Econmics

[kylebes1]

To the original poster:

The scenario is somewhat warped. If the first four had been shining the shoes of the highest 2 then we could more easily understand how they were allowed to drink without paying.

Those at the top provide for those at the bottom. There is no doubt about that, and it has worked for thousands of years.

The guys in the middle can handle life on their own, but are still helped some what by the guys above them.

That is the idea of economics, which can easily exist on its own. The government and socialism are something separate.... should I go into that?

[Aptyp]

I'm not talking about that stupid scenario.

Stupid scenario is the current reality.

[Ral]

You do realize Saddam worked very hard to make the international community think he had weapons, right? We should have had better information, and there were failures at every level of government, including President Bush (I am not exonerating him). But it was a much more ambiguous situation when the decision was made than it is now. (And we should have been more clear and followed the advice of the international community, so don't think I'm saying I think it was a good idea at the time.)

and trashcop, you are right on. +1.

[trashcop 80s 80s]

You want to know what the problem with Social Security is?

The problem with social security is that it is a pay as you go system. The money you are putting in today is not the money that you will receive at retirement. It is being spent today on receipients. Your money is not being invested, your money is not growing, it is not doing anything for you like it would in a 401k or IRA. The only way to maintain the SS system is to increase taxes in the future, and it will never stop. It will destroy itself as it is now.

Also, the whole Social Security surplus trust fund is not really a trust fund. There is no surplus SS funds. Any and all funds that are put into SS today are being spent TODAY, ALL OF IT. The surplus that the government does not use on SS, they write the trust fund a Treasury bond. A treasury bond is just MORE guaranteed government debt. They then take the money and spend it on other things.

When SS can not pay for everything in the future, it will start cashing those Treasury bonds. The govt will pay for those treasury bonds with new tax money because the old money has already been spent. A SS tax surplus today is nothing more than a GUARANTEE that you will be taxed again in the future for the same money that has already been payed. You will pay for SS now, and and be taxed again in the future to cover the money you've already payed. It is an idiotic time bomb, and it will destroy itself if we do not destroy it.

The best idea would be to get rid of SS entirely, because it was originally designed to be a short term program.

Where are you getting this information from? Social Security was designed to be permanent. I pay into it now so that when I turn 65 I can begin getting it back. By your logic, at some point when it ended, a lot of people younger than 65 would have been royally fucked.

You want to know what the problem with Social Security is? It is the fact that our President decided it would be a good idea to use that money towards a fucking war. He used mine and your retirement money to pay for a war which he blatantly lied about. You call yourselves conservative yet it is the Republicans that spend all the money and drive the deficit sky high and drastically increase debt.

[Turf1600]

the 4 bums would have to be sober and possibly get jobs to pay for beers.

I'm not talking about that stupid scenario.

[Aptyp]

the 4 bums would have to be sober and possibly get jobs to pay for beers.

[Turf1600]

I feel like I pay a ton in taxes. At least 1/3 of my paycheck goes away every period - though some of it goes to insurance.

What's the problem with a flat tax?

[Money$hit]

Thrift Savings Plan- it gets taken out of your pay pre-tax, and thus could possibly put you back into a lower tax bracket. It's also been one of the top-performing plans for a while. (I don't have any data to back it up though.)

I want to see my paycheck now, not 8000000 yrs down the road. Im setting up a 401k with my fulltime employer.

[Money$hit]

yeah! let's vote democrat, then they can finally take away our 401k retirement plans, and force us to pay another 5% into social security! cause we've all seen how well the social security system is working so far! I hope all the obama supporters like living in poverty when they retire! :p

No kidding. I think everyone should admire Bush for actually trying to pass a bill to reform SS. I think it was one of the best ideas to come from the current administration. Too bad congress couldnt get it passed, because setting up individual retirement accounts would have been the good.

The best idea would be to get rid of SS entirely, because it was originally designed to be a short term program.

[z31maniac]

yeah! let's vote democrat, then they can finally take away our 401k retirement plans, and force us to pay another 5% into social security! cause we've all seen how well the social security system is working so far! I hope all the obama supporters like living in poverty when they retire! :p

Oh come on. The CHANGE is coming nevermind that Medicare Medicaid and Social Security are expected to = total Fed spending within two decades and already = 40%

I'll just keep saying change and it will happen.

[nando]

^Until Obama does away with pre-tax contributions.....

yeah! let's vote democrat, then they can finally take away our 401k retirement plans, and force us to pay another 5% into social security! cause we've all seen how well the social security system is working so far! I hope all the obama supporters like living in poverty when they retire! :p

[z31maniac]

^Until Obama does away with pre-tax contributions.....

[Ral]

You know whats funny?

About two years ago, I increased my rank in the military, and actually now my net pay is less than what I brought home at my lower rank. Its all because Im in a new tax bracket.

What kind of fucked up shit is our tax code? Is it sad that I actually want to take a demotion so I can just make the same money I was making before?

Thrift Savings Plan- it gets taken out of your pay pre-tax, and thus could possibly put you back into a lower tax bracket. It's also been one of the top-performing plans for a while. (I don't have any data to back it up though.)

[Aptyp]

Well, I am not a fan of any tax code. When it comes to government spending, EVERY tax paying American is a conservative. Problem is, being conservative doesn't mean being a republican. Being liberal doesn't mean being a democrat.

How hard is it? Really screwed up system. I think state and local governments can handle their own needs.


All tax codes are doomed to fail as there will be a group of people that will feel neglected. I'm shocked 10th guy waited to be beat up, until he stopped drinking with losers.