My e30 is thinking it's a VW!

[Jean]

Very odd. Try adjusting your rates: raise the front, lower the rear. The rear of these cars needs to be planted to have any chance of going fast.

What rates do you suggest I try next (considering the next tire size is going to be 275/35/15 I am thinking I should probably go stiffer all the way around) ? Currently its 550front/675rear with front cabrio bar and no rear bar.

I thought about maybe giving a small rear bar a chance?

[Cabriolet]

jean, that's a really nice looking set up. those 550 fronts keeps you so stable.

coming to marina on the 20th?

[JJ1]

What rates do you suggest I try next (considering the next tire size is going to be 275/35/15 I am thinking I should probably go stiffer all the way around) ? Currently its 550front/675rear with front cabrio bar and no rear bar.

I thought about maybe giving a small rear bar a chance?

A rear sway bar will make your inside rear wheel lift worse. Get an adjustable substantial front swaybar or an adjustable set. The OEM ASBs are a joke.

[E30 Racer]

What rates do you suggest I try next (considering the next tire size is going to be 275/35/15 I am thinking I should probably go stiffer all the way around) ? Currently its 550front/675rear with front cabrio bar and no rear bar.

I thought about maybe giving a small rear bar a chance?

Those spring rates should be OK...what kind of shocks are you using? Assuming they're OK, I'd try a big Ireland bar at the front, and try lowering the rear ride height.

[Jean]

The shocks are bilstein sports that I sent to bilstein and they were revalved. Instead of using an Ireland bar would running existing bar but with m3 end links be just as effective?

[E30 Racer]

Hard to say, I don't have the M3 links. The big bar works well, I'm pretty sure the fastest e30 autocrossers in the country are so-equipped.

Try some 500-550s at the rear and widen your track as much as possible. Also remember slow in, fast out. Adjusting your driving style may help the car as well.

[Jean]

Thanks Garrick! I think I'll give the m3 style end links a shot, since it will be easy and cheap to try vs a new front bar and report back .

[Wanganstyle]

A rear sway bar will make your inside rear wheel lift worse. Get an adjustable substantial front swaybar or an adjustable set. The OEM ASBs are a joke.

you think so? I have not autoXed an E30, so I cannot say from my own seat time. only similar japanese shoe boxes

His diff setting is non standard, very aggressive locking and power transfer. As long as there is enough weight on 1 tire on ground to not burn out on power, he can put it all down, it will not break away and become open.

its setup to allow swing swing transition on full power such as corner #5 @ Laguna Seca, lift a tire or not.

[JJ1]

If your point is, wheel lift is ok, I would still disagree (unless under trail braking conditions). But my post was refering to how to eliminate the wheel lift. I think lifting the rear inside wheel would cause loss of power and grip out of the turn.

[JJ1]

you think so? I have not autoXed an E30, so I cannot say from my own seat time. only similar japanese shoe boxes

His diff setting is non standard, very aggressive locking and power transfer. As long as there is enough weight on 1 tire on ground to not burn out on power, he can put it all down, it will not break away and become open.

its setup to allow swing swing transition on full power such as corner #5 @ Laguna Seca, lift a tire or not.

I dont understand why you quoted me. Your post doesnt really refer to anything in my quote. ??

[Wanganstyle]

sorry, I did not specify more clearly;

yes, its not ideal for any reason to lift a wheel, but If the car had an open diff or less aggressive setting I don't think it would be as prone to lifting rear wheel on power.

the car also has no rear sway bar, so the rear of the car is rolling more than normal - with the higher rate rear spring than front transferring the weight

--wouldn't the addition of ANY rear sway bar reduce the sway of the rear end of car?

I'm guessing it may cause oversteer because of the high rear spring rate; but does not a sway bar "reduce sway" or keep the body tensioned against itself while cornering?

I have never (personally) lifted a rear wheel in a RWD car before while on power or trail braking for more than a split second on bumpy stuff-

[JJ1]

yes, its not ideal for any reason to lift a wheel, but If the car had an open diff or less aggressive setting I don't think it would be as prone to lifting rear wheel on power.

lift has nothing to do with the diff

the car also has no rear sway bar, so the rear of the car is rolling more than normal - with the higher rate rear spring than front transferring the weight

the reason the wheel is lifting is because the suspension is not compressing on the outside wheel. It is TOO stiff already, so the weight of the car is not compressing the spring. But because of the lateral load being transferred and the suspension not working (that is compressing and rebounding, in this case compressing) the inside wheel comes up because the outside wheel cant compress. Imagine if you had two 20lb cars. One with very soft suspension and one fixed with no suspension. If you pushed the left side of the soft car it would sway to the right. If you pushed the left side of the fixed suspension car it would just roll over on its side.

does that make sense?

[Jean]

For what it's worth, pics 5345 5184 are with the car slowing down / on the brakes.

[JJ1]

I assumed so. I dont think its possible to induce inside rear wheel lift under acceleration.

[Wanganstyle]

I assumed so. I dont think its possible to induce inside rear wheel lift under acceleration.

I didn't think so either but I have seen photos of gymkhana cars (evo or sti I think) lift 2 wheels while turning (one side of the car). I don't know how that works. I will see if can find some photos of this-

also have seen them accelerating and lifting rear wheel @ same time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e2f5N3lNyE&feature=related

sorry for the strange questions, I'm interested to know of how different e30's are setup footwork wise; I have not autox'ed seriously since 2003.

what would happen if:

1. rear spring rate was lowered
2. add rear bar

compared to:

adding larger front bar and leaving rear no sway bar?

I do not understand the remove front or rear or both sway bar phenomenon, seems done in these cars more than others? Or is this an autoX thing? I have heard of civic's removing front or rear bar for autoX reasons.


how would adding more front sway bar stiffness reduce rear tire lift under braking?



would the rear still be jacking up on braking?

is this rear tire lift caused by the front braking force and turning to send all the weight to one side (like how full suspension mountain bikes can have strange rear tire hopping issues under braking)

I have lifted front inside tire cornering before on heavy spring rates but with rear bar, this was on an AWD car with rear bias and a tight set rear diff, for some reason the weaker locking diff would not lift as much front tire. Perhaps I just transferred more weight to rear?