Ground Control responds: "Camber Plates: Vorshlag vs GC"

[2002maniac]

I look forward to seeing the new and improved GC camber plates. I'm sure they'll be a great product.

[Hellabad]

The actual parts? did Erik bring them over for you to photograph?

All I'm saying is that the Vorshlag camber plates that you pictured are different from the model that Vorshlag sold me when I asked for "E30 camber plates for bilstein shocks and 2.5" perches" (Erik might have the same ones that I do, in which case his claims would be completely correct.)

My camber plates (vorshlag) have more travel and less stack height than GC, 100% guaranteed.

I still disagree. And remember the Original Poster didnt have Bilsteins.

100% truthful would be to show the different options from Vorshlag and not just show the model with the least travel.

But I showed the GC camber plate with the least travel also, the design from 4 or 5 years ago. So I actually I am being as reasonable and fair as possible. I call it 100%

I did not show Vorshlag options from the last 10 days or so, and did not show any of the new GC camber plates either.

Jay

ps didnt you see my post about "stack height" being a red herring?

[Hellabad]

Here is our rally plate. There are a lot of guys using these already. Nuts.

[2002maniac]

I did not show Vorshlag options from the last 10 days or so, and did not show any of the new GC camber plates either.

I'm not sure what you mean by this, I've had my plates for over two years...

[MR_SAZ]

Do you have softball down under?




The pictures at the start of the thread are actual pictures of the parts that erik325, the original poster said he had on his cars. I intentionally ignored different camber plates, in order to be 100% truthful.



Well actually you are wrong, and I'm sorry, because you are so nice about it. The reason for that measurement is to show TRUE suspension travel available over bumps etc. The dimensions shown are indicating the limits of travel, which has nothing to do with where the spring does or does not seat.

The whole concept of "stack height" is a red herring (do you have that phrase in Aus?) to draw attention away from the lack of suspension travel. Every one of these camber plates is for an adjustable ride height suspension, so "stack height" as measured to where the spring touches has nothing to do with anything.

Click here for definition of "red herring".


We do have softball here...but they dont play it on TV...we play rugby and AFL instead..lol no idea about what softball has to do with anything...lol

And ill look into the link u left me...I understand wht ur saying, but my thinking is that the double bearing ring is what reduces your stack height and hence suspension travel..but i`ll read into it more...

To be fair, the whole discussion relates to one set of "OLDER/Different" camber plates that have since been updated...
I guess evolution isnt dead...we all just need to catch up with it!
************I love Bimmers!********



I should take lessons from you. That is a good attitude, which I appreciate.

Jay

[MR_SAZ]

Do you have softball down under?




The pictures at the start of the thread are actual pictures of the parts that erik325, the original poster said he had on his cars. I intentionally ignored different camber plates, in order to be 100% truthful.



Well actually you are wrong, and I'm sorry, because you are so nice about it. The reason for that measurement is to show TRUE suspension travel available over bumps etc. The dimensions shown are indicating the limits of travel, which has nothing to do with where the spring does or does not seat.

The whole concept of "stack height" is a red herring (do you have that phrase in Aus?) to draw attention away from the lack of suspension travel. Every one of these camber plates is for an adjustable ride height suspension, so "stack height" as measured to where the spring touches has nothing to do with anything.

Click here for definition of "red herring".




I should take lessons from you. That is a good attitude, which I appreciate.

Jay

We do have softball here...but they dont play it on TV...we play rugby and AFL instead..lol no idea about what softball has to do with anything...lol

And ill look into the link u left me...I understand wht ur saying, but my thinking is that the double bearing ring is what reduces your stack height and hence suspension travel..but i`ll read into it more...

To be fair, the whole discussion relates to one set of "OLDER/Different" camber plates that have since been updated...
I guess evolution isnt dead...we all just need to catch up with it!
************I love Bimmers!********

sash

[scabzzzz]

How many people actually use Vorschlag camber plates in Spec E30?
Just curious.

[golde30]

just got a set of specE30 plates, and it looks like they are missing something...i dunno, seems weird that they would be floating on the top of stock spring perch instead of going all the way in and resting where it should?? or... have something that replaces the stock spring perch? is this how every1's looks?

[Hellabad]

Spec e30 rules do not allow the upper spring perch to be removed, only the rubber pad may be removed. Therefore, you are required to use the upper perch that came on your car.

Other than the modifications specifically allowed in these Rules, every part of the car must remain as it came from the factory.

9.3.8.7.2. Spring pads may be removed.

That camber plate bolts up exactly like the stock upper mount. You remove the stock upper mount, but don't remove the upper spring perch, and then reassemble exactly how you have it in your hand. The nut goes on top, just like stock and then you bolt it into the car just like stock.


Jay

If you have more questions PM me or start a new thread.

[e30rcr]

Do you have any comparision shots showing the GC camber plate next to a stock strut bearing. I'd like to know how much lower my car will be after installing them, prior to purchasing them.

[e30rcr]

Here is our rally plate. There are a lot of guys using these already. Nuts.

Is that designed to take a strut bar or for rod end struts? If it's for a strut bar I'd be interested in the complete price with bar...

[shotright]

"stack height" as measured to where the spring touches has nothing to do with anything.

Then why did you illustrate this in your OP?

To achieve the same "ride height" when using components with a greater "Stack Height" (measured as you describe) it is necessary to lower the vehicle. If the vehcile is lowered (by either installing different springs or adjusting the lower spring perch) then the suspension travel will be reduced.

...or from a different perspective...

To retain suspension travel when installing camber plates with a greater "stack height", a greater "ride height" is inevitable.

The GC website describes an "articulating needle bearing". Can a needle bearing articulate? How does this work? Is this evident in any of the previous pictures?

[SR20Fastback]

But here is the worst part. Think about it. If SR20Fastback bought Vorschalg plates based on the story presented by Erik, then he has a suspension with less suspension travel, less camber adjustment and less caster adjustment. If he has Bilsteins, he will also need a propane torch to undo the loctite on the strut shaft everytime he needs to work on the suspension, plus he paid more.

In conclusion, my fellow R3Vers, THAT is why the truth is important.

Thanks for the bandwidth. Jay

Jay don't worry about it, I ended up getting the Spec E30 GC plates ;)

and there are konis on the car