If you were spending 7K on a new NA M20 engine

[markseven]

Get a hobby that doesn't require dumping $$$ into the engine bay? Watch the kid as baby momma takes a long relaxing bath? Go play cards? Go play golf? Go dump money into a tax-shielded college saving account for the kid? (529) Throw money into a mutual fund for your retirement? Increase your deferred income for your 401K if you're DC and not fully maxed on being matched? Do Auto-X events in the downtime? Build a mini-barn? Hammock? Swingset? Clean your house out? Having a few guys over to share some beers? Learn tennis if you don't know how to play? Join a bowling league?

"Wow" said in my best Jim Halpert impression :D

After reflecting a bit on your advice, I came to the realization that I am one boring, narrow-minded dude. I don't like much else except track days and driving my car. I don't have any other hobbies. I kinda submerse myself in one thing that I like and blot out everything else. BMX when I was in elementary school. Skateboards in jr. High. Drums/punk rock in high school. Now this. I know this expenditure is neither prudent or wise, but aren't most purchases that aren't necessities or staples? Anything over basic maintenance and repairs can be considered frivolous, correct?

**In the end, you are right**

[rwh11385]

Indeed. I may be losing sight of why I bought this car. I wanted a momentum car to learn with... but in the summer months when I don't attend HPDE's (too freakin hot), a fast car can alleviate the boredom.

Get a hobby that doesn't require dumping $$$ into the engine bay? Watch the kid as baby momma takes a long relaxing bath? Go play cards? Go play golf? Go dump money into a tax-shielded college saving account for the kid? (529) Throw money into a mutual fund for your retirement? Increase your deferred income for your 401K if you're DC and not fully maxed on being matched? Do Auto-X events in the downtime? Build a mini-barn? Hammock? Swingset? Clean your house out? Having a few guys over to share some beers? Learn tennis if you don't know how to play? Join a bowling league?

[markseven]

Heh, it's more fun when the E36 M3 or M coupe guys are asking what you have under the hood when you're passing them with a bone stock M20B25 than if you were packing a S50. I like this approach, I recommend it.

Indeed. I may be losing sight of why I bought this car. I wanted a momentum car to learn with... but in the summer months when I don't attend HPDE's (too freakin hot), a fast car can alleviate the boredom.

you're still entirely missing my point. While you love your stance/ride height/ride quality right now with your suspension setup, the 80lbs won't affect that at all, however the added power of any of your new choices will drastically effect your ride quality. So what I'm telling you is no matter what you could probably do to go hard on the suspension i.e. coilovers... you're talking about a 7k m20.... either put things in perspective at least or don't talk to us about building your car. I'm not trying to be rude... I'm just trying to get you to see what the real issue is here. 80lbs... it'll be just like riding with the supermodels who hop in coz it's a bimmer. But 80 horsepower extra kicking you in the ass is going to squat much much harder than you are use to. tires are round... all that extra power does indeed push you forwards, but it's doing so through your tires... and your car wants to stand up if you have traction, so it squats. I love love love m20's, but if I'm dumping 7 grand into my e30, especially if I have a lump 7 grand to spend and not just over the next 3 months or so i'm bleeding off 7k in parts, then there is no way in HELL I'm not getting an S52 and putting that in. And if I'm spending 7k on an engine, I won't have any problem spending 2k on the suspension to get it to the point where it can really be let lose.

You don't want to buy coilovers...but you want a $7,000 M20..... that still won't have the same balance and nimbleness you are used to because you are looking for substantial power gains.

I'll be the first to admit I know little about suspension setup. However, I do know that 80lbs on the front axle will affect the car in a differently than an 80lb super model riding shotgun, well aft of the front axle. An issue that I am not certain about but am willing to discuss is coil-overs and corner balancing. When the desired 50/50 front-to-back and diagonal is met, how does this address squat under acceleration? Also, I never get down to second gear at any SoCal track except Buttonwillow, and even there it's at just one corner. I understand the S52 will give a good kick in the pants, but accelerating in third, fourth or fifth, I am assuming the torque will be lessened and squat shouldn't be an issue.

My budget is $7K installed. Nothing left for anything else, including coil-overs.

On my wish list!

L, there's a guy in north San Diego that is says he can build a 240hp M20 for 6K installed and dyno tuned. I started this thread after speaking with him. A better value than MM, but he doesn't have the reputation. Let me know if you want his info.

Me too, I know you can make more power and be more reliable with a 24v swap, but I still think a 200-210 whp M20 would be pretty sweet.

Werd.

Do an LS1 swap. You can find them for pretty cheap, they weigh the same if not less than M20's, and you get better weight distribution. Plus 350hp out of the box.

Sounds nice... but I think I want ///M Power!

For the record it made:

233BHP @ 5700RPM
238TQ @ 4425RPM

2759cc

Nice! :D ls the torque curve wide?

I think 420 may be more reasonable.

TURBO!!!!

My low boost setting. High boost dyno coming soon!

I'll say it again. 7k gets you a TCD stage 2 kit(A/W Intercooled) with clutch and full exhaust. That's 300 rwhp that will be faster than any N/A S50/52. All this in a package thats been engineered for reliability and you get to keep your low mileage M20...

Haha, you forced induction boys are percisstant! Me likey for you, no likey for me.

Quit bitching, nobody notices or cares about your affinity with sarcasm. We all understand it, but we never ever tell you "LOL, good one man."

¡Simón!

[TDE30]

have you been reading the thread? I was obviously mocking his obsession over not increasing weight 80lbs to almost double power output.

enjoy your asphalt nap you fool!

Quit bitching, nobody notices or cares about your affinity with sarcasm. We all understand it, but we never ever tell you "LOL, good one man."

[z31maniac]

For the record it made:

233BHP @ 5700RPM
238TQ @ 4425RPM

2759cc

5 Angle valve grind (intake) 6 angles on exhaust
JE 85mm Forged pistons 10.2:1 CR
TotalSeal piston rings
Lightweight wrist pins
81mm stroke crankshaft
Blueprinted & balanced bottom end
274°/274° 11.5mm lift Shrick camshaft
Heavily ported & polished head
Reshaped and highly polished combustion chambers
19lb Bosch Design II injectors
Port matched intake manifold
Crankcase oil vapor seperator
Custom CAI & heat shield
8mm red silicone ignition wires
173 DME Unit
UniChip piggyback engine management
M52 HFM (MAF) conversion
Bavarian Autosport full length Jethot coated headers
Jethot coated catless midpipes
Brullen muffler, dual 3in round tips
Lightened stock single mass flywheel (12lbs)

About $3500 spent.

Metric Mechanic is far from the final word in M20's

zOMG!!! A 173 DME??!!?!?!?!?

No dyno sheet, no care.

[Mulholland]

have you been reading the thread? I was obviously mocking his obsession over not increasing weight 80lbs to almost double power output.

enjoy your asphalt nap you fool!

[backtrail69]

Sarcasm is difficult to catch in typing...

[Mulholland]

if you didn't catch my sarcasm you should go take a nap on the nearest highway, for rilz besh.

Besides... the type of people who want a 240hp M20 aren't the type you should be pitching a turbo build to because that obviously isn't what they want.

[backtrail69]

and guys quit saying turbo. He couldn't possibly go turbo without increasing his underhood weight, which would totally fuck his cars balance, you idiots.

Less weight or equal to a 24v....

[Mtriple]

I'll say it again. 7k gets you a TCD stage 2 kit(A/W Intercooled) with clutch and full exhaust. That's 300 rwhp that will be faster than any N/A S50/52. All this in a package thats been engineered for reliability and you get to keep your low mileage M20...

[Mulholland]

and guys quit saying turbo. He couldn't possibly go turbo without increasing his underhood weight, which would totally fuck his cars balance, you idiots.

[Mulholland]

metric mechanic isn't entirely about putting numbers down, however I severely doubt they could maintain the type of longevity intended for those motors even under heavy use if they pushed out anything over what they run.

on a side note, 1) you still povided no dyno or any real proof other than a list of work you did/had done to the motor, up to and including some 8mm silicone ignition wires.... and generally when people get that detailed, it's usually because they can't just show a dyno plot and say "this is what I put down" they feel it is necessary to list every single scrub of info so that you find their statement of power within reasonable doubt. Regardless.... s52 still a better investment over even a 3500 dollar 240 crank horse power m20 because he has to add install on top of it, and can't do any of that internal work himself for sure.

[backtrail69]

I think 420 may be more reasonable.

TURBO!!!!

My low boost setting. High boost dyno coming soon!

[Dave McLaren]

Is 240 reasonable?

I think 420 may be more reasonable.

[E30FTW]

I find that hard to believe if it was N/A.

Metric Mechanic accomplishes 240 at the crank with more displacement a 286 cam, 11:1 compression, custom built intake manifold, headwork and turning 7k RPM.

For the record it made:

233BHP @ 5700RPM
238TQ @ 4425RPM

2759cc

5 Angle valve grind (intake) 6 angles on exhaust
JE 85mm Forged pistons 10.2:1 CR
TotalSeal piston rings
Lightweight wrist pins
81mm stroke crankshaft
Blueprinted & balanced bottom end
274°/274° 11.5mm lift Shrick camshaft
Heavily ported & polished head
Reshaped and highly polished combustion chambers
19lb Bosch Design II injectors
Port matched intake manifold
Crankcase oil vapor seperator
Custom CAI & heat shield
8mm red silicone ignition wires
173 DME Unit
UniChip piggyback engine management
M52 HFM (MAF) conversion
Bavarian Autosport full length Jethot coated headers
Jethot coated catless midpipes
Brullen muffler, dual 3in round tips
Lightened stock single mass flywheel (12lbs)

About $3500 spent.

Metric Mechanic is far from the final word in M20's