E30 misconceptions or facts?

[Bill 84 318i]

The thing is, people always compare late model E30s (i.e. they had 8 years to work out the bugs) to the brand new E36's (92-94) where none of the big issues were worked out yet. The only troublesome E36s I have encountered are the early ones, where stuff like the interior and the cooling system go sour.

I don't think its a very fair comparison.

But what 'big bugs' did e30's have early on? Rear suspensions didn't fall out, there were no plastic impellers in the cooling system...I can't think of anything on the e30 that was a MAJOR flaw that was fixed later on. The only big recall I can think of at the moment is the heater core valve.

E30's got OBCs, ABS, Cruise Control, and power options. What more do new BMWs have, traction control?

Holy crap man. iDrive, SMG, electronic steering, throttle-by-wire, dynamic sway bars...there's TONS more.

[Jordan325iC]

in top gear once they called the z3 an "american car" and some talking about the american made bmw's built for the american, read: wrong, crowd.

I believe you're talking about the episode with the face-off between the boxster, the s2k and the z4. It was a z4.

And hell yes! iDrive! Still trying to collect the parts for an iDrive swap into my e30. Gonna be sick! Instead of having all those silly knobs and switches, I'll have a set of menus and a mouse!!!

[arsevader]

But what 'big bugs' did e30's have early on? Rear suspensions didn't fall out, there were no plastic impellers in the cooling system...I can't think of anything on the e30 that was a MAJOR flaw that was fixed later on. The only big recall I can think of at the moment is the heater core valve..

What a lot of people also fail to realize is that both of the engines used in the early E30s (M10 & M20) had been used in previous models before the E30 was released. Thay had time to work a lot of the kinks out.

E30 issues include bad ECUs, cracked dashes, bad SI boards, cracked front subframe and the usual front suspension woes that every BMW with wishbones has had etc. Some happen early some happen late, no more or really less than any other car.

As TJ says, the E36 had most of it's kinks worked out by 94. Most of the issues that remained weren't e36 specific anyway as the M50 series was used a variety of cars.

[silversleeper]

i think one of the only things that may make an e30 the "last real BMW" is the fact that the only driver aid it was equipped with was abs. but in the 21st century, u cant expect car companies to mass produce cars that have 20th century technology. its almost as stupid as de-evolution (if there is such a thing). i particularly love when cars were more simple, easier to diagnose and work on. less things that could go wrong. but face it, for the most part (and for the majority of their consumers), the new technology is a positive thing for the cars.

[Digitalwave]

For the times, E30's had all the latest technology as well. OBC's, airbags, ABS, fuel economy, etc. If they built the E30 in 2006 it would have all the new stuff that the new BMW's have.

[E30 Wagen]

For the times, E30's had all the latest technology as well. OBC's, airbags, ABS, fuel economy, etc. If they built the E30 in 2006 it would have all the new stuff that the new BMW's have.

Good point.

[silversleeper]

For the times, E30's had all the latest technology as well. OBC's, airbags, ABS, fuel economy, etc. If they built the E30 in 2006 it would have all the new stuff that the new BMW's have.

i meant technology in the sense of driver's aids. come to think of it, obc's can be somewhat informative (i dont use mine, and to top that off it recently died on me), airbags are driver+passenger safety aids, but fuel economy? i only manage 16mpg, but as far as fuel economy goes, eta ftw!

[Digitalwave]

Well, what I meant was that if there were more driving aids available in the 80's, they would have been on the E30.

Using that logic, does that make the 2002 better than the E30 because it has NO driving aids?

[Ryan Stewart]

Both cars had their issues but the E36 has more.

The problem is that isnt all cost cutting. As they add more safety/economy/comfort features they add weight. In an attempt to keep car weights stagnant they have to cut weight somewhere.

Everyone bitches about the clips used in the E36 vs. the screws in the E30. Well,take a bowl of those clips and a bowl of the screws an weigh them. That shit adds up quick.

Also only recently has aluminum been cost effective as a weight savings device. Its not a matter of BMW being too cheap to use aluminum, its a matter of it being stupid to spend millions more to save a few lbs on a car you are going to make 400,000 of.

Being said, the fit and finish of the new 5s and 3s suck ass. The panel gaps are much bigger than those on my E30 and its worse without any strips to break up the slabs between those gaps.

[uofom3]

i don't think its fair to call the e30 the last "real" bmw, but it is the last of its kind in a lot of regards...

- i think it was one of the last bmw's that you can easily wrench on yourself, and things are in sensible, accessable places. Ever take the knee bolster off an e36 and try and find a relay behind the steering column? you'll be glad you have an e30.

-The e30, though somewhat cutting edge in its day, is still a primitive car. Systems are straight forward, electronics are only in places they are really needed, and a lot of "mechanical" or "manual" sysems still exist. I think this is why so many e30's have surivived neglected lives and are still on the road.

-e36/e39 ect. and new required electronic systems to diagnose some problems or reset the computer. These systems are very expensive and put some smaller shops at a huge disadvantage to the dealerships for service revenue.

The thing that has improved IMO - the motors. The sound of an m20/s14/m42 ect. and feel of them is far, far better. But the motors out of the newer cars are such a huge improvement. If you want to make power in an e30, dumping a shit load of money and time into an m20 is retarded if you are really trying to make power. Why not spend that money and energy on working an m50/s50? Or wait, just drop an s50 straight in an have more power straight out of the box?? That said, i think the s50 is a boring engine and does not make the e36 fun to drive imo, the s14 in my e30 puts a much bigger smile on my face every time i drive it.

Another componet worth mentioning that has improved with the newer cars is the brakes... much better on the e36 ect. cars across the boards.

On paper - every aspect of the cars has been improved. In the end, it comes down to feel. These cars drive differently, are most cost effective to operate, have a large amounts of OE/aftermarket parts available from them, and have the most distinctive look of any bmw that has hit the road IMO (minus the 02)...

Its funny to bring this up as i've been seriously contemplating selling my e36 m3, which after some recently performed work is in very, very good condition.... and buying something along the lines of another e30... just because the e36 is not nearly as fun to drive

[silversleeper]

Well, what I meant was that if there were more driving aids available in the 80's, they would have been on the E30.

Using that logic, does that make the 2002 better than the E30 because it has NO driving aids?

i see what you are saying, and in all honesty, i would love to own a e46 m3 not only because of its drop dead gorgeous looks, but i bet it drives just as good, and a lot better than any modified e30. and it still retains traditional bmw styling, a subtle yet agressive appearance, rwd, and superb performance.

[DEV0 E30]

I love how these threads always go to this with so many of the same arguements coming back and nothing coming from it. E30 forum fact.

[808BMW]

On paper - every aspect of the cars has been improved. In the end, it comes down to feel.

Like on top gear, how the e30 m3 has a slow lap time, but is a pure joy to drive while going "slow"