American Exceptionalism

[Delphinitive]

it surprises me that more people don't specify our country as the United States of America.
"America" and "American" are technically very diverse terms. terms that encompass much more than just our states and their residents.

not that everyone participating in this thread can't make the inference that we're speaking about the United States of course. i just felt the need to chime in here. it's something that i notice a lot

[Borat]

Did I say that? No. However, because I believe in this country, take pride in this country, and understand what makes this country great, I can easily assume that most people in the world would want to live in the USA. Simple as that.

bahahahahahaha.

are you really that one-eyed or just winding us non americans up?

Friends of mine went to the states on a holiday and had people ask where they were from, friends replied "New Zealand", and were then asked "oh, what state is that in?" :violent

how can you say that when a number of your population don't even know about the existance of other countries?

[NC325iC]

the only way to show other countries how much they need us (and yes we need them in return) is to cut them off

america should go into anti social mode for a couple of years just to show everyone what it would be like without america. put crazy tarriffs on foreign goods and go into self sustaining mode. I think it would be a wake up call to the world.

edit: yeah we have some dumb people, so do you

[etxxz]

i'm not going to read the whole discussion but i can say that US is THE most generous country in this planet. people here are mostly exposed to what is reported in the (really bias) media: the war, the tsunami etc. There is so much more, most of their charitable work, donations, helping other countries, troops all over the world helping out (colombia/FARC) etc etc etc. I thank it i thank you.

BUT

I am going to correct everyone on their believes of "FREEDOM"... as a resident i feel very limited and regulated in all aspects of my life here.. security and peace of mind is another thing... freedom and "free society" is experienced in many different ways and just about every country out there has as much if not more freedom so i don't understand why most americans say "we fight for liberty/freedom the works". keep this in mind a ton of countries have better living standards than USA.

edit:

the only way to show other countries how much they need us (and yes we need them in return) is to cut them off



america should go into anti social mode for a couple of years just to show everyone what it would be like without america. put crazy tarriffs on foreign goods and go into self sustaining mode. I think it would be a wake up call to the world.



edit: yeah we have some dumb people, so do you

and you are the kind of ignorant ... that thinks that USA so great that you don't need the rest of the world...hehe look around you right now, your computer/desk. what % of things are made here in usa...i mean not just the manufacturing, but material. your car, what do you think it runs on? your food. who do you think picks it and allows it to be so (relatively speaking) cheap? i see usa as a big customer service center seriously. be careful in this kind of thinking, what if the rest of the world cuts YOU off?

[trashcop 80s 80s]

.

[nando]

america should go into anti social mode for a couple of years just to show everyone what it would be like without america. put crazy tarriffs on foreign goods and go into self sustaining mode. I think it would be a wake up call to the world.

I think it would mean instant death to our economy.

[Maluco]

it surprises me that more people don't specify our country as the United States of America.
"America" and "American" are technically very diverse terms. terms that encompass much more than just our states and their residents.

BTW the name America was first attributed to my continent, South Amercia, by a map maker via a Amerigo Vespucci's supposed stop on South America's eastern coast... But of course there is alot of controversy surrounding all that.

[project86]

country has become more liberal, and it's gone further into the shitter. This is NOT the point of this thread.

No one answers the question as to why it's not OK to say you love your country, root for it against others, and generally have pride in it regardless of it's faults.

There are a lot of POS e30's on this board that people LOVE more than any other car on the road. It's not perfecet, but they love it and will defend it. It's part of them. But if someone says they love American, their a closed minded arrogant hick.

Country has become more liberal and now our eyes are open to the atrocities that we have committed and the general disdain that other places and even people have for the establishment and the power that we wield over not only the citizens of other countries but the citizens of our own who are deemed to be of a lesser class. There is nothing more American or more true to our countries roots then to question authority and to strive for absolute perfection. I am not saying its wrong to love your country but obviously the modern connotation is much more loaded then a simple expression of gratitude as you have proven by your posts in this thread stating that the establishment is simply the best and the status quo is the way to go. I have a problem with anyone thinking that the 1950's or 1960's are heroic times in which the most good and the least bad existed and that the left wing radicals ruined our perfect little bubble. There are many social problems that are still lingering today from the bubble of the 50's, inequality for one, social pressure to attain radical conservative ideals (stepford wife, the pull of the subburbs), teenage angst as depicted in movies such as Rebel Without a Cause. What we have now is the same only different, and the difference is that our eyes are more open because our world is more connected, so elitist and egocentric views are no longer good foreign policy for countries and individuals.

[project86]

Thanks for another personal attack. Typical liberals.

Don't wear you're beliefs on your sleeve in the middle of the firing range if you don't want to be attacked. You are the one martyring yourself fighting for the conservative right, no one asked you to do that, you volunteered to argue passionately and then call foul at the first sign of disagreement. It would be courteous of you to not take everything in such a defensive manner so that maybe this discussion did not have to resort to who has the bigger gun, figuratively. Thats how closed minded people settle debates, thats not fun.

[smonkbmw]

america should go into anti social mode for a couple of years just to show everyone what it would be like without america. put crazy tarriffs on foreign goods and go into self sustaining mode. I think it would be a wake up call to the world.

i kind of like this idea. +1

...hehe look around you right now, your computer/desk. what % of things are made here in usa...i mean not just the manufacturing, but material. your car, what do you think it runs on? your food. who do you think picks it and allows it to be so (relatively speaking) cheap? i see usa as a big customer service center seriously. be careful in this kind of thinking, what if the rest of the world cuts YOU off?

you shop at walmart i bet. i think if the US produced more of its own goods it would be better for the economy via more jobs being taken back/created here as opposed to overseas. let the world cut the US off, we have more than enough technology and a unemployed work force to produce our own goods and survive. let the world cut us off, its time we put money back into our OWN economy and not some other countries.

on topic: Ted do you think that maybe a change of scenery/cities might expose yourself to other points of views besides eugene's? i understand you travel a bit, have you noticed the same attitudes everywhere? or just in town down there? are you generalizing the views of general media i.e. magazines, TV? Im curious as to where these opinions, comments come from that you gather this view on.

[z31maniac]

I totally agree with everything you've said, Ted. But I did want to touch on this.

I've always said you should never be "proud" to be an American. You should be happy, and feel lucky and fortunate that you are an American. If you were born in this country, you were born here by nothing more than a stroke of cosmic chance. Yes, your parents live here and that's why you were born here, but that's part of it. Pride does nothing more than create arrogance (not saying you are) and bigger problems, and you can't take pride in something that you more or less "happened" into.

Do I love this country? Yes. Does my government piss me off on a daily basis? Oh yes. But I thank my lucky stars every day that I was fortunate enough to win a cosmic lottery, if you will, and be born in this country.

Ahh yes. A George Carlin fan.

[etxxz]

^^ indeed jaja

i kind of like this idea. +1



you shop at walmart i bet. i think if the US produced more of its own goods it would be better for the economy via more jobs being taken back/created here as opposed to overseas. let the world cut the US off, we have more than enough technology and a unemployed work force to produce our own goods and survive. let the world cut us off, its time we put money back into our OWN economy and not some other countries.

on topic: Ted do you think that maybe a change of scenery/cities might expose yourself to other points of views besides eugene's? i understand you travel a bit, have you noticed the same attitudes everywhere? or just in town down there? are you generalizing the views of general media i.e. magazines, TV? Im curious as to where these opinions, comments come from that you gather this view on.

i don't do walmart. i'm rich (lol j/k)...i don't shop in general :-|
but believe it or not, gov has been trying to make this happen for the longest time. invest in ourselves but there are so many godam business people that go offshore to "make" (more like move) the quick buck....they too have to feed their families so like i said. this country is like a ginormous service/trade center. india and china are growing so much from supplying the rest of the world that even a recent raise in the standard of living (more consumption) has created a food scarcity problem

i'm an engineer not an economics person so i don't have the solution...atleast i recognize the problem.

i think we went offtopic this is no longer a usa tribute thread but i'm glad there arent so many people on here that make comments like "cut them off" etc... + how could any us say that, we'll probably own e30's for the rest of our lives!!

[NC325iC]

jeez it appears hypothetical itll never happen scenarios are taken as serious suggestions now

and you are the kind of ignorant ... that thinks that USA so great that you don't need the rest of the world...

look at the very first line in my post, its says in parentheses (yes i know we need them too) im not an idiot please do not call me one

all i was saying is that you dont know what you have until its gone, and if the us cut the world off (and by this i only mean that we raise our prices ridiculously high for exports, and place high tarriffs on all imports) and pull all of our troops abroad back home, we would be able to focus more on ourselves and leave all the america hating bastards to there own devices. we could crack down on illegal immigration with all of our military forces back in the country. people that want to give to charity can donate their money to the many homeless we have right here in our own country. and i dont think it would kill our economy i believe smokn has it right we might have to do without some things (oil) but for the most part i think many of the goods made in foreign countries are made there just because of the cheap labor. i also believe that doing this would bring back the small businesses as there prices would be competitive with the highly tarriffed walmarts of the country. as far as fuel goes (as this is a car forum) biodiesel can be had, waste vegetable oil. i dont know the condition of the alaskan oil but thats america too. then theres hydrogen which in my eyes is the best of all the new fuel sources as it surely will be able to be adapted into existing internal combustion engines. and if you absolutely need something from another country you can get it, itll just cost you alot more. and i know this will never happen but its something to think about isnt it.

[etxxz]

its cool i wouln't have called you anything. but this country runs on oil. how do you pretend we to "do" w/o it? illegal immigration should be the least of your worries; some its actually good for you. cheap labor. would you be able to survive on $50/day? what about $5/day?

as for the hydrogen comment, it might be the only thing i agree with you on. I actually work for a fuel cells company and we are mostly about hydrogen generation and fuel cell systems integration. Look us up ~ Ener1 (Enerfuel is where i am) the feasability of this technology on large scale will be very difficult as there is no (really small) infrastructure for a hydrogen economy. In the years to come you will see more and more hybrids, plug in FC/battery hybrids and eventually purely plug-in batteries running off nuclear power plants who knows....we might be entering the f.c./battery hybrid stage.

honda has already begun. when will GM/FORD/D.Chrysler? do you see what i mean? breaking ties with the rest of the world is nearly impossible.... and "nearly" just because maybe 150years from know everything will be a different story....nobody will have oil....maybe venezuela and some eastern countries...we have the largest oil reserve in the world even though "official" numbers suggest otherwise (we are actually north of 300billion barrels)


...i can't tell you.

and that is if lack of energy, food, water and wars dont kill us first but now i'm just talking theoretically-/out of my ass.

[MattE30]

all i was saying is that you dont know what you have until its gone, and if the us cut the world off (and by this i only mean that we raise our prices ridiculously high for exports, and place high tarriffs on all imports)

The WTO trade regime is set up to specifically bar this. We put a tariff on steel imports in the early 2000s to help ailing U.S. Steel producers, and dropped it at the end of the "grace period" specified by the WTO.

Placing tariffs does nothing except inhibit a globalized, free-market economy for all actors.