Water shutoff in Detriot.

[LSM3]

I live in Southern California. There going to shut off my water because we're running out of it, not because I can't pay for it.

That tends to happen when you don't have a water source.

[E30NJ]

Let Detroit fall, crappy cars and crappy people!

[BLACKCHARM88]

If people in Detroit were actually tax payers and not food stamp leaches there wouldn't be a problem.

[Farbin Kaiber]

^In before "That's Racist".

[kickinindian]

it is rather racist but it isn't wrong I worked with some people from the inner city on a government work program when I worked for the USFS, lazy and whiney as Fuck doing the simplest things! they only lasted 2 months

[mrsleeve]

its very apparent to me that most people posting itt have never set foot in detroit

[cale]

it is rather racist but it isn't wrong I worked with some people from the inner city on a government work program when I worked for the USFS, lazy and whiney as Fuck doing the simplest things! they only lasted 2 months

It's not racist, it's prejudicial.

[rhE-30]

entitlement society

I see this word tossed around here quite a bit, and while in some case's true, in this case it is more like a dependent society. A system has been created on which the population must be dependent on to survive, is this really the fault of those who are now dependent?. For the purpose of the following paragraph, the dependants are those who came, invested in homes, small businesses, families and such.
Back in the day, and by "back in the day", I mean before what we call society today, shopping malls, tract homes and borders, I assume you were able to grab your gun, bow & arrow, slingshot rock or whatever weapon of your choice and go out and kill yourself some critter thing to eat, get some water to wash it down too. That is not the situation today. There... Detroit a system was created, it attracted a large population. At first it was going good, like a brand new shiny red car, with a bunch of chrome on it, just rolling, feeling good, all insured. Soon then the orgies ensued..while they were awesome, it was only awesome during, because after...only shame. The kick in the nuts is when you find maybe one or two not so wifely broads are pregnant. Thus creating a bunch of illegitimate children not worth investing in. Then big business goes bust because they can't see far enough in the future, packs it up and moves out leaving the system a single mom, decaying, battered woman. Those dependants now find themselves holding property that ain't worth shit, can't sell it because there upside-down. More jobs leave, you lose yours. The kids need food, gotta pay the bills.. including da celly, what do you do? The teen wants some Jordan's, so he starts selling some weed, learns the word "ratchet"...it is a vicious spiral. Then it's easy to tell somebody, "just pack it up, try somewhere else", but where are you going to go? I've read "The Grapes of Wrath", it's not easy. Now sitting on failed investments and dreams, they're stuck, like a hamsters in a cage sucking on a giant metal nipple attached to a giant plastic water bottle, near a rusty empty building almost empty. The owner watching and standing back asking themselves if they should refill it. O, they will consider it.. in exchange for money, which like the water, mostly under their control. The point here is.. ...wear a condom at the orgy.

[marshallnoise]

Wow. You put a lot of effort into that. Invest in the "return key" once in a while.

That said, if you understood basic economics, opportunity cost and economies of scale, you would see the situation for what it is: people feel entitled. Or dependent by choice.

Bad things happen to good people every day and good things happen to bad people every day too.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

[The Dark Side of Will]

From the website:

How did things get so unequal?
Expose the root cause of inequality and help find solutions

That by itself is way over on the looney bin side of leftism.
Inequality isn't a problem.

Throughout human history, people have had to work for drinkable water. That work has gradually been handed off to big machines. That's part of the advancement of technology. The operation of the big machines still has to be paid for. Therefore, water isn't a right.

In general, you don't have any rights that require someone else to do something for you.
There's a word for someone having the right to the product of someone else's work: slavery.

It's hilarious that the article said what the real problem is, but was so wrapped up in its ideological soap box that it couldn't be bothered to look at what's actually wrong.

years of corruption and mismanagement

Every time I read anything about Detroit politics, I'm told that everything there is completely fucked.

[Dozyproductions]

Supply and demand. Not everyone can be rich........ There's always the conspiratorial view. Middle class is systemically being destroyed so the government makes it easy being dependent, with all these "help you put you back on your feet" programs, on them when you transition to the lower class. Take away the guns and we have a more plutocratic society and heil hitler. Water is no longer a right. /troll

[BLACKCHARM88]

Its not racist at all, its a statistical fact. Yes, I may be prejudice but their the ones projecting the blame and making excuses why they weren't able to make a solid living. Do I feel sorry for them and their problems? Hell no!

[smooth]

From the website:



That by itself is way over on the looney bin side of leftism.
Inequality isn't a problem.

Throughout human history, people have had to work for drinkable water. That work has gradually been handed off to big machines. That's part of the advancement of technology. The operation of the big machines still has to be paid for. Therefore, water isn't a right.

In general, you don't have any rights that require someone else to do something for you.
There's a word for someone having the right to the product of someone else's work: slavery.

It's hilarious that the article said what the real problem is, but was so wrapped up in its ideological soap box that it couldn't be bothered to look at what's actually wrong.



Every time I read anything about Detroit politics, I'm told that everything there is completely fucked.

When people make that kind of claim they're referring to the cascading effects of systematically restraining certain groups of people from being able to better themselves both formally and informally. There's a direct connection between slavery when blacks were legally prevented from learning to read and write, then after being freed legally prevented from owning certain property, then legally prevented from voting, then legally prevented from benefitting from things like social security and union positions, legally prevented from being in manager or getting certain raises, then after those things were dismantled they were still redlined and prevented from voting and holding certain jobs informally, and couldn't go to the same schools or colleges until fairly recently in us history.

Now the water situation isn't about simply saying poor people don't want to pay but rather their rates doubled over night and payment was demanded in full and shut off immediately for non-compliance. Even if you're holding a secure job but living paycheck to paycheck even an extra 50 bucks means choosing between water that month or not paying rent, gas, or child care. Simple because people came in and coughed up some money when the water turned off doesn't mean they had it all along and were choosing not to pay and there's no legit crisis.

In fact, what do you envision accounted for this 120% water rate hike? It didn't become twice as expensive to pump water into Detroit overnight. Over time, utilities cost less to serve not more. Surprised adults don't understand that basic concept of economy of scale, etc. Much more complicated than simply believing that 80,000 people are just lazy fucks who don't work and rather but iPhones and escalades instead of paying their utility bills. UN human rights groups just crazy mofos even though we can get potable water into the deepest regions of the amazon and war torn Iraq but can't get it pumped into what was once the bedrock of US ingenuity and commerce...

[The Dark Side of Will]

When people make that kind of claim they're referring to the cascading effects of systematically restraining certain groups of people from being able to better themselves both formally and informally.

Not sure what you're getting at here. What kind of claim are you referring to?

There's a direct connection between slavery when blacks were legally prevented from learning to read and write, then after being freed legally prevented from owning certain property, then legally prevented from voting, then legally prevented from benefitting from things like social security and union positions, legally prevented from being in manager or getting certain raises, then after those things were dismantled they were still redlined and prevented from voting and holding certain jobs informally, and couldn't go to the same schools or colleges until fairly recently in us history.

That's racist discrimination. They still owned the products of their work, so it wasn't slavery.

Now the water situation isn't about simply saying poor people don't want to pay but rather their rates doubled over night and payment was demanded in full and shut off immediately for non-compliance. Even if you're holding a secure job but living paycheck to paycheck even an extra 50 bucks means choosing between water that month or not paying rent, gas, or child care. Simple because people came in and coughed up some money when the water turned off doesn't mean they had it all along and were choosing not to pay and there's no legit crisis.

I'm familiar with having to make tough financial choices.

In fact, what do you envision accounted for this 120% water rate hike?

I quoted above where they mentioned it right in the article, but couldn't see it for what it is because of their ideological fixation:

years of corruption and mismanagement

It didn't become twice as expensive to pump water into Detroit overnight. Over time, utilities cost less to serve not more. Surprised adults don't understand that basic concept of economy of scale, etc. Much more complicated than simply believing that 80,000 people are just lazy fucks who don't work and rather but iPhones and escalades instead of paying their utility bills. UN human rights groups just crazy mofos even though we can get potable water into the deepest regions of the amazon and war torn Iraq but can't get it pumped into what was once the bedrock of US ingenuity and commerce...

Detroit's been a financial disaster for a long time. The city is desperate for cash, and they're trying their most extreme measures to get more.

If they can't pay the workers who operate the water systems, those workers won't show up for work... then *NO ONE* gets water. It's headed that way if the city can't unfuck itself. This isn't about oppression or human rights. It's simply complete, utter, total, bafflingly persistent grotesque mismanagement on the verge of criminal negligence on the part of the city government... but it's not a human rights issue. It's just the result of putting stupid people in charge for a long long time...

I'd guess probably due to union voting blocks... but that's a different discussion.

OBTW, what's your source for the more detailed information about Detroit's water billing practices?

[mrsleeve]

. It's simply complete, utter, total, bafflingly persistent grotesque mismanagement on the verge of criminal negligence on the part of the city government... ?

Ummm that verge was crossed a while back and by a huge margin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kwame_Kilpatrick

I cant help but laugh at the waxing about Detroit from CA from all the bleeding hearts that have never set foot in the town, or have the foggiest clue about its last 60 years of history and why it is what it is. Not to mention form those that have no idea how much it costs to install, repair, maintain, and operate a municipal water system. As to the economics of scale, Detroit was once a city of near 2mil people, now its population is about a 1/4 of that, lots of abandon and bombed out neighborhoods, ( its like a slightly more friendly and inviting Mogadishu) . So when you cut the available "customers" by 75% yet still have to maintain service to the others how else to you get the money to keep the system up and running with out adding a few pennies to each months bill.....

I lived the bulk of my life not all that far from Detroit, I built municipal water and sewer systems for a decade in MI, as did my father for 28 years. 2 subjects I know a little about