Why do American Cars Suck So Bad?

[Gary Horneck]

Some American cars suck... some just need modifications to be extremely entertaining.

[JasonC]

Interesting how there was a sudden upsurge in the quality of the American automobile after a site administrator posts in a thread on r3vlimited
.

So you calling them nutswingers? I can assure you that I'm not the voice of r3v, and everyone on here has their own voice, and can chose to post up what they think on a subject. Now I will toss in my two cents on things here and there. This subject is one of them. Plus,I see you're pretty new here. Now I haven't been on here as long as some, but can tell you one thing I have learned about people on here. This place has a very mixed demagogic in where people's car background is from. Some are pure euro, some pure Asian, some American, and some with a mix of all. I think that makes this place great as a car forum! Cause its not all liking the same thing ( yes we are all here cause we like the BMW e30) But if one looks further at others, they will see that others will like other things that wasn't made in a foreign country. But if you feel that people on here are sheep and I'm their shepherd. You are highly mistaken.

[FredK]

You know what pisses me off about American-market cars versus the world? Lack of turbo diesels. Especially in trucks. I want/need aDD truck that I will use to tow a chump car and can park it in the city when I need to. Give me a medium sized pickup with a turbo diesel, quad cab and can tow about 6-8000 pounds. I don't want a full-sized truck with a V8 or turbo 6. The Ford Ranger we no longer get here is a great vehicle that fits this bill. The Toyota Hilux is another. A medium sized TD pickup that gets 25+mpg around town would be tits.

I've posted about this exact phenomenon before. I call it Top Gear Syndrome, where for some reason, the forbidden fruit of a Toyota Hilux is all the sudden more desirable for some reason because we can't get it, and the Top Gear boys feel it's UNSTOPPABLE.

The HiLux TD 3.0 has 170hp and 252 lbs ft of torque, and a tow rating of 5500 lbs. With a steel trailer and a fairly lightweight Chump Car, you're going to get close to 5000 lbs with some wheels and tires and some tools. This is not something I'd want to drive for 5 hours to a track, in crosswinds, or up and down hills.

[Holland]

Never said that anything about an F30 being first and foremost a drivers car.
Actually, I'm completely with you. American auto companies are not the only culprits in the "extinction of the driver's car"

Try the new ATS, 2.0t or the 3.6. Still convinced it's not a 3 series killer?

For fear of talking about something I have absolutely no knowledge of, my original post was a expression of my dislike of the American cars that I have driven or had actual experience with. That excludes enough cars produced after ~2009 to prevent me from having an opinion I am willing to post on an online message board. So yes, I guess in that respect I am stuck in 2004.
But yes, I have seen and driven the new x1, among a few other European abominations. Ugh...

Exactly. American cars over the last 2 years or so have began to become quite good. Mind you there are technologies and designs from other branches around the world, but it's still the same company.

Sure, that's fair. But keep in mind that a portion of that gap in cost can be attributed to:
-subsidization/bail outs (bill is footed to taxpayers who often have no say in the matter)
-import tariff
-miscellaneous costs of doing business overseas

Wave your magic wand and make those things disappear, and you render these American car companies helpless and unable to compete. Like I said in my first post, go to Germany and try to find someone who drives a malibu.

Taxes and imports =/= a 30k price difference between a top 5 and malibu.

[z31maniac]

We get the Mustang, the Camaro, and other antiquated technology BS. America, fuck yeah.

Yep, and the stick axle Mustang that costs 1/2 of an M3 will still equal it around the track.

2015 Mustang's are supposed to be down on weight, up on power, and have IRS. M3s won't stand a chance on the track.

Are the interior's nicer and stuff like that? Yeah, but I'm not a woman, so I don't really care if dash is hard touch plastic or leather-wrapped. The feel of a part of the car I never touch is generally the most important thing to me when purchasing a vehicle.

[z31maniac]

Sure, that's fair. But keep in mind that a portion of that gap in cost can be attributed to:
-subsidization/bail outs (bill is footed to taxpayers who often have no say in the matter)

Ford received NO bailout money.

[Wschnitz]

I've posted about this exact phenomenon before. I call it Top Gear Syndrome, where for some reason, the forbidden fruit of a Toyota Hilux is all the sudden more desirable for some reason because we can't get it, and the Top Gear boys feel it's UNSTOPPABLE.

The HiLux TD 3.0 has 170hp and 252 lbs ft of torque, and a tow rating of 5500 lbs. With a steel trailer and a fairly lightweight Chump Car, you're going to get close to 5000 lbs with some wheels and tires and some tools. This is not something I'd want to drive for 5 hours to a track, in crosswinds, or up and down hills.

Get a swivel trailer hook, then when hilux flips car is ok you just need to flip the hilux back over hahahaha.

[FredK]

Unrelated: z31maniac has a butch-ass Miata.

Unrelated #2: z31maniac also has a new Mustang.

[z31maniac]

Follow-up question: Why does it seem that British Ford always has cooler stuff than US-market Ford?

Because Americans won't pay $45k for a bad boy Focus, etc.

[bonobo]

I should have been much more careful with my wording on the original post. Again, I'm not here to change anyone's opinion or start a ten page rant about why whatever car sucks. I had an opinion that was based off of what I have personally experienced and albeit it being a strong one, I was interested to see what other people's opinions were, in agreement with me or not.

So you calling them nutswingers? I can assure you that I'm not the voice of r3v, and everyone on here has their own voice, and can chose to post up what they think on a subject. Now I will toss in my two cents on things here and there. This subject is one of them. Plus,I see you're pretty new here. Now I haven't been on here as long as some, but can tell you one thing I have learned about people on here. This place has a very mixed demagogic in where people's car background is from. Some are pure euro, some pure Asian, some American, and some with a mix of all. I think that makes this place great as a car forum! Cause its not all liking the same thing ( yes we are all here cause we like the BMW e30) But if one looks further at others, they will see that others will like other things that wasn't made in a foreign country. But if you feel that people on here are sheep and I'm their shepherd. You are highly mistaken.

I'm not calling them anything. Having the same opinion as you or liking a different automobile than me makes them no less of a person. Even if they were "nutswingers," I don't see any point in name-calling on an online message board. Like you said, diversity is a great trait in a car forum. I simply noticed a shift and I thought I would point it out. Any readers may interpret that as they wish. I know I interpreted it a certain way, but you're right, I could easily be mistaken.
Anyways, I was glad to get your two cents, and meant that in the least sarcastic way possible.

Try the new ATS, 2.0t or the 3.6. Still convinced it's not a 3 series killer?



Exactly. American cars over the last 2 years or so have began to become quite good. Mind you there are technologies and designs from other branches around the world, but it's still the same company.



Taxes and imports =/= a 30k price difference between a top 5 and malibu.

Glad we could somewhat come to an agreement. But no, I never said that taxes and imports were the sole reason for the $30k gap we see between entry level American cars and European cars. I realize that my wording may have made it seem that way. I just thought that it would be important to note that those are costs that European car companies see that their American counterparts don't necessarily have to deal with.

Again, my original post was an opinion based off of the cars I have driven. I have seen enough of some of them to begin to form an opinion. But in no way is my opinion all encompassing or even correct at all. That's why I was careful to state that it was my opinion. Obviously, not every single American automobile out there is cheaply made or badly engineered, just as not every single European automobile has to be finicky and high maintenance.

[Xat1cZ]

lol mustang.


edit: Ford Europe and USA are like two completely different car companies imo anyways...


edit: edit altho out of the new lines off trucks I think Ford got the best line-up with the Raptor, that's alot of fun, I have yet to drive a newer Chevy truck tho'.

[bonobo]

Yep, and the stick axle Mustang that costs 1/2 of an M3 will still equal it around the track.

2015 Mustang's are supposed to be down on weight, up on power, and have IRS. M3s won't stand a chance on the track.

Are the interior's nicer and stuff like that? Yeah, but I'm not a woman, so I don't really care if dash is hard touch plastic or leather-wrapped. The feel of a part of the car I never touch is generally the most important thing to me when purchasing a vehicle.

Sure, but people look for things in cars besides their track performance. That's why you don't see LSx swapped, gutted out track rats going for tens of thousands of dollars.
Some of the biggest things I look for are overall build quality, solid engineering, and fit and finish. If that makes me a woman in an overweight, underpowered slug, then so be it.

[kung fu jesus]

Yep, and the stick axle Mustang that costs 1/2 of an M3 will still equal it around the track.
.

The new Mustang on the track is pretty mediocre. IRS would help. A LOT.

[tspangle88]

The new Mustang on the track is pretty mediocre. IRS would help. A LOT.

I think it gets by pretty well. There are a couple of them that are faster than any BMW around VIR: http://www.caranddriver.com/features...o-2013-page-10

Every suspension design has it's pros and cons. Every automaker has it's strengths and weaknesses. Making broad-brush statements about any of them is just silly.

[z31maniac]

Sure, but people look for things in cars besides their track performance. That's why you don't see LSx swapped, gutted out track rats going for tens of thousands of dollars.
Some of the biggest things I look for are overall build quality, solid engineering, and fit and finish. If that makes me a woman in an overweight, underpowered slug, then so be it.

At least you admit it.

The new Mustang on the track is pretty mediocre. IRS would help. A LOT.

Sure, they are planning on it for the next generation. But the current one is still a BEAST on track.