if you could no figure that out from my post. Please explain why the different ID makes them utterly useless.
                              because all the standard springs out there are 2.5" id. so if you want to change the rates, you have to search for an oddball size spring, rather than having a plethora of cheap 2.5" id springs available to you in the new/used market, in any lengths of .5" and 25lbs/in increments.

                              I just don't understand cheaping out on something like this.. it's $200. I guess that's more than your weekly Mcburger paycheck?
                              Build thread

                              Bimmerlabs

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