Obamanomics is a failure! Give it a read

[uofom3]

Let's try this again.....:???:


You can pay yourself whatever you want. Period. Just like any other business. But.....if the business fails, then you can't keep paying yourself....right? Unless, of course, the taxpayers bail you out. Did you miss this? Are you OK with it?

As to your #2......did you know that under Reagan, we went from the world's biggest creditor to the world's biggest debtor? And we're still dealing with the fallout. Business rules change often at the whim of legislators and lobbyists. This is nothing new. But if I, as a business owner, overspend and take big risks and fail, do I deserve a taxpayer funded bailout so I can continue to overspend and take big risks, or do I deserve to fail and face accountability? If not, why not?

Are you serious? What is your point? All you do is stir the pot and provide not an ounce of solution. So how do we fix it?

Also, debt isn't always bad. How else do businesses get started? Seed money (DEBT). Don't confuse good and bad debt. If the country is running into debt financing expansion that makes a lot of sense to me - any good business does that. That's not what we are doing right now. We are spending money that we don't have a snowballs chance in hell of ever seeing any benefit from.

This is what pisses me off about the left fiscally - a lot of whining and blaming and then nothing. The solution they provide is more taxes, spend more on shit that provides zero return, and strangle business. Take from the rich, give to the poor, etc. NONE of that does anything but make matters worse. In reality, all they care about is power and keeping their positions. They made life worse for more people, so they have to create more government programs to keep things going. Then they become the party of the savior and people vote for them because they have to if they want to survive. It's beyond me that someone cannot logically see the pattern here.

The real problem is that no politician has the balls to say "Shit is going to be really hard for a few years, but we will come out of this better off" and just let the markets work themselves out. Supply and demand drives and will take care of everything.

[mar1t1me]

Are you serious? What is your point? All you do is stir the pot and provide not an ounce of solution. So how do we fix it?

Really? Fix it? You CAN'T fix it. Any "solution" one could pull out of one's arse would no doubt be based on only a partial knowledge of the situation, which is why no one can fix it.

Also, debt isn't always bad. How else do businesses get started? Seed money (DEBT). Don't confuse good and bad debt.

All debt is risk based. If I borrow, and still run my business into the ground, would you keep loaning me more? Bad debt is giving the same people more money and expecting a different result!

The real problem is that no politician has the balls to say "Shit is going to be really hard for a few years, but we will come out of this better off" and just let the markets work themselves out. Supply and demand drives and will take care of everything.

That's because our politicians are bought and paid for by the parties that keep getting bailed out.

If those cash cows fail, the politician's golden parachutes fail with them.

[uofom3]

Partial knowledge? No one knows everything, i don't, you don't, no one does. I can accept that. But we have to look at this by taking a step back. It sounds like you blame corporations and the right - but what about the unions? They are a failed economic model for just about anyone and only help the employees of those businesses and they fail (GM, Government employees, etc.). They vote Dem 99% of the time becase the dems will keep shelling out money and destroying private enterprise to keep them happy.

As far as letting them fail goes, I'm all for it. Darwinian forces will take over and those who make sound decisions will win. But guess who is going to lose? The unions, goverment employees, etc. They will be the primary casualties of all of these things.

No solutions are perfect, but lets stop basing them on emotion and base them on basic principles of how things work in an economic system. It sounds like you are promoting the idea of free markets solving the problems - I agree but that's not what we are doing as a country.

I thought that rather than going this far into debt we should have done the following:
- not passed the healthcare bill
- had a 50% suspension of all taxes for at least a year (we already ran $900 billion plus in the hole - at least this way the consumer would spend the money based on free market forces and not the Government).
- Let the companies that are going to fail, fail. Lots of companies go BK and come back, so let the market decide the winners and losers.

We have proven that and increase G in the equation does not increase Y. So why do we keep doing it? That's what is beyond me.

[uofom3]

I needed to add this:

The government at the start of the financial meltdown had the means to stimulate the economy. There is nothing wrong with that but to the degree that they did it, in combination with all of the other legislation that was passed, has really put us behind the eight ball for quite a while.

[gwb72tii]

I needed to add this:

The government at the start of the financial meltdown had the means to stimulate the economy. There is nothing wrong with that but to the degree that they did it, in combination with all of the other legislation that was passed, has really put us behind the eight ball for quite a while.

do you know the government could have declared an income tax holiday for everyone that pays tax for 12 months and not spent as much as the "stimulus"?
maybe that would have worked better.

[uofom3]

do you know the government could have declared an income tax holiday for everyone that pays tax for 12 months and not spent as much as the "stimulus"?
maybe that would have worked better.

That's what I said in my first post - I agree. This puts the money in the hands of the consumer to SPEND. This creates a HUGE amount of cash for businesses to spend and hire. Our problems would be solve and with the huge increase in tax revenue that would be gained by the Government and they would be able to tax more people who were employed a year later and be able to solve the deficit problem relatively quickly if they cut spending in the process.

BUT, that goes straight against the posture that the current administration takes - that is that Goverment is the solution, not the problem.

[DarkWing6]

do you know the government could have declared an income tax holiday for everyone that pays tax for 12 months and not spent as much as the "stimulus"?
maybe that would have worked better.

Then everyone would be crying that the rich got a bigger break than the poor. And that you didn't help those people that don't have jobs.

:yawn:

[Farbin Kaiber]

Wow, startling fact.