Paul Ryan

**gwb72tii** · 08-13-2012, 12:10 PM

even Clinton's former chief of staff likes Ryan

Democrat Erskine Bowles Called Ryan Budget 'Sensible, Straightforward, Serious'

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/08/13/Democrat-Erskine-Bowles-called-Ryan-Budget-Sensible-Straightforward-Serious

Erskine Bowles, the Democratic co-chairman of President Obama's National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform, called the Paul Ryan budget |

i'd also argue that if you cut spending hard and raise taxes we'd be in a serious recession and tax revenues would never match expectations. the economy has to grow to get out of the hole we're in.

**herbivor** · 08-13-2012, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by Cliche Guevara

Is he one of those "never ever raise taxes ever" idiots? What we need is someone to come forward and admit that we'll have to both cut entitlements and raise taxes in order to balance the budget. The only spending Congress will consider cutting is non military discretionary spending, which is some of the most fruitful spending. Things like scientific research, education, and infrastructure lay the framework for a strong nation, but they're the first thing we look to when we need to save a quick buck.

AFAIK he is one of those "never raise taxes" idiots.

**Cliche Guevara** · 08-13-2012, 12:14 PM

Originally posted by gwb72tii

if romney had chosen portman or some other romney-like-clone for vp, it would be really hard to pull the lever, but i would anyways.

But that's the thing, you guys are pulling for anybody but Obama just like we were pulling for anybody but Bush in '04 (which rolls of the tongue a bit better ;)). Kerry was an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Romney is an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Both have made past legislative actions that they sorely regret (voting for the Iraq war, signing the Massachusetts health care reform into law) and both are woefully bland.

Romney is the GOP John Kerry, and just like Kerry he won't win.

**Cliche Guevara** · 08-13-2012, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by gwb72tii

even Clinton's former chief of staff likes Ryan

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...orward-Serious

Do yourself a favor and stay away from partisan news sources.

i'd also argue that if you cut spending hard and raise taxes we'd be in a serious recession and tax revenues would never match expectations. the economy has to grow to get out of the hole we're in.

Woah, so you're admitting that cutting spending hurts the economy? This is the first time I've seen a right-winger make that concession.

**BraveUlysses** · 08-13-2012, 02:31 PM

Originally posted by Cliche Guevara

But that's the thing, you guys are pulling for anybody but Obama just like we were pulling for anybody but Bush in '04 (which rolls of the tongue a bit better ;)). Kerry was an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Romney is an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Both have made past legislative actions that they sorely regret (voting for the Iraq war, signing the Massachusetts health care reform into law) and both are woefully bland.

Romney is the GOP John Kerry, and just like Kerry he won't win.

Agree, bigtime. Instead of picking someone to appeal to the undecided masses, he went for the guy who will appeal to the rightest of the GOP, who may not have been too keen on Mr milquetoast romney's blandness.

**gwb72tii** · 08-13-2012, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by Cliche Guevara

Do yourself a favor and stay away from partisan news sources.

Woah, so you're admitting that cutting spending hurts the economy? This is the first time I've seen a right-winger make that concession.

don't kill the messenger. it's still true.

there is no multiplier for government spending. but to cut government spending you will have to reduce the government workforce. raising taxes at the same time will also throw people out of work. this is why europe's path to prosperity won't work. they're doing the same thing.

will anyone please show me where raising taxes has reduced the deficit. it didn't work with clinton. congress spends whatever it brings in.

herb and others apparently still think, even without supporting proof (global warming anyone?) that we have a tax issue, not a spending issue.

**gwb72tii** · 08-13-2012, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by Cliche Guevara

But that's the thing, you guys are pulling for anybody but Obama just like we were pulling for anybody but Bush in '04 (which rolls of the tongue a bit better ;)). Kerry was an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Romney is an uninspiring, rich, disconnected moderate going against an incumbent hated by his opposing party. Both have made past legislative actions that they sorely regret (voting for the Iraq war, signing the Massachusetts health care reform into law) and both are woefully bland.

Romney is the GOP John Kerry, and just like Kerry he won't win.

yes, and the diff today is we have the most partisan politician in the presidency in my lifetime. both bush's were right of center moderates like romney. clinton was the reverse. obama is so far left he's practically off the map.

i had, as many "right wingers" had, problems with with the bush's and clinton's spending. this president has turbo'd the spending and has no plans to stop according to his budgets. it's going to kill our country if it doesn't stop IMHO.

debates should be interesting. we'll see if Ryan gets to school obama on the budget again.

**Cliche Guevara** · 08-13-2012, 02:55 PM

Originally posted by gwb72tii

don't kill the messenger. it's still true.

I'm not debating the facts in that article (didn't read it), I just know who Andrew Breitbart is and what he stands for. He is a conservative pushing a conservative agenda, that alone should tell you that you aren't getting the full story when you read articles off his website. The same goes for liberal publications, I'm not doing myself any favors if I read DailyCos (or whatever it's called). You are best served getting your information from a news source with as little bias as possible while avoiding publications that serve only to reaffirm your preconceived notions. That's why I don't watch any cable news other than Fox News (just to see what they're up to) and get most all my info from The Economist and Christian Science Monitor.

this is why europe's path to prosperity won't work.

Europe is not one, homogeneous nation, there are a slew of plans being tried with mixed results. Germany has weathered the recession quite well, and we would be wise to follow their lead in the future.

will anyone please show me where raising taxes has reduced the deficit. it didn't work with clinton. congress spends whatever it brings in.

Sure you cannot be serious?

herb and others apparently still think, even without supporting proof (global warming anyone?) that we have a tax issue, not a spending issue.

Nobody thinks that this is purely a tax issue. Spending is most certainly a part of the problem, but the key word is "part." There's nothing radical about returning to the tax rate we had in the 90s.

**Cliche Guevara** · 08-13-2012, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by gwb72tii

yes, and the diff today is we have the most partisan politician in the presidency in my lifetime. both bush's were right of center moderates like romney. clinton was the reverse. obama is so far left he's practically off the map.

What has Obama done that is unprecedented? Hell, Nixon was more liberal than Obama.

**DaveNorCal** · 08-13-2012, 03:59 PM

Obama is polarizing because he is presiding while non-white. Plain and simple. And yes, he does make Nixon look like a liberal.

**joshh** · 08-13-2012, 04:35 PM

At least Romney picked a guy that isn't a total waffleswaffleswaffleswaffleswaffles like himself. Ryan can argue and argue things well. This may make things interesting for the folks on the Obama side who now have a shit ton more work to try to not get involved and make things look a certain way rather than confront the other side.

**Farbin Kaiber** · 08-13-2012, 04:38 PM

It's interesting how it's always the "Lefterners" talking about race.

**e30e** · 08-13-2012, 04:48 PM

Douche Bag!!!
Lets start:

The Worst Part of Paul Ryan's Budget

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/03/the-worst-part-of-paul-ryans-budget/254845/

Paul Ryan's budget takes us back to 1950. That's not a metaphor. That's a statistic.

The Ryan Role

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/08/13/the-ryan-role/?smid=tw-NytimesKrugman&seid=auto

He’s not a serious conservative, but he plays one on TV.

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http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/08/13/paul-two-bills-ryan-congressional-seat-warmer-zero-impact-in-thirteen-years/

The Legendary Paul Ryan -- New York Magazine - Nymag

http://nymag.com/news/features/paul-ryan-2012-5/index3.html

The implosion of the Newt Gingrich presidential campaign—the first implosion, before the weird resurrection and inevitable second implosion—came because he used four words: right-wing social engineering. He used the phrase, last May, to describ [...]

The Right's brittle heroes - Salon.com

http://www.salon.com/2012/08/12/the_rights_brittle_heroes/?miaou

The contrast between Paul Ryan's iconic image and his personal reality is typical of America's partisan leaders

Paul Ryan in Six Charts: How He’d Bring Romney’s Taxes Close to Zero

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/08/paul-ryan-charts

Gut Medicare and children's health, a giant windfall for the 0.1 percent: Eye-popping stats on what the numbers really mean.

And finally of course his running mate turd sandwhich wants to do this, why would anyone vote for these idiots oh because their idiots:

Mitt Romney Denies Freedom of Religion

http://www.alternet.org/mitt-romney-denies-freedom-religion

Do you believe in freedom of religion? President Obama does, and he is defending Americans’ freedom of religion against Mitt Romney and Fox News.