Military

you so full of shit your eyes are brown
did you ever pay attention in school?
what a dumbass

false 50yr propaganda. how about 50yrs of history, or doesn't that count in your opinion

Funny because I have taken multiple university courses on socialism and have written many papers on various subjects within the realm of socialism. These include a Karl Marx biography, a paper focusing on Historical Materialism and a paper contrasting Libertarian Socialism with Authoritarian Socialism. What are your credentials?

[gwb72tii]

I have told you this before and I will say it again, your idea of communism is false. Communism is an egalitarian society. Egalitarianism is good. Communism is good. Your idea of communism is based on false, 50 year old, fear mongering, cold war propaganda.

you so full of shit your eyes are brown
did you ever pay attention in school?
what a dumbass

false 50yr propaganda. how about 50yrs of history, or doesn't that count in your opinion

yes, lets see holmes, communism is good
tell that to the 30,000,000 chinese killed by communists (yes, yhat number is correct)
the ignorance of youth

I have told you this before and I will say it again, your idea of communism is false. Communism is an egalitarian society. Your idea of communism is based on false, 50 year old, fear mongering, cold war propaganda. Try reading some Marx or Bakunin instead of O'Reilly and Hannity.

[LINUS]

1st 10 words pretty much set the tone, what more do you need me to say?

You're right - we don't agree.

[gwb72tii]

It is a fallacy to say that communism is bad unless you think that egalitarianism and freedom from authority are wrong. That is true communism. Considering most of America endorses these principles, you simply cannot argue that communism justified our entrance into Korea and Vietnam. It sure as hell threatened all the rich capitalists though and their so called way of life. But you don't belong to that group. You might know them as the ones who make all the "important" decisions but don't actually sacrifice anything themselves.

When I think of why we fought the Revolutionary War, the Civil War and World War II, the first thing that comes to mind is civil rights. Each of these wars was fought against an entity which was restricting the rights and freedoms of human beings and threatening their very way of life. That is what makes violent conflict justified. War is not justified however when it means making money, acquiring land or possessions, gaining power and influence. Every war since World War II and the majority of wars before then were fought for these selfish purposes.

Also, you can't make the argument that your friends died for people to weak to protect themselves. First, you're implying that anyone that isn't in the war is weak. Second, did you ever stop to think that some people never asked for protection? I never asked for protection from Saddam but I was fooled into thinking I needed it. If he came knockin at my door I would defend myself. You really shouldn't feel all high and mighty walking down the street telling yourself that all the "weak" people around you need you, because they sure as hell don't.

yes, lets see holmes, communism is good
tell that to the 30,000,000 chinese killed by communists (yes, yhat number is correct)
the ignorance of youth

Holmes -

You should print your post, plant it with some soil & a MJ seedling, and grow that into the biggest plant EVAR - because it's full of "nutrients"

From the 1st sentence on, that's the biggest pile I've ever seen you post.

Why? Because you don't agree with it? I have read that post a few times now and it is valid and sound. The OP's posts however, are full of holes.

[LINUS]

It is a fallacy to say that communism is bad unless you think that egalitarianism and freedom from authority are wrong. That is true communism. Considering most of America endorses these principles, you simply cannot argue that communism justified our entrance into Korea and Vietnam. It sure as hell threatened all the rich capitalists though and their so called way of life. But you don't belong to that group. You might know them as the ones who make all the "important" decisions but don't actually sacrifice anything themselves.

When I think of why we fought the Revolutionary War, the Civil War and World War II, the first thing that comes to mind is civil rights. Each of these wars was fought against an entity which was restricting the rights and freedoms of human beings and threatening their very way of life. That is what makes violent conflict justified. War is not justified however when it means making money, acquiring land or possessions, gaining power and influence. Every war since World War II and the majority of wars before then were fought for these selfish purposes.

Also, you can't make the argument that your friends died for people to weak to protect themselves. First, you're implying that anyone that isn't in the war is weak. Second, did you ever stop to think that some people never asked for protection? I never asked for protection from Saddam but I was fooled into thinking I needed it. If he came knockin at my door I would defend myself. You really shouldn't feel all high and mighty walking down the street telling yourself that all the "weak" people around you need you, because they sure as hell don't.

Holmes -

You should print your post, plant it with some soil & a MJ seedling, and grow that into the biggest plant EVAR - because it's full of "nutrients"

From the 1st sentence on, that's the biggest pile I've ever seen you post.

Not WWII, only Japan threatened us. Korea was because of communism and we still have bases their. Vietnam, hmm Communism. Is that the only reason we have wars? Political reasons? Ummm, the Revolutionary war, Politics. Civil war, Politics. WW2, Politics. The root of all of them is politics.

I never used those wars as justification of me being "more" free (did not know there was such a term) I used it as the lives lost/years fought.

It is a fallacy to say that communism is bad unless you think that egalitarianism and freedom from authority are wrong. That is true communism. Considering most of America endorses these principles, you simply cannot argue that communism justified our entrance into Korea and Vietnam. It sure as hell threatened all the rich capitalists though and their so called way of life. But you don't belong to that group. You might know them as the ones who make all the "important" decisions but don't actually sacrifice anything themselves.

When I think of why we fought the Revolutionary War, the Civil War and World War II, the first thing that comes to mind is civil rights. Each of these wars was fought against an entity which was restricting the rights and freedoms of human beings and threatening their very way of life. That is what makes violent conflict justified. War is not justified however when it means making money, acquiring land or possessions, gaining power and influence. Every war since World War II and the majority of wars before then were fought for these selfish purposes.

Also, you can't make the argument that your friends died for people to weak to protect themselves. First, you're implying that anyone that isn't in the war is weak. Second, did you ever stop to think that some people never asked for protection? I never asked for protection from Saddam but I was fooled into thinking I needed it. If he came knockin at my door I would defend myself. You really shouldn't feel all high and mighty walking down the street telling yourself that all the "weak" people around you need you, because they sure as hell don't.

[Edev]

That is one POWERFUL statement...


Thanks again for everything you and your brothers have done and sacrificed for us...

can i get an Amen?! i totally agree. i thank all whom have, or are currently serving. My older brothers are both in the military. Mike is in the USMC, and has been since '05. David is in the USAF and has been since '06. love em both. major respect to those who are and who have served.

[atomic]

My friends dieing for a lie? None of my friends ever died for a lie. They died protecting people too weak to protect themselves. They died for the right cause. The died because they knew that one day, they just might have to give their life. Do I feel sorry for their families? Yes I do. But more than that, I wish I could take their place.

That is one POWERFUL statement...


Thanks again for everything you and your brothers have done and sacrificed for us...

[BigWaveDave]

This is the biggest misconception of all. The Korean government wasn't threatening your life, Vietnam wasn't affecting your life, Saddam wasn't threatening your life. They were political wars, fought for power and money in the hands of an elite few men and they had nothing to do with your freedoms. Stop fooling yourself into thinking that you are somehow more free because of the sacrifices soldiers made in Vietnam. It's bullshit.

There have only been a few wars that were actually fought for worthy causes. The Revolutionary War, The Civil War and most of all, World War II.

Not WWII, only Japan threatened us. Korea was because of communism and we still have bases their. Vietnam, hmm Communism. Is that the only reason we have wars? Political reasons? Ummm, the Revolutionary war, Politics. Civil war, Politics. WW2, Politics. The root of all of them is politics.

I never used those wars as justification of me being "more" free (did not know there was such a term) I used it as the lives lost/years fought.

[BigWaveDave]

Now my question to you is. How do you feel about being lied to by your commander in chief? How do you feel about your friends dieing for this lie?

What lie did he say directly to me? I was told to go somewhere and carry out a mission. I am not at liberty to make those calls on what we might accomplish. They see the bigger picture than I. Also, I know what is said on the news, I also know what reports I receive and missions I carry out, and you know whats funny. The news most of the time, seems to have things 180 out from what I have read. Also, if you talk to most people who work in intel/comm/fore front/outside the wire type people, the vast majority will have agreed with the big man in white house. Just because CNN/Fox/AP/whoever says it, does not make it gospel.

My friends dieing for a lie? None of my friends ever died for a lie. They died protecting people too weak to protect themselves. They died for the right cause. The died because they knew that one day, they just might have to give their life. Do I feel sorry for their families? Yes I do. But more than that, I wish I could take their place.

Have you looked up WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, and countless other operations that have happened. All for the benefit so we can sit here and play armchair quarterback.

This is the biggest misconception of all. The Korean government wasn't threatening your life, Vietnam wasn't affecting your life, Saddam wasn't threatening your life. They were political wars, fought for power and money in the hands of an elite few men and they had nothing to do with your freedoms. Stop fooling yourself into thinking that you are somehow more free because of the sacrifices soldiers made in Vietnam. It's bullshit.

There have only been a few wars that were actually fought for worthy causes. The Revolutionary War, The Civil War and World War II. Maybe World War I as well.

[BigWaveDave]

I was in for 20 years. ;-)

Thanks for yours!

I appreciate everybody's thanks. But, I did not want the thread to turn that way. Again thanks.

deutschman,

I am not going to bash you, just request you use proper grammar. As far as you not liking the fact that we got involved in Iraq. Is that your reason for not joining the Corps? You do know that military members do not choose where we fight. Also, as a member of the USMC (or any armed forces) you are expected to take a life if called upon (not the real mission, just an example), maybe even give your life. You can think the war is unjustified and that is your opinion. But I ask, Where are you getting your information that the war was not justified? News sources? Have you ever sat and talked with anyone that has done anything related to the actual strategy of the Iraq Campaign? Do you understand that Osama bin Laden actually said that the fall of America or the fall of the Taliban with be decided on the battle grounds of Iraq. Do you understand that Saddam had 6 or more months to move his WMDs out of Iraq before he granted NATO inspectors to do their job? 6 months! Do you think that you could move WMDs out of your country into a country nieghboring country like Syria or Iran? Hmmm, they don't like us either and are harboring Terrorist.

We could have saved 4K + American brothers and sisters lives from being taken on Iraqi soil. But would you rather tally up that than the lives of Civilians that would be lost on American soil if we had not? I am not downplaying my brother's sacrifice, RIP, but 5/6 years in a war and only 4,000 lives. Have you looked up WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, and countless other operations that have happened. All for the benefit so we can sit here and play armchair quarterback.

I have nothing but love and respect for the men and women serving in our armed forces, and I'm very liberal.

I don't think it's fair to judge a large group of people for the actions of a few, liberal does not equate to soldier hater.

I know for a fact both liberal and conservative groups have chosen very poor places and times to make their voices heard.

The Iraq war is a failure of our government at it's highest levels, no man on the ground should ever be held accountable for the deeds of politicians.

Thank you to all the members of our military that have served bravely and with distinction!

This is a good post. I am very liberal and have nothing bad to say about the military. I have even considered, and still consider joining.

What I have a problem with is using the military as a political tool rather than a means of self defense. Now im not going to ramble on about Iraq because everyone knows the story, but the truth is that the Bush administration used the military to further their own neo-conservative agenda. There were a bunch of different reasons why we invaded Iraq and not one of them was WMD's. But that is what us civilians and you soldiers were all told by the people we were supposed to trust.

Now my question to you is. How do you feel about being lied to by your commander in chief? How do you feel about your friends dieing for this lie?