Polish President Lech Kaczynski dead in plane crash

[Farbin Kaiber]

What questions?

[Luke!]

What questions?

the question if you're a dumbass AND a racist

answer: yes

[Massive Lee]

Countries of the European Union and Russia are joining Poland on an official day of mourning.

http://www.france24.com/en/20100412-polish-president-kaczynski-crash-national-mourning-poland-plane-crash-president-russia-eu

For those who want to know more about the 1940 Katyn massacre (to which commemoration the Poland's president was heading to when plane crashed), awards winner Polish director Andrezj Wajda as made a movie called "Katyn" that relates the sad events.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUhBB3FgslI&feature=related

@ Farbin.

International leaders express their condolences.

http://www.france24.com/en/20100410-international-leaders-poland-airplane-crash-merkel-brown-sarkozy-walesa

"Despite the strains, German Chancellor Angela Merkel was one of the first to express her sorrow over the death of Kaczynski, with whom she had some memorable encounters over differing views on European Union developments and Germany's post-war role."

;-(

[Farbin Kaiber]

the question if you're a dumbass AND a racist

answer: yes

Funny thing, I am neither. You can't title someone with traits from one statement.

There was nothing racist about what I said.

And, LOL at that Merkel bitch.

[E30Kaiser]

This article I found on CNN points out the terrible irony of the occasion as others have stated in this thread. http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/04/1...tyn/index.html

However I found this statement funny. In 1940, Stalin ordered the assassination of Poland's military and political leaders in order to create a leadership vacuum so he could prop up a Communist puppet state in Warsaw. As it implies one of two things, Stalin got beat to the punch by Hitler(which I doubt based on the terrible state of the Soviet military in 1940 and 41), or the writer doesn't know what he is talking about.

[Luke!]

Funny thing, I am neither. You can't title someone with traits from one statement.

There was nothing racist about what I said.

And, LOL at that Merkel bitch.

haha

oh I think I could quote a lot more statements

you hate Mexicans waving their own flag IN THEIR OWN BACKYARD on US territory? rly?

how is that not racist ?

and dude, the only indigeounous people there are Indians, your parents came on a boat

you're double fucked!

triple if you count your own racist statements

take care now ya here!

now, please don't fuck up this thread with your retarded comments or antics

where I am from, there's such a thing as respect for the deceased

apparently that doesn't fly in your trailerpark, but I'm sure your mom brought you up to be a good boy despite all your shortcomings

[Luke!]

This article I found on CNN points out the terrible irony of the occasion as others have stated in this thread. http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/04/1...tyn/index.html

However I found this statement funny. In 1940, Stalin ordered the assassination of Poland's military and political leaders in order to create a leadership vacuum so he could prop up a Communist puppet state in Warsaw. As it implies one of two things, Stalin got beat to the punch by Hitler(which I doubt based on the terrible state of the Soviet military in 1940 and 41), or the writer doesn't know what he is talking about.

oh no, they both succeeded

Stalin took out 20.000 sergeants to captains
+ shot intellectuals who were a "threat"

Hitler raeped us from the other side

still a miracle how Poland withstood over 64 days with nothing but horseback cavillary

Holland capitulated in 6 days while they had fuckin tanks!

[Dozyproductions]

Stalin got beat to the punch by Hitler

Not really. Russia invaded the other half of Poland, as was part his agreement with Hitler, soon after Germany invaded. The Poles didn't trust the Russians in the East but they figured it was better than what Hitler was offering to do. They later figured out the grass was never greener.

[E30Kaiser]

Not really. Russia invaded the other half of Poland, as was part his agreement with Hitler, soon after Germany invaded. The Poles didn't trust the Russians in the East but they figured it was better than what Hitler was offering to do. They later figured out the grass was never greener.

You guys are misunderstanding the point I am trying to make.... In 1940, Stalin ordered the assassination of Poland's military and political leaders in order to create a leadership vacuum so he could prop up a Communist puppet state in Warsaw.

Who had control of Warsaw in 1940? Germany did. So either the dude is saying Stalin planned to invade Germany(or at least German held Poland) and create a Communist puppet state in Poland after they were done, or he didn't understand that Germany controlled Warsaw and not the Soviets.

Is that more clear? I sometimes only post half of what I am thinking so it is sometimes taken the wrong way. The whole Stalin got beat to the punch comment is implying that Hitler struck first against the Soviets.

[Farbin Kaiber]

haha

oh I think I could quote a lot more statements

you hate Mexicans waving their own flag IN THEIR OWN BACKYARD on US territory? rly?

how is that not racist ?

and dude, the only indigeounous people there are Indians, your parents came on a boat

you're double fucked!

triple if you count your own racist statements

take care now ya here!

now, please don't fuck up this thread with your retarded comments or antics

where I am from, there's such a thing as respect for the deceased

apparently that doesn't fly in your trailerpark, but I'm sure your mom brought you up to be a good boy despite all your shortcomings

Show me where I said hate, show me when I made a racist statement. Where was it implied that I was retarded or lived in a trailerpark? You need to come with your A Game if you wanna fuck with me, n00b. I see you trying to put words in my mouth.

[Dozyproductions]

You guys are misunderstanding the point I am trying to make.... In 1940, Stalin ordered the assassination of Poland's military and political leaders in order to create a leadership vacuum so he could prop up a Communist puppet state in Warsaw.

Who had control of Warsaw in 1940? Germany did. So either the dude is saying Stalin planned to invade Germany(or at least German held Poland) and create a Communist puppet state in Poland after they were done, or he didn't understand that Germany controlled Warsaw and not the Soviets.

Is that more clear? I sometimes only post half of what I am thinking so it is sometimes taken the wrong way. The whole Stalin got beat to the punch comment is implying that Hitler struck first against the Soviets.

well germany had control of warsaw on the west bank of the vistula and the agreement was that the Russians would have the east bank. It was like that until after the uprising in 44'. Stalin was under the impression that that was going to be his new boundary for the USSR.

[E30Kaiser]

well germany had control of warsaw on the west bank of the vistula and the agreement was that the Russians would have the east bank. It was like that until after the uprising in 44'. Stalin was under the impression that that was going to be his new boundary for the USSR.

Ah, I wasn't sure exactly where the boundary of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact ran, I just knew Germany had Warsaw and the boundary was the Vistula, but I assumed they wouldn't cut Warsaw in half, obviously I am in error. Did the Russkies ever establish de facto control of their part of Warsaw or did 1941 come too quick?

[Dozyproductions]

bleh my bad I was confusing different events and I should of known better to spew my inaccuracies. The boundary I was speaking of earlier was in 44 after the german retreat. The ribbentrop boundary was where current belarus and ukraine are today. But at that time it was still a some what significant polish territory including Katyn. But the rest of what I said is what my grandfather (in the army at the time) described to me as what was happening.

So no I was in error. I just called my father about this and he is some what a historian on this matter. This is his website www.warsawuprising.com

[thornado327i]

For the Katyn part:

Stalin planned the execution of military officers for two main reasons:
1. He didn't want us to fight back (he knew trouble Germans had in the west part of Poland)
2. Hi did want to establish a puppet government later on.

And the division of Poland according to Ribbentrop-Molotov pact has nothing to do with it.

Here is why:

After the WWI Soviets' (Lenin's) original plan was to take the Red Army and go as far westward as possible bringing the people of wester countries "freedom from capitalist goverments and communist welfare". Poland stopped them in 1920 in the Battle of Warsaw (despite being greatly outnumbered) - this battle is known as "The miracle over Vistula" - whether this was a miracle or a strategic masterpiece is unknown (probably a bit of both).

But the Soviets' plan to go west hasn't changed for the WWII. Stalin didn't really care about the pact with Hitler (as didn't Hitler too). He planned to invade the fallen Poland, Germany and as much of Europe as possible in the late summer of 1941. Hitler surprised him with the attack just before that.

Stalin was surprised by the attack as he thought launching an invation on Russia (Soviet Union) in the same exact date as Napoleon did a century earlier is a suicide (which in fact was true). He though should Hitler attack it would happen in spring 1942 (to avoid russian winter).

The proof is that in the first days of German invasion, Wehrmacht captured a lot of equipment (tanks, cannons etc.) just waiting for a "go" order. The whole army was set to attack and was not in a position to defend.

Then of course things got worse for German forces. Winter killed them. Russians have a saying - "Russia could always count on it's two generals - general January and general February".

As for the Warsaw upprising - Stalin was waiting on the eastern bank of Vistula and held the attack so that both fighting sides in Warsaw would bleed out. Which happened. But even before that happened, in the eastern city of Lublin a government of Polish People's Republic was porclaimed. With all the main brains of the country gone in Katyn there was no one to oppose.

And history circled.

There.

[Dozyproductions]

For the Katyn part:

Stalin planned the execution of military officers for two main reasons:
1. He didn't want us to fight back (he knew trouble Germans had in the west part of Poland)
2. Hi did want to establish a puppet government later on.

And the division of Poland according to Ribbentrop-Molotov pact has nothing to do with it.

Here is why:

After the WWI Soviets' (Lenin's) original plan was to take the Red Army and go as far westward as possible bringing the people of wester countries "freedom from capitalist goverments and communist welfare". Poland stopped them in 1920 in the Battle of Warsaw (despite being greatly outnumbered) - this battle is known as "The miracle over Vistula" - whether this was a miracle or a strategic masterpiece is unknown (probably a bit of both).

But the Soviets' plan to go west hasn't changed for the WWII. Stalin didn't really care about the pact with Hitler (as didn't Hitler too). He planned to invade the fallen Poland, Germany and as much of Europe as possible in the late summer of 1941. Hitler surprised him with the attack just before that.

Stalin was surprised by the attack as he thought launching an invation on Russia (Soviet Union) in the same exact date as Napoleon did a century earlier is a suicide (which in fact was true). He though should Hitler attack it would happen in spring 1942 (to avoid russian winter).

The proof is that in the first days of German invasion, Wehrmacht captured a lot of equipment (tanks, cannons etc.) just waiting for a "go" order. The whole army was set to attack and was not in a position to defend.

Then of course things got worse for German forces. Winter killed them. Russians have a saying - "Russia could always count on it's two generals - general January and general February".

As for the Warsaw upprising - Stalin was waiting on the eastern bank of Vistula and held the attack so that both fighting sides in Warsaw would bleed out. Which happened. But even before that happened, in the eastern city of Lublin a government of Polish People's Republic was porclaimed. With all the main brains of the country gone in Katyn there was no one to oppose.

And history circled.

There.

I suggest you watch the BBC documentary about the uprising. British man did it but he has a polish wife. I think their sources are from 'inside men' involved with all the politics behind what was planed for poland. Let me try to find it for you. I know I have the DVD at my parents house. It explains all the treaties and pacts and explains the perspectives of stalin, churchil and roosevelt.