Question for the hardcore 2A guys.....

[mbonder]

Honestly this last page is what society needs
Adult level communication. So much shallow, name calling, get the last dig, childlike behavior going on by both sides that it's damn near impossible to even converse with anyone holding alternate viewpoints and opinions. Society has indeed taken a turn to the worse as far as respect for one another, deep thinking, self awareness, and honesty. The lack of thinking or intellectual laziness is scary. Other govt see this and are actively sewing the seeds of conflict while simultaneously fanning the flames. We need to change are attitudes towards one another if we are to find solutions for today and tomorrow's problems.

Open question. I hope guys can answer honestly. It appears there may be the will for some firearm legislation comming forward. Do you think if Hillary was president, it would be passed? I am not asking it in a way that only Trump could get it done, but more from the angle of the GOP would have blocked any Democratic measure for firearm laws?

Honestly, we could solve the global warming debate thread as well with just this one page, decay agreeing with sleeve, hell may have just frozen over and stopped rising ocean levels...

To answer your question, I think it's more about who controls Congress than it is about the President. Traditionally, Republicans are less likely to pass gun control legislation than Democrats are, so depending upon which one is in power will determine whether legislation is passed or not.

I do also feel that if Hillary were in power the Republicans would never vote in agreement with her on a single issue unless forced into a corner by the lesser of two evils. It would have been the final two years of Obama for another four years, which I think wasn't good for anyone.

[mrsleeve]

Is this really where we have ended up with all this shit 1st pop tart gun from a 7 year old a few years ago to teenage math problem gun threat 4 days ago WTF...... I am really getting tired of seeing all these kids that can barely be trusted to NOT EAT packets of laundry detergent, and dress themselves appropriately, all the suddenly are now experts on the gun control debate. Now they are seeing "gun/terrorist threats" in fucking 9th grade math problems that require the police to get involved..... Surely you "take them all types" see this ridiculousness in this right????? Its sad really I really think by the end of my life time this agenda will see its fruition....... These useful idiots will get to vote soon...................

http://www.katc.com/story/37560947/student-investigated-after-allegedly-saying-a-math-symbol-looked-like-a-gun

Criminal charges will not be filed against a student after allegedly saying a math symbol looked like a gun.





On Tuesday afternoon, Allen Parish Sheriff's Office deputies investigated an allegation of terrorist threats at Oberlin High School, according to the department's Facebook page. The investigation revealed that a student was completing a math problem and drew the sign for square root. Deputies say another student made a comment that the symbol looked like a gun and several other students made similar comments. According to investigators, the comment made by the student in question "could" sound like a threat when taken out of context.

Detectives also searched the students home and found no evidence that he possessed or had immediate access to any type of firearm. Investigators say there was no evidence that the student had any intent to commit harm to students or faculty.

"The student used extremely poor judgment in making the comment, but in light of the actual circumstances, there was clearly no evidence to support criminal charges," stated on the Allen Parish Sheriff's Office Facebook page.

The matter was turned over to the Allen Parish School Board for determination of disciplinary action.

[decay]

decay agreeing with sleeve, hell may have just frozen over and stopped rising ocean levels...

i've said this before, but anarchists and libertarians do align, sometimes.

sleeve, isn't that really an overreaction on the school administration's part? this, to me, is overreach- the culture of "can't say bomb in an airport or TSA gives you a free ride in the party van" has now extended to "can't say gun in a school".

(also wtf, kids are learning what a fucking square root is in *high school* now? i seem to remember being introduced to that somewhere in K-5...)

[z31maniac]

^

Like I have always said laying peacefully in our safes and closets is far more effective than taking them up.......

I have no illusions of effectiveness against modern mechanized tech, be it armor or drone (likely to be piloted by a operator in Bulgaria not a US citizen to avoid that whole not following orders by firing on fellow citizens thing) Thats not the point, deterrance is as napes brings up. A point that if it ever were to come to this....... Well look how long we have been trying to route out a few 1000 guys with rifles in the mountains of Afghanistan since what 2001..... thats 17 fucking years, and a decade before that the russians tried the same thing for about 10 years in the 80's, you have to have boots clearing real estate, and if only 1% of the firearms owners were involved well thats a lot of people.

As to the grazing fees, like I said right wrong or indifferent, thats not the crux of the issue for this discussion. They were being shit on by the feds in the name of environmentalism (desert turtle or something) and they stood up. It should have been handled differently by BOTH SIDES. As to grazing leases, we looked at place a couple years ago that had a 15k ac grazing lease with the place that if you were to let it expire it there was no option to pick it back up. Federal restrictions on public lands and use in the west have been getting more oppressive and more restrictive in general for a long time now.

1. Shut up about the Bundys, that is not relevant in anyway to this discussion.

2. Are you really going to bring up the Middle East? We could level the entire region in just a few days if we wanted to. But the gov't prefers to use it as an excuse to continue the "War on Terror" and keep the general populace scared and inline. I know you know this, but you're using it as a damn sad attempt to justify your position.

[Mediumrarechicken]

This little puppet David Hogg is being good to his master and reading the script. Too bad his master is a complete dumb fuck.

[frankenbeemer]

I frequently read the reason for the 2A, is because of protection against tyranny of the gov't.

Does anyone honestly believe if the gov't turned it's guns on the people, middle-aged folks with a glock and an AR would do anything? (Hint, they wouldn't)

I then frequently get the response that "The military would never turn against the people."

Does anyone see the contradiction here?

It is simply silly to respond that small arms are irrelevant against nuclear armed states; Witness contemporary Northern Ireland and the territories occupied by Israel, where the sophisticated weaponry of Great Britain and Israel have proved almost totally beside the point. The fact that these may not be pleasant examples does not affect the principal point, that a state facing a totally disarmed population is in a far better position, for good or ill, to suppress popular demonstrations and uprisings than one that must calculate the possibilities of its soldiers and officials being injured or killed.

Sanford Levinson

Yale Law Journal, Volume 99, pp. 637-659
Entire article here: http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/2nd_Am...assing_2nd.htm

[mrsleeve]

Opps that didnt work out too well

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/google-tried-censoring-gun-shopping-searches-it-backfired/article/2650230

[flyboyx]

this thread is a great example of why we shouldn't have a p&r sub forum on a bmw web site.

[Thizzelle]

it is there as a prevention measure.

[mrsleeve]

HUH SO the leftist do understand the reasoning for the 2A. This is funny as shit coming from the party that wishes the public to be disarmed , and seems a bit more willing to jump the gun with this type of sentiment.

yeah yeah fox news blah blah blah, there is a video of the idiot.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/03/19/democrat-suggests-second-amendment-remedy-vs-trump.html

[Powling]

I'm not trying to spark a pro-gun VS no-gun debate here...

...but how are we going to stop people from shooting up schools? I heard about the shooting in Texas today and my mind (to my own disgust) automatically went numb and had no reaction. Almost like its become so normal these days that my mind has no emotional reaction to it.

This made me feel TERRIBLE immediately afterwards. Is that the stage we are at now, where we hear about school shootings and react like its a normal part of our daily lives? I really don't hope so.

We recently had the van attack here in Toronto, which shows that even with banning guns people can still use whatever they can get their hands on to attack innocent people, but with that being said are these attacks too "glorified" in the media and encourages others to commit acts like it for the attention, or is it an issue with mental health that seriously needs to be addressed, not only in America but world wide?

[mrsleeve]

Stop putting them on tv 24/7 don't give the attention mongers what they desire. Their name emblazoned into the history books for ever....

[myinfernalbmw]

I'm not trying to spark a pro-gun VS no-gun debate here...

...but how are we going to stop people from shooting up schools? I heard about the shooting in Texas today and my mind (to my own disgust) automatically went numb and had no reaction. Almost like its become so normal these days that my mind has no emotional reaction to it.

This made me feel TERRIBLE immediately afterwards. Is that the stage we are at now, where we hear about school shootings and react like its a normal part of our daily lives? I really don't hope so.

We recently had the van attack here in Toronto, which shows that even with banning guns people can still use whatever they can get their hands on to attack innocent people, but with that being said are these attacks too "glorified" in the media and encourages others to commit acts like it for the attention, or is it an issue with mental health that seriously needs to be addressed, not only in America but world wide?

I think a huge part of the problem is that it's such a complex issue that people try to oversimplify. Combined with the insatiable need to be right about absolutely everything instantly leads to people solidifying their "take away guns" vs "give everyone guns" arguments, which are non-starters. Until people want to consider real solutions on both sides (and understand that it's not a simple pen stroke fix), nothing is going to change and we're going to keep becoming desensitized to events like this.

[Powling]

Stop putting them on tv 24/7 don't give the attention mongers what they desire. Their name emblazoned into the history books for ever....

I'd agree with that statement. Especially when you see some of the people committing these acts will openly praise others before them that did the same thing.

I think a huge part of the problem is that it's such a complex issue that people try to oversimplify. Combined with the insatiable need to be right about absolutely everything instantly leads to people solidifying their "take away guns" vs "give everyone guns" arguments, which are non-starters. Until people want to consider real solutions on both sides (and understand that it's not a simple pen stroke fix), nothing is going to change and we're going to keep becoming desensitized to events like this.

I think this is a key point here - and from what I've observed of America lately is it seems there is more divide between opinions and cultures than there has been in a long time. Even just getting both sides to sit down to discuss what COULD be done to fix this issue is like moving a mountain. I could be wrong though, and just stating that from what I've seen in the news rather than actually having multiple conversations with Americans on the issues.

[wworm]

I heard about the shooting in Texas today and my mind (to my own disgust) automatically went numb and had no reaction. Almost like its become so normal these days that my mind has no emotional reaction to it.

I'm in the same boat here. This has become such a real and disappointing reaction on my end to these situations.

I think a lot of problems could be solved with proper educational funding, gun control is more of a band aid when the root of the problem lies more in the fact that these kids are fucked in the head and need therapy/extra curriculars/hellaothershittokeepthembusyandsatisfied. Its phenomenal what one good teacher can provide for a student, or what a club or hobby can do for someones self esteem.