Gun ownership restricted for domestic offenders

[einhander]

At least that's what the Supreme Court has to say about it.

Glad to see that progress to keep guns away from lunatics continues.

The Supreme Court on Wednesday strengthened a federal law that bars anyone convicted of domestic violence from possessing a gun.
In a 9-0 decision, the high court said the ban extended to anyone who had pleaded guilty to at least a misdemeanor charge of domestic violence, even in cases in which there was no proof of violent acts or physical injury.


http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-...#ixzz2xASLqbm1

[mrsleeve]

your in your shop working on something, had a VERBAL argument with wife/G.F. . Wife calls the local constabulary claims domestic violence. Cops come, your word against hers, you go to jail you will be convicted you lost fire arms right because of vindictive lying bitch.

Women lie about such things all the time to gain the upper hand in divorce proceeding's or to lay the ground work for such a case. I work in a industry with a very high rate of divorce, thanks to the shear amount of travel and length of time in which we are gone. I know people that have been placed in this very trap, so the soon to be ex will get higher support checks every week so they dont have to lose their life style but can go fuck around with the Milk Man or the UPS guy.

I dont like the misdemeanor provision of the law, I think its a necessary law for true wife/husband beaters but in a lot of ways it puts even more incentive out there to "massage" or embellish a story to gain a legal advantage. Since many Domestic cases are he said she said kind of deals, that in many cases the out come favors the woman I think there needs to be some more definitive proof or running history involved when the forfeiture of a RIGHT is on the table thats all I am trying to say really.

Also is a disciplining your children with a occasional and rightly deserved spanking domestic violence (your form CA no need to answer) well I have family that was taken to court by his ex for swatting his daughter LIGHTLY for misbehaving it was a pat to get her in the car more than anything (it was at our house). When the ex heard about it well they have been fighting in one way or another since they split up 5 years ago and you can guess how many 1000 of dollars had to go to the lawyers to get that one cleared up. Should he have lost his firearms rights for that as well ??????

[Farbin Kaiber]

Well einhorn, have you looked into just how many presently 'regular' citizens will begin to rapidly fall into the politically incorrect term you used above because of DSM-V?

[kronus]

so, rebuttal A is "domestic offenders should have guns because women are lying bitches", and rebuttal B is "the government is going to reclassify everyone as domestic offenders and take our guns away"

seriously? do you guys even listen to yourselves?

[mrsleeve]

DO you evre leave the bay area and deal with real people that might be older than 28????

We all know someone or have family or have ourselves delt with a crazy ex......... I did not state all women are of such volition, just making a point thats how easy it can happen because we all know break-ups and divorces can and in many cases do get down right NASTY and dirty. That was the point of that, its nice to see that if fly's right of your elitist head.

anyone who had pleaded guilty to at least a misdemeanor charge of domestic violence, even in cases in which there was no proof of violent acts or physical injury.

So having a verbal altercation can land you into this situation??? Lots of people cant afford the legal battle (especially when having to pay both sides lawyers) so they cop the plea to avoid the fight.


On second thought: This can be used by men just the same against a woman. there have been some cases where this is true, since its mostly the other way around and we are mostly dudes around here that is just the example I chose to use.

[Farbin Kaiber]

so, rebuttal A is "domestic offenders should have guns because women are lying bitches", and rebuttal B is "the government is going to reclassify everyone as domestic offenders and take our guns away"

seriously? do you guys even listen to yourselves?

I think your portrayal of Rebuttal B is a bit shortsighted and minimized. What I was saying is that the precedent the OP shared will undoubtedly be used in stare decisis to continue to add more people to the 'not-legal-to-own' list and remove more and more law abiding citizens from the 'legal-to-own' list. I shared a text that is, and has been used in the past to diagnose and place people into categories of mental-fitness, and implied that it will continue to be used to facilitate the aforementioned list shuffling.

[kronus]

DO you evre leave the bay area and deal with real people that might be older than 28????

We all know someone or have family or have ourselves, that has had a run in with a crazy ex......... I did not state all women are of such volition, just making a point of thats how easy it can happen because we all know break-ups and divorces can and in many cases get down right NASTY and dirty. That was the point of that, its nice to see that if flys right of your elitist head.

yeah, sleeve, I do leave the bay area and deal with people older than 28 on occasion. The bay area is also not some sort of domestic-violence-free hippie fairy land, so I'm not sure what you think you're implying. if you're saying that domestic violence is such a common and accepted conflict resolution strategy where you live that this ruling would seriously affect gun ownership rates, well that sucks. consider moving.

I think your portrayal of Rebuttal B is a bit shortsighted and minimized. What I was saying is that the precedent the OP shared will undoubtedly be used in stare decisis to continue to add more people to the 'not-legal-to-own' list and remove more and more law abiding citizens from the 'legal-to-own' list. I shared a text that is, and has been used in the past to diagnose and place people into categories of mental-fitness, and implied that it will continue to be used to facilitate the aforementioned list shuffling.

So if they already classify people as mentally unfit and use this for political means to restrict gun ownership, how does this additional legislation make it any easier for them? Fudging a mental health ruling from a "suggestible" state psychiatrist has to be easier than setting up a sham trial for domestic violence.

[BraveUlysses]

so, rebuttal A is "domestic offenders should have guns because women are lying bitches", and rebuttal B is "the government is going to reclassify everyone as domestic offenders and take our guns away"

seriously? do you guys even listen to yourselves?

Did you really expect anything better than that?

I did laugh out loud at sleeve calling you an elitist though, always funny to watch someone overreact about where a poster lives.

[Farbin Kaiber]

DSM-V was released last year, and many practicing Psychiatrists are still working out of DSM-IV because it was released in 2000, and has been expounded upon, and has established clinical and legal precedence.

[z31maniac]

DO you evre leave the bay area and deal with real people that might be older than 28????

We all know someone or have family or have ourselves delt with a crazy ex......... I did not state all women are of such volition, just making a point thats how easy it can happen because we all know break-ups and divorces can and in many cases do get down right NASTY and dirty. That was the point of that, its nice to see that if fly's right of your elitist head.



So having a verbal altercation can land you into this situation??? Lots of people cant afford the legal battle (especially when having to pay both sides lawyers) so they cop the plea to avoid the fight.


On second thought: This can be used by men just the same against a woman. there have been some cases where this is true, since its mostly the other way around and we are mostly dudes around here that is just the example I chose to use.

It says IF YOU PLEAD GUILTY NOT IF THE POLICE are called.

2nd. I live in OK, land of the rednecks, I honestly don't know a single person who has ever pleaded guilty to domestic violence or been arrested for it.

Quit hanging out with winners.

[BraveUlysses]

Woah, no need to let a little bit of reading comprehension get in the way of another stupid rant

[Farbin Kaiber]

So Buddy, you mean like a plea deal where you plead GUILTY even though it's formality because both lawyers and the judge know it's BS, and it was 15 years ago, and you end up with a misdemeanor slap on the wrist and 1 year of probation for throwing a coffee cup at a wall in a heated argument with the spouse over the electric bill?

[Thizzelle]

Hit the video recorder on your phone it ends most arguments, trust me. Yes they are still pissed but they are going to be anyways

[z31maniac]

So Buddy, you mean like a plea deal where you plead GUILTY even though it's formality because both lawyers and the judge know it's BS, and it was 15 years ago, and you end up with a misdemeanor slap on the wrist and 1 year of probation for throwing a coffee cup at a wall in a heated argument with the spouse over the electric bill?

So Brandon, you mean like when you constantly come up with far-fetched hypotheticals as an attempt to prove an ill-conceived point?

[mrsleeve]

I deal with lots of people from all class levels. Not in the economic sense but in the social sense. In my line of work I deal with those that you would expect to beat their spouse to those that have attended some of the finest engineering schools and would fit right in with the black tie formal fund raising dinners for 10k a plate.

Most everyone falls somewhere in between. Every job I go to there is at least 3 guys going though a divorce or nasty lawyer involved break up of some degree, it comes with the job when you are gone for months at a time sometimes even years with very little time off to go home. Granted I hear one side of the story, but in many of those situations there seems to be a lot of "embellishment" or out right LYING by both sides to garner an upper hand in said legal proceedings. To either get more cash from the guy out trying to make a living, or trying to get out having too pay at all.

When it comes to Domestic's if the woman says you did anything you are likely leaving in hand cuffs on that accusation alone proof or no proof. Haven't you guys ever watched COPS ffs I know thats a way back machine reference but most of us should remember that....

As to the kronus and the bay area, San Fran has its share of issues I am sure and I may have been a bit harsh. But trying to discount both my and farbs points with "a that will never happen laugh off you guys are grasping at straws" mentality is a bit, how shall we say naive to say the least. From my readings of kronus posting I get the impression that while he may have room mates he lives in a pretty good area, works with lots of good educated white collar management types and is in that around 30 age group like most of us posting ITT. Hence why I asked if he ever ventures far from "hippy land" and associates with people that are more likely to have gone though a Bitter hard fought divorce and ever had to deal with a "woman scorned" that is hell bent on ruining your life with lawyers truth be dammed. Since our generation has not hit that 2 kids a divorce and living in a shitty apartment phase yet and are still in the building a life and career phase, its a legitimate question.

Myself, I do leave my comfort zone and deal with people that have and are going though shit like this, some are very deserving of it just seeing how they deal with life on a day to day basis. Others I am not so sure about and some I KNOW they dont. Unfortunately its a byproduct of my line of work and being in the trades, you get all types, and due to the income it can provide with minimal college level education you get more form the lower end of the social class spectrum than you would say working for Yelp in the BAY area.

I have extended family that have had these types of stunts pulled on them, and its very very expensive to fight it, many people simply cant afford to do so. My wifes uncle had this pulled on him by his diagnosed yet unmediated bi polar ex, (she refused to take her meds) who fled the country with the kids to Germany IIRC, and told the local cops he beat her right before he left on a business trip. This man does not have a violent bone in his body and is a aspiring part time preacher for his chosen faith. Even with the hotel check in to prove he was out of the county at the time of the alleged beating it took him 4+ years to get his/grand fathers/some his dad gun collection back and cost 10's of thousands in legal fees to do so. Hes still fighting with his ex..................

Dont tell me it cant an does not happen, it does every day. This is my point, and to construe other wise or that I am implicating all women will pull such arbitrary BS is nothing more than piss poor attempt to marginalize and dismiss a real and serious catch 22 involving serious consequences for a he said / she said conflict.