Thinking about a E46 XI for winter - what should I know before hand?

[bimmer630]

I never had a problem driving an xdrive in the snow. When you do get really stuck and the dsc starts cutting power and activating brakes etc, just turn it off.

other than that ive been saved a few times going into a corner sliding, the dsc and x drive sorta pointed the car back in the direction i was trying to go

[sector6]

again, thanks!

So, E30 IX vs Subaru...I think I might lean towards a Subaru. I know a guy who is a dealer and goes to the auto auctions regularly. I'm going to see what he can dig up in the lines of a WRX (non-STI).

[nrubenstein]

Honestly, the E46 xi is not bad in the snow at all. It isn't a performance system, but on the other hand you don't have to worry about burning out a viscous coupler, either. It's mostly annoying when you're driving at the limit in the dry. It's actually wicked fun to autox one with the ABS fuses pulled.

Is it as good as an iX? Maybe not. On the other hand, they have more ground clearance.

On similar tires, I always thought my E46 xiT was better than the '02 Subaru WRX in the snow. The Subaru's front heavy understeer tendencies were quite annoying and the braking performance was horrible.

[nando]

26mpg is about the same as our subaru gets. But the subaru has other drawbacks I guess.

[mrmckie]

I was in your boat earlier this year when i picked up my 5 spd 99 CRV awd for $3500 from a friend over a e46 xit for $11k w/ 68k on it in april and i don't regret it. I considered a wrx/9-2x wagon as well but decided to go the cheaper road and sacrifice the speed for gas mileage and maintenance

I'm looking forward to seeing how this thing does in the snow once winter hits with my snows on...

did i mention it uses 87 and i get 26mpg...hehehe..it's kinda slow though lol

[atmobenzin]

No amount of footwork will change that. These kinds of AWD systems are pointless,

Agreed, but I am just saying that the TC does not help at all, just makes it worse by creating larger chance to get stuck due to not letting any of wheels spin when needed.

you'd be better off in a RWD car with an LSD and studs. Except BMW doesn't offer LSD anymore except on M models..

Ground clearance and good winter tires would be more important in my book, after that would come an lsd and other things.

And studs or no studs is yet whole another discussion...

:)

[nando]

And so what that it does not limit slipping? There are three pedals supposed to be in car for a reason. Treacherous understeer? Downshift or clutchkick. Way too much oversteer? Lift your right foot. And so on...
.

you can't control differential slip based on your foot. I'm talking torque going to the wheel with the *least* grip. you get stuck because all the differentials are open. No amount of footwork will change that. These kinds of AWD systems are pointless, you'd be better off in a RWD car with an LSD and studs. Except BMW doesn't offer LSD anymore except on M models..

[sector6]

Ok, so down with the E46 XI. Thanks for all the input.

I guess I should have made this a Subaru thread :)

[atmobenzin]

Still on that hyundai with two open diffs it was still more controllable and would get stuck less, rather than with the TC on.

It could be that the particular hyundai TC system is just that lousy, although I have not driven one that would be any better - especially newer fwd cars in winter tend to understeer on corner entry way more with TC on. Not to mention that it is almost impossible to accelerate in a decent manner with it not being turned off.

And so what that it does not limit slipping? There are three pedals supposed to be in car for a reason. Treacherous understeer? Downshift or clutchkick. Way too much oversteer? Lift your right foot. And so on...

My point is if some snow scares you and you feel the need of these TC systems - you should not be on the road in the first place.

I feel I have led this discussion way off topic and apologize for that.

[bmwstephen]

I own one and its one of the main reasons i drive an e30 plus its paid off. The e46xi was a half ass attempt for bmw to re-enter the awd market. With the auto version there is a poorly designed flex plat and steering wheel coupler that causes vibrations at idle throughout the cabin making ur car feel like a diesel. This occured 16k after buying it new from 2004 and to this date still no solution from BMW. The fact that this versions drive terrain was just a slapped on from the X3 suv, BMW failed to forsee the abuse the cv boots would get on a lower platform, so expect to replace those every 30k. Im on my second one now and it is still leaking. Control arms and other suspension components are twice as expensive too.

-Blame my typos on my fat fingers & Droid Charge

[nando]

I'mnot saying that the x-drive is any good, but - have you tried turning the traction control/stability-whatever off?

For the last two winters(and they do get pretty heavy over here) i used my work assigned car - 07` hyundai tucson 4wd with decent snow tires.
And after the first month of winter with it I came to a conclusion that it handles, moves better from dead-stop and even slides rather controllably with all those idiot systems turned off. With traction control on it actually felt dangerous to drive on anything other than dry pavement. From then on I turn traction control off with every vehicle I am ever driving that has one.

Who the fuck actually invented them?!

if you turn off TC that pretty much disables the AWD. it doesn't have another way of limiting slip.

[atmobenzin]

not all dsc/tc systems are bad. personally, i love the system in my rx8. it'll let you slip the tires, slide a bit, but if you go too far it'll bring you back in line.

That may be true, but I have yet to encounter one I would not despise.

[sector6]

the E46 X-drive sucks. It's basically the same thing as an E30 iX with a burned out VC, except it uses the ABS/TC to try to imitate an LSD.

I second the Subaru comment - especially the older ones, they're really light and fly through the snow. but $10k? what the hell kinda beater are you looking for? we got a MINT '03 for $5500..

...a mint '03 for $5500?. I was looking at new-er WRX's. Also, never said I was looking for a "beater". I want something somewhat reliable so I can take the E30 off the road and work on it. I need something decent for winter, but it will most likely be driven in the spring/ early summer as well.

[Kershaw]

not all dsc/tc systems are bad. personally, i love the system in my rx8. it'll let you slip the tires, slide a bit, but if you go too far it'll bring you back in line.

[atmobenzin]

I've lived in eastern Canada and Boston for a bunch of years, so I have lots of experience driving in the icy/slushy/slick conditions up there. In my experience, the BMW "X-Drive" system is among the absolute WORST when it comes to really slippery conditions. It basically just cuts power. Very difficult to control in a slide, and very hard to get moving once you're stopped if it's really slick. Honestly, you'd be better off with a regular RWD BMW. As long as it's got snow tires and a functioning LSD, you'll be in better shape than you would with an X-Drive car.

If you insist on AWD, get a Subaru with mechanical/viscous diffs. My dad's '05 Forester 2.5 XT was very surefooted in the snow and ice. It had reasonable ground clearance without being wallowy. Never got stuck. Much better than my '03 Lancer Evo VIII (although that car had 400hp, was very low, and ran 255/40-R17 rubber).

Honestly, my old '90 325iX was pretty much the perfect winter beater. I still regret selling it. It was a 1-owner car originally purchased by a BMW CCA life-time member and came with full service history from day 1. With 205/55-R15 snow tires, that thing was a billy goat. Best winter car I've ever driven.

I'mnot saying that the x-drive is any good, but - have you tried turning the traction control/stability-whatever off?

For the last two winters(and they do get pretty heavy over here) i used my work assigned car - 07` hyundai tucson 4wd with decent snow tires.
And after the first month of winter with it I came to a conclusion that it handles, moves better from dead-stop and even slides rather controllably with all those idiot systems turned off. With traction control on it actually felt dangerous to drive on anything other than dry pavement. From then on I turn traction control off with every vehicle I am ever driving that has one.

Who the fuck actually invented them?!