Canada's Health Care

[Ryan Stewart]

You guys are funny. Do you have any idea what Labarador is? It's like the moon. There's nothing on that piece of land. Worst than Alaska. So yes, the treatment was not available in his province, just as not every treatment is available in Alaska, Guam, Hawai or Puerto Rico.

With a huge shift in population age, types of diseases are also changing and doctors' fields of operation also need to change. That takes time. Some US patients come to Montreal for some special surgery because some Montreal surgeons have very specific specialties. The other way around also works. Who pays? Obviously the patient does, thu his/her type of coverage.

Its still up in your fucking country. Not ours. So why cant he just go down to little France and get it done?

[Ryan Stewart]

you're oversimplifying it.

I've never asserted equal compensation for all, I'm just saying that financial gain is not high on the list of motivation to enter medicine. A normal human being wouldn't undertake the career for $50k a year no matter how much they loved it. The stress and time dedication isn't worth it.

You are correct. Only a few people I know are doing it for the $$. My girlfriend isnt doing it for the $$.

However, while money isnt a motivator it can be a barrier to entry. Its fucking HARD to become a doctor. You have to go to school for a LONG time. Then be a fucking slave to a real doctor for shit money. Then, maybe, someday you will have your own practice. Now, if you dont get raped for malpractice (which REALLY needs to be reformed) you might be on the road to repaying all of those student loans you had to take). Maybe, by 40, you will eventually be well off. But how many people make it that far?

And there is already a shortage of doctors. All of the decent ones arent taking new patients (I just moved and am looking for new ones). Only the douchebags are (ones with poor reviews). Now, imagine who will be willing to take fed-med cases? I bet its the one the douchebags turn away.

[Raxe]

Its still up in your fucking country. Not ours. So why cant he just go down to little France and get it done?

Why would he want to, especially if the same surgery is available immediately in the States?

[Ryan Stewart]

Why would he want to, especially if the same surgery is available immediately in the States?

My point is, why are we better at it? Why is it more readily available or we have a specialist not available in Canada?

People keep using your system as an example of one that works. Im wondering if it works and ours is "broken" why is someone using his wealth to come down here to use the "broken" system.

[ck_taft325is]

Why would he want to, especially if the same surgery is available immediately in the States?

So, said surgery was not available anywhere in Canada?

[geezerman402]

My point is, why are we better at it? Why is it more readily available or we have a specialist not available in Canada?

People keep using your system as an example of one that works. Im wondering if it works and ours is "broken" why is someone using his wealth to come down here to use the "broken" system.

Both system have their benefits. Canada is good for an every man thing, where small, simple, and common issues can easily be solved. That way people won't have to suffer through things that can readily be solved just because the price is a bit more than they would otherwise be able to afford.

USA is good for crazy exotic shit that takes extreme knowledge and skills in a very specific area. Not worth the cash to fix your cold, but if it's something that could kill you, hell yeah you can offer your money and you'll have the best doctors possible.

Simple.

[gwb72tii]

all anyone needs to know about the USA healthcare system vs Canada's is that nobody has ever flown to Canada to have a procedure done

[Raxe]

My point is, why are we better at it? Why is it more readily available or we have a specialist not available in Canada?

People keep using your system as an example of one that works. Im wondering if it works and ours is "broken" why is someone using his wealth to come down here to use the "broken" system.

Quite simply because the best medical professionals in the world are more likely to operate in a country where they will be most profitable, such as the USA thanks to their privatized health care system.

Not really the fight you were looking for, huh?

It works in that those who cannot afford private care from the worlds best still have a perfectly acceptable alternative in their own country. Those who can afford to pay for private care simply fly to the USA and take advantage of your system. Best of both worlds.

So, said surgery was not available anywhere in Canada?

Probably. Dude has money, it's not his only option.

[reelop19]

So what happens when our health care system starts to mimick Canada's or any other socialized country's? Do specialists start to operate on the black market? Do specialists disappear? Here is the breakdown of my mom's appendectomy yesterday:
8:00 AM - feeling sick all night and makes an appointment to see the doctor
10:45 AM - I take my mom to see the doctor and she gets lab work done which does not look good.
1:45 PM - She receives a CAT scan which shows an inflamed appendix
3:00 PM - admitted to emergency room
5:30 PM - has the appendectomy and is resting comfortably in her hospital bed

Thank you Private Health Insurance. I understand that this is no heart surgery but its my mom and she was in pain so I'm thankful that it was handled all in one day. I admire what doctors can do here in the US and they should be paid well for it. I don't know how something like this is handled elsewhere but our system should be admired and improved on so all others can benefit.

[Mystikal]

What the fuck does it matter if it's a specialized surgery that is NOT available here? You have over ten times as many people, of course there are procedures available there that we wouldn't have. It's a fucking numbers game.

Get over yourselves.

[Massive Lee]

This is big business, with lots of interest on behalf of the insurance companies. If they didn't make huge profits, they wouldn't be in the business. Anyone wonder how much was the doctor's annual liability insurance premium? And who actually pays the bill at the end?

Some money goes to the doctor and hospital for their services.
Some money goes to the doctor and hospital so that they can pay their liability insurance. Huge amount.
Some money goes to the insurance company as profit.

Basically, insurance companies get paid both ways. They have some interest not to change this money making scheme.

So, is this really an efficient return for your dollar?

[z31maniac]

If they didn't make huge profits, they wouldn't be in the business.

Please provide a source for these extravagant profits.

And not in dollar terms, but in % terms vs revenue.

[Hallen]

This is big business, with lots of interest on behalf of the insurance companies. If they didn't make huge profits, they wouldn't be in the business. Anyone wonder how much was the doctor's annual liability insurance premium? And who actually pays the bill at the end?

Some money goes to the doctor and hospital for their services.
Some money goes to the doctor and hospital so that they can pay their liability insurance. Huge amount.
Some money goes to the insurance company as profit.

Basically, insurance companies get paid both ways. They have some interest not to change this money making scheme.

So, is this really an efficient return for your dollar?

What do you mean get paid both ways? I don't think it's the same insurance company that gets the medical insurance premium and the malpractice insurance premium. And trust me, if malpractice payouts weren't as huge as they are, that insurance would cost a lot less. Why, you may ask. Well simple: it's a competitive system and if you charge buckets more for the same service, you'll go out of business.

Huge profits is one of your overstatements, again. Yes, health insurance providers make profit. That's a good thing. It's not like they are necessarily gouging us. Just like you selling your brake kits. Why do it if you aren't making a profit? You're preaching against the very thing that you survive on.

Yes, malpractice insurance is stupidly big expense. That's a problem that must be addressed. Surgeons will pay in the range of $250,000 per year, per surgeon for malpractice insurance. This problem can be fixed with no reforms to the rest of the industry. We'd all see a huge benefit from this kind of reform.

One of the reasons, actually the main reason, health insurance in the US is so expensive now, is the government mandated coverages and the stupid way Medicare and Medicaid are handled. Insurance companies are mandated to cover all doctor visits. They have to cover stuff that is financially infeasible to cover. So, it forces the costs way up. The government programs under pay by law and are much more expensive for health care providers to process and they are slow to pay. All these things mean that health care providers have to pick up the slack by charging more to other customers.

The US system isn't perfect, it has flaws, but a complete socialization of the system is not the answer to fixing it. Much of the socialized portion of health care now IS the problem.

[reelop19]

You know in terms of big business I don't believe health insurance companies make even close to the amounts of profit other businesses bring in. Somebody research that.

[rwh11385]

Quite simply because the best medical professionals in the world are more likely to operate in a country where they will be most profitable, such as the USA thanks to their privatized health care system.

Not really the fight you were looking for, huh?

It works in that those who cannot afford private care from the worlds best still have a perfectly acceptable alternative in their own country. Those who can afford to pay for private care simply fly to the USA and take advantage of your system. Best of both worlds.

that sounds great for canadians to piggy back off our system. But what if out healthcare went the same path? What if no one was like us now and no one had a strong drive for innovation and everyone had long wait times. . .