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Old 06-20-2019, 12:37 PM   #1
surebimmer
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Carbotech XP10 for HPDE track days with S52 swpa

Hello everyone. I've been doing alot of HDPE track days now in my swap car. I'm at the point where i'm out driving the HP+ brake pads. Got the front and rear smoking after a 20 min session at Laguna Seca. I'm using E30 M3 Brakes front and rear. I hear good things about Carbotech xp10 pads. I was also looking at the Hawk DTC 60 pads.

Thanks for any advise.
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Old 06-20-2019, 01:08 PM   #2
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Lots of good info here:

https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/sho...d.php?t=350705
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would be in depending on tip slant and tube size
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Old 06-20-2019, 04:30 PM   #3
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Good info there thanks. Lots of feedback on PFC 08 but not much on Carbotech.
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Old 06-22-2019, 05:01 PM   #4
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I've never had good luck with Carbotech. No matter how careful you are with break-in, they smear pad material unevenly all over the rotors and cause horrible vibration.
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Old 06-22-2019, 07:05 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emre View Post
I've never had good luck with Carbotech. No matter how careful you are with break-in, they smear pad material unevenly all over the rotors and cause horrible vibration.
I'm having this issue with DTC60's on my track car currently, I think. Have you have this issue on e30's only or other cars as well? I'm thinking my problem is dumb e30 ABS and pad compound related

OP, I've never heard anyone say anything bad about PFC 08
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Old 06-25-2019, 02:23 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emre View Post
I've never had good luck with Carbotech. No matter how careful you are with break-in, they smear pad material unevenly all over the rotors and cause horrible vibration.
I have e36m3 front brakes, and a custom rear setup. I cannot seem to get the Carbotechs xp10 to not shudder after a few sessions. I have been spending a lot of time trying to get them to work because the dust is not corrosive. No luck though.
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Old 06-26-2019, 06:45 AM   #7
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I'm running about the same power to weight ratio as a swapped car and also have E30 M3 suspension/brakes. I absolutely love PFC08's with blank rotors and AP fluid. The pads last forever as well. As my braking confidence rose I started cracking rotors, but I recently added ducting to help with that issue and so far so good.

Side note: you'll want to switch to a 25mm E32 master cylinder if you're still running a non-M MC, as the non-M MC has the wrong bias for the E30 M3 piston sizes.
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Old 06-26-2019, 08:43 AM   #8
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I'm running the 325xi booster. I think it has the stock master. Should I swap the master on this unit?

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Old 06-26-2019, 08:53 AM   #9
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I am not familiar with anything 325ix but if it uses the same 22mm/f and 17mm/r MC as a non-M, going to the 25mm f/r E32 MC will provide much better bias. The E30 M3 MC was 23.8mm f/r (equal f/r) but does not work with non-M's. The E32 MC is the closest and easiest option to fix the bias.
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Old 06-26-2019, 09:36 AM   #10
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Instead of changing the master, could delete the bias valve.

I started out using Carbotech xp16 for the first couple track years, never had any warping/shuttering - except the one time I got a flat mid-session and didn't do a cool down lap (no brake ducts).

For about the last few years been using dtc60 front/70 rear (stock brake setup, 2650lb/180whp) and they last an entire 14hr race and have about 40% f and 70% rear left on them depending on which track. We alsways buy the cheapest rotors we can find (Centric blanks) and they have small 4-8mm hairline cracks throughout.

On the e36 we run dtc 30f 50r, but that has the 1m front calipers e36m rear. 2750lb/255whp, sprint car, brakes last ~2 weekends.
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Old 06-26-2019, 01:19 PM   #11
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Driven more than one track Miata on Carbotechs. I've read many people complain about break-in, but I know multiple people who follow the same process I did, with no issues.

A nice bonus is they are easy on rotors and aren't harmful to wheels finishes.


Bleed brakes and Install Carbotech's on fresh rotors that have been thoroughly cleaned.

Find a spot where you can follow this exact procedure:

1. Start doing 70-5 mph stops, HARD, on the verge of lockup, threshold braking.
2. Repeat step 1 until the brakes start to smell.
3. Continue to repeat step 1 until the brakes REALLY smell and the pedal starts to get soft.
4. Let cool completely.
5. Bleed brakes again.

Enjoy.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:14 AM   #12
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Thanks for evryones input. I'm going to try the Carbotech xp10's and report back. I don't have a track day until the end of July.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:45 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z31maniac View Post
Driven more than one track Miata on Carbotechs. I've read many people complain about break-in, but I know multiple people who follow the same process I did, with no issues.

A nice bonus is they are easy on rotors and aren't harmful to wheels finishes.


Bleed brakes and Install Carbotech's on fresh rotors that have been thoroughly cleaned.

Find a spot where you can follow this exact procedure:

1. Start doing 70-5 mph stops, HARD, on the verge of lockup, threshold braking.
2. Repeat step 1 until the brakes start to smell.
3. Continue to repeat step 1 until the brakes REALLY smell and the pedal starts to get soft.
4. Let cool completely.
5. Bleed brakes again.

Enjoy.
Yea but...... how often do you really have to use the brakes on a track prepped miata? Unless its turbod or engine swapped.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:54 AM   #14
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Quote:
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Yea but...... how often do you really have to use the brakes on a track prepped miata? Unless its turbod or engine swapped.

HA! So true.



First time I drove a Spec Miata was at Sebring. I did a lap and thought to myself "this thing is so slow and just makes a lot of noise". Then coming down the front straight, I thought "wait...Miata...less braking". Sucked in my gut and just did a throttle lift for turn 1 instead of braking like when in the e30, and couldn't believe how well the car stuck. The lst 30mins of the session was actually fun. The next year I started the 14hr of Sebring in a Miata, and promptly passed the other teammate - who was driving our e30. Had a really good time weaving though traffic until the cool shirt cooler stopped working and nearly had heat stroke (had to get out of the car after 1.5hr dry heaving and nauseous).
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:37 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plain325 View Post
Yea but...... how often do you really have to use the brakes on a track prepped miata? Unless its turbod or engine swapped.
Best you could come up with?

Try again sweetheart.
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