is this a groundhog??

[Mr. Burns]

this is where I grew up.
suppose this can't really be considered a bustling metropolis now can it?





the deers are running scared because we decided to open fire with a semi-automatic...yahno...to show who's boss...

[mrsleeve]

irrelevant.

I simply implore a little trick I learned while growing up. It's helped me throughout my years, thus offering me a great sense of wisdom.

this trick, is called common sense.

not every answer to societies littlest issues has to be remedied with guns/firepower. Believe it or not, there are other effective ways.

Your condescension about how farmers, ranchers, and rural people deal with destructive pests on their property when in close proximity to live stock or structural assets is laughable. You growing up in a country subdivision where you have a few deer in the yard is one thing, but my city guy comment is more based on your diatribe about how people deal with such pests, and similar previous discussions not form your actual up bringing, since you seem to hold a view point more consistent with someone of that proclivity. Form the looks of the proximity of your neighbors you would have a hard time using a bb gun to sting any kind of pest into running away without hitting one of their houses, let alone a powder driven projectile .

Have you ever seen a horse after it breaks its leg from stepping into wood chuck or ground squirrel hole ??? Or how about a cow??? I have its not a good sight to witness, and when you have to put down a 8500 dollar show horse (my bosses wifes show pony at the farm I worked at a about 15) it leaves a bit of a sting in the wallet, I would rather use 85 cent 22 hornet rounds by the box full on wood chucks than a 50 cent 45 on a 8500 dollar horse after the 350 dollar vet bill then have to dig a hole and all the trouble that comes with it. They are also destructive to crops and the holes can be very hard on equipment

[Mr. Burns]

replied, but honestly what's the use.

:roll:

i'm not out to change anybody, but perhaps to charge in some perspective behavioral changes instead.

I can empathize and actually relate with your argument having worked for many years on a dairy farm growing up, but in todays day and age...there are far superior solutions to a spray of bullets to resolve issues, even when it comes to livestock loss/injury.

let's just agree to disagree

[JinormusJ]

Thread just got P&R'd

[mrsleeve]

replied, but honestly what's the use.

:roll:

i'm not out to change anybody, but perhaps to charge in some perspective behavioral changes instead.

I can empathize and actually relate with your argument having worked for many years on a dairy farm growing up, but in todays day and age...there are far superior solutions to a spray of bullets to resolve issues, even when it comes to livestock loss/injury.

let's just agree to disagree

I can agree to that, but really if your any good at all, you should only need one maybe 2, you should not be "spraying" bullets around ;)

[Farbin Kaiber]

I've got a wicked coyote issue in my rural neighborhood this season, the wrongly re-introduced wolf packs are pushing a lot of creatures out of the hills and down into the valley. People are complaining about the ID/WY/MT wolf tags thing, but they are in their condos, not losing entire herds of livestock.

I told my Mom, who works at an animal rescue/sanctuary, and she asked about what type of humane traps and release methods are being used for the coyotes. I told her I wasn't sure, but I really am sure. I really hope the Mountain West can get this stupid wolf thing under control before I lose anymore livestock, it's tough walking out and seeing baby goats you bottlefed and didn't sleep in order to make sure they lived ripped to shreds and strewn across the front 20.

[mrsleeve]

^

I know what you mean, we have been having a lot more frequent yote activity down further into the valley the last few years. There is always some, but there has been more and larger packs than traditional levels. In my area its not just because of the growing wolf population its the out of control lion population that the fish and game refuses to acknowledge or do anything about, and the competition for food in the lean months . In most places yote are consider pest's and can be eradicated as you see fit, they breed like fucking rabbits

I dont think the wolf reintroduction was wrong, they are important to healthy forest/eccosystem, in their traditional ranges especially in the western states and Rockies. Letting the populations get out of hand is the issue though, and this is why we have a wolf season in our respective states, along with MN had a limited 3 day hunt this last winter as well I think.

[Farbin Kaiber]

^

I know what you mean, we have been having a lot more frequent yote activity down further into the valley the last few years. There is always some, but there has been more and larger packs than traditional levels. In my area its not just because of the growing wolf population its the out of control lion population that the fish and game refuses to acknowledge or do anything about, and the competition for food in the lean months . In most places yote are consider pest's and can be eradicated as you see fit, they breed like fucking rabbits

I dont think the wolf reintroduction was wrong, they are important to healthy forest/eccosystem, in their traditional ranges especially in the western states and Rockies. Letting the populations get out of hand is the issue though, and this is why we have a wolf season in our respective states, along with MN had a limited 3 day hunt this last winter as well I think.

You feel the introduction of a non native species (Mackenzie Valley wolf as opposed to the native Northern Rocky Mountains Wolf) of which the regional prey animals were not accustomed to was a good idea?

I agree though that regardless of the further actions of humans after the fact to allow the size of packs and numbers of wolves to be the root problem being faced now. The attitudes of not hunting the hunter so to speak has been what now needs to be overcome.

[mrsleeve]

I think in this sense a grey wolf is a grey wolf, they are highly adaptable and will fill the role of "wolf" in the ecosystem sufficiently. Afaik in our area we got the northern rockies wolves form the hat, both transplanted and natural re-population. You have to remember the regional prey had not had to deal with wolves for nearly a 1/2 century or better as well

[Mr. Burns]

Is there a law that prevents anyone from pumping bullets into wolves or coyotes? Or does it vary from state to state/district to district?

[mrsleeve]

In general it depends on your state law.

That said Wolves are a protected species in most states WY, MT, ID, and MN have limited hunting seasons that the animal activist have been trying to hold up in court, though most of these people have never set a foot in the places in which they are trying to stop management practices. In those states the wolves are back to a healthy population (in localized areas where the the tags are issued for) and a limited harvest is needed to keep the population at a healthy level. For decades the wolf has been a 100% protected species you engendered list, if you had them tearing your shit up yo uhad to call fish and game and have them deal with it, normally not very effectively either.

In most states (the western ones especially) Coyotes are considered a nuisance and can be eradicated as you see fit, as there are way too many of them in lots of places. Again see your local laws, and some states you can only take them during a hunting season.

Dont think because you have a gun that can shoot 800yd that killing a wolf or even a yote is some easy task. trust me its not they are both very smart and cunning pack predators. Cyotes are not that scary, but wolves is a whole differant deal, you ever find your self face to face with a wolf, its not the one you see that you need to be scared of is the 1-4 that you dont see. In a lot of cases if you see one fairly close its because he wants you to see him, and you might want to check your 6

[Pac1373]

We have an even more irritating pest in our Yotes' here, they are actually a Coyote/Wolf Hybrid, they call them "Eastern Coyote" they obviously hunt in packs, but are nearly twice the size of the western Yote I was always used to in Alberta.
they actually killed a lady hiking in Nova Scotia a year or two back.

7.62x39 is my personal remedy if needed, so far so good though. I see more Red Fox around here, but hear the coyotes on the regular

My primary anti pest plan is my 10 week old Great Pyrenees pooch, she ought to keep most everything out of the barns...and yard...and driveway...and field lol.

I would be pissed if something ate one of my baby goats...

[Farbin Kaiber]

We have an even more irritating pest in our Yotes' here, they are actually a Coyote/Wolf Hybrid, they call them "Eastern Coyote" they obviously hunt in packs, but are nearly twice the size of the western Yote I was always used to in Alberta.
they actually killed a lady hiking in Nova Scotia a year or two back.

7.62x39 is my personal remedy if needed, so far so good though. I see more Red Fox around here, but hear the coyotes on the regular

My primary anti pest plan is my 10 week old Great Pyrenees pooch, she ought to keep most everything out of the barns...and yard...and driveway...and field lol.

I would be pissed if something ate one of my baby goats...

Yes, we have two Pyrs.



They do a great job of keeping them from coming too close to the property.

[Pac1373]

Awesome dogs Farbin, we have only had our girl for 1 week now. She is pretty amazing. So far we have been livestock lucky, but as we add more the LGD makes sense.
Will get some pics up soon.