Shocking News: Stock E30 brakes aren't really up to S50 swap track use....

[nrubenstein]

well, there's one big problem...

t

Never said it wasn't. It's still impressive how quickly I put that kind of heat into them.

For comparison, I actually found that ducting the brakes in the race car would would increase the likelihood that I would crack the rotors.

[Fidhle007]

I did more damage to my rotors then I did to my pads, I forget what compound I was running though. They were shaking pretty good by the last session and had some minor cracks.

[jlevie]

Never said it wasn't. It's still impressive how quickly I put that kind of heat into them.

For comparison, I actually found that ducting the brakes in the race car would would increase the likelihood that I would crack the rotors.

Ducting does increase the chance of cracking a rotor, but it significantly increases the chances of avoiding overheating the rotors & pads which means that the brakes work every time and don't fade. Finding out that you have no brakes from fade at 150mph facing a 90deg turn is far worse than a cracked rotor.

[nrubenstein]

Ducting does increase the chance of cracking a rotor, but it significantly increases the chances of avoiding overheating the rotors & pads which means that the brakes work every time and don't fade. Finding out that you have no brakes from fade at 150mph facing a 90deg turn is far worse than a cracked rotor.

Not when you are cracking them in multiple places from hub to rim, all the way through. :). That's why I put DTC-70s on my do not use list. PFCs don't do that, even with ducting.

[ed94r]

I did the same thing to mine some years ago...VIR south. After a session I had to park the car and borrow an E92 M3 for the rest of the weekend.

Notes:
A showroom stock E92 M3 on stock pads at 135mph to 40...good all day

A E30/S50 with HT-10's and PFC 01's rear+superblue, from 125 to 40...trashed rotors and pads after a session.

I can't see how people are doing OK with the stock set-up on brake intensive tracks, no matter what pads.

Ed

[giantkeeper]

Ever considered cool carbon? I have these to help with stopping the swap car. I am no pro on track but these performed quite well for me.

[nrubenstein]

Ever considered cool carbon? I have these to help with stopping the swap car. I am no pro on track but these performed quite well for me.

Those are street pads. The rest is just marketing. Their temperature range is WELL below that of a serious pad.

[e30s50dan]

I may have missed it,but what kind of rotors are you using? Maybe cyro-frozen is an option..just asking,stay the hell a way from advance/auto zone rotors...i installed ducting on my s50 swapped e30, and never really had an issue with brakes,now fuel pick-up...don't get me started!!

[Keith M]

Braking technique? I say this because I've witness pro3 e30's using stock rotors for years. 12 hour endurance races included without changing brakes.

[nrubenstein]

Braking technique? I say this because I've witness pro3 e30's using stock rotors for years. 12 hour endurance races included without changing brakes.

The brakes on my race car last quite a while. Pro3 cars are presumably running ducts, do not have 3,200lbs. competition weights (I know that SpecE30 is around 2,700), are not making the same straight line speed, and don't have to slow nearly as much for the corners because they are running r-tires and a stiffer suspension.

[nrubenstein]

I may have missed it,but what kind of rotors are you using? Maybe cyro-frozen is an option..just asking,stay the hell a way from advance/auto zone rotors...i installed ducting on my s50 swapped e30, and never really had an issue with brakes,now fuel pick-up...don't get me started!!

IIRC, they are the Brembo cheap crap.

[seatown88]

The brakes on my race car last quite a while. Pro3 cars are presumably running ducts, do not have 3,200lbs. competition weights (I know that SpecE30 is around 2,700), are not making the same straight line speed, and don't have to slow nearly as much for the corners because they are running r-tires and a stiffer suspension.

Yep, most PRO3s run ducts, spec weight is 2650lbs, probably don't see as much top end speed, and carry more speed around the corners probably as well.

We still have rotor issues. I cracked a rear rotor last race. I have heard rumors of issues cracking brembo front rotors in the field as well.

[Jonny Cash]

The title has thrown the point of this conversation way off, because we already all know that with all the proper components the stock hard parts (late model ducts included) can handle that power no problem...
obviously bigger brakes wont overheat as quickly but you know what i mean. I personally like ht-10's

[bmnut2002]

Yep, most PRO3s run ducts, spec weight is 2650lbs, probably don't see as much top end speed, and carry more speed around the corners probably as well.

We still have rotor issues. I cracked a rear rotor last race. I have heard rumors of issues cracking brembo front rotors in the field as well.

I stock Centric Premium rotors at my shop. I'll match online pricing and they are cheaper than Brembos. Centric is the parent company for Stop Tech and they don't crack. Give me a ring if you are interested.

[nrubenstein]

The title has thrown the point of this conversation way off, because we already all know that with all the proper components the stock hard parts (late model ducts included) can handle that power no problem...
obviously bigger brakes wont overheat as quickly but you know what i mean. I personally like ht-10's

HT-10s suck. They don't have very good braking torque and they don't last and they have mediocre feel. The only virtue is that they are a lot cheaper than PFC, but PFC pads (even the 01s) last so much longer that it's cheaper to run them.

And yes, with ducts and a few tweaks, you should be able to make the stock system usable. However, if you are using it seriously and spending more time than I was on track, you will probably end up saving money by upgrading to larger brakes. When the brakes are undersized, you tend to eat rotors and eat pads. I also need to rebuild all the calipers as I crisped all of the dust boots as well.

Keep in mind how little time this was on track. I grant that I made no supporting mods other than pads, but this was 1.5 short sessions.