my 24v build, slightly different than the norm. Now with dyno numbers!

[The Dark Side of Will]

I agree. Don't use ARP or any other non-stretching bolts with alu-block. if you have to, use iron block.

One certainly *CAN* use ARP's in an aluminum engine... they just need to be used with the right torque sequence.

What *will* result in disaster is using a factory torquing sequence when either bolt or head gasket material is significantly different than stock.
E.g.'s: replacing aluminum bolts with steel OR replacing a composition head gasket with MLS.

[328ijunkie]

Don't do ARPs. I would timecert though. If the motor has ever gotten hot at all the threads will pull on the 3rd torque stage and then you have to pull the head back off and timecert anyway.

[pazi88]

I'd skip the ARP stuff personally unless you're building some turbo monster you should just use an iron block.

Time-serts, on the other hand, serve a real purpose on the aluminum block motor. My mechanic told me it was a factory recommended repair when removing the head on a high mileage motor. The concern was behind torquing down a head on an aluminum block that it might pull the threads rather than stretch the bolts.

Your results may vary, but I had a motor with an unknown history so I chose the insurance policy of doing them.

I agree. Don't use ARP or any other non-stretching bolts with alu-block. if you have to, use iron block.

But I have experience on several alu-blocks and if the threads look fine, there is no need for timeserting. But for example if you see aluminium in the head bolt threads when you remove them or strange corrosion in the threads in block, then you need to timesert them.

But If you need to timesert the threads I have video showing how you can do it without buying that ridiculously priced thread repair set for m52 engine:

[2mAn]

I'd skip the ARP stuff personally unless you're building some turbo monster you should just use an iron block.

Time-serts, on the other hand, serve a real purpose on the aluminum block motor. My mechanic told me it was a factory recommended repair when removing the head on a high mileage motor. The concern was behind torquing down a head on an aluminum block that it might pull the threads rather than stretch the bolts.

Your results may vary, but I had a motor with an unknown history so I chose the insurance policy of doing them.

[NufnSus]

Why do you need ARP's for NA engine. Or even the timeserts if the threads are fine? The stock bolts are fine even in mild boosted engines.

I don't know the history/ mileage of the block, and from what I've read, stripping threads is possible if the alloy has softened due to excess heat cycles. Seems like a worthwhile 'while I'm in there' job...
Plus supposed possibility of using ARP bolts, which can be re-used

[pazi88]

Thanks for the ongoing updates OP, it's really great to see feedback from someone who's battled through this process successfully, as well as reading your reflections now that you've put some mileage into the motor :thumbsup

I was hoping you might remember some of the details on the timesert-ing process;

I've been considering this process for my N/A aluminium M52B30 build, but I've been seeing a fair bit of conflicting info in terms of timesert type to use, and the compatibility with ARP studs - what combo did you use?

ARP's own website only shows cylinder head kits for the iron blocks, nothing for the Euro M52 (alu).
And my understanding was that those ARP studs are too long for the threads created by the timeserts, when installed in the alu blocks

Why do you need ARP's for NA engine. Or even the timeserts if the threads are fine? The stock bolts are fine even in mild boosted engines.

[NufnSus]

Thanks for the ongoing updates OP, it's really great to see feedback from someone who's battled through this process successfully, as well as reading your reflections now that you've put some mileage into the motor :up:

I was hoping you might remember some of the details on the timesert-ing process;

I've been considering this process for my N/A aluminium M52B30 build, but I've been seeing a fair bit of conflicting info in terms of timesert type to use, and the compatibility with ARP studs - what combo did you use?

ARP's own website only shows cylinder head kits for the iron blocks, nothing for the Euro M52 (alu).
And my understanding was that those ARP studs are too long for the threads created by the timeserts, when installed in the alu blocks

ok so I spent the last two days working on the engine. yesterday I spent drilling and timesert-ing the block, then today my goal was to get the head and oil pan on so it looked like a long block, more or less...

my timesert setup.

[2mAn]

This isnt the exact same motor, but heres your chance to get both goals done

http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=342823

[MatRacer]

Just read the entire thread... Wow, you went through a lot! good job on keeping faith!

I'm presently looking at the possibility of an aluminium 24v. still debating. But the story you went through is guiding me to just droping a complete good running engine...

[pandaboo911]

I had the same dips in power. After hooking up the VSS they were gone. Try resetting your Ecu and see if they disappear. Probably a VANOS related issue.

[2mAn]

A little premature 1 year update. Ive successfully put 24k miles on this thing and I honestly can say now that it was all worth it. When the deadlines werent met, I bitched like a spoiled child, but once I let go of the situation and let it work itself out, I now have reaped the benefits and have enjoyed the car. I have had a few issues, but most could've been prevented up front:

-Fan issue couldve been prevented if I used a Spal from the beginning

-Blew an ignition coil and subsequently the coil driver (might've been t he other way around though??). This probably couldve been avoided if I had bought new coils when I built my new engine. Either way, 1 new ignition coil and a new ECU and that was fixed

-VANOs is making the typical rattling noise. This was something I overlooked while I was building the engine. Would've and should've done it while the engine was apart, but will be fixed soon.

Other than that, I love this setup. My cars power/ weight ratio is awesome (2450lbs will full interior, full tank, 12" lukebox, etc) and I am constantly embarrassing a lot of newer cars with WAY more power than mine.

I hope to report back in a year with more miles and more smiles.

Peace

-Simon

[2mAn]

Sick gains bro!!

:up:

Thats a high reading dyno considering you shut it down at 6300 for an M52. Either way that graph needs some cleaning up esp if those AFRs are correct ;) :P
Great numbers either way i suppose :P

I dont trust the AFRs, but more importantly I dont like the 2 dips between 3500-4000 & 5000-5500. I know the first is probably related to my noisy VANOs, but not sure on the second.

[328ijunkie]

Thats a high reading dyno considering you shut it down at 6300 for an M52. Either way that graph needs some cleaning up esp if those AFRs are correct ;) :P
Great numbers either way i suppose :P

[Habla]

Sick gains bro!!

[2mAn]

So it clicked out 16k miles on the M52 today. It happened on my way to TFB Performance. They are located right on the Sonoma Raceway property so it was a cool drive and an awesome destination. Went to TFB to get some dyno numbers and honestly was just hoping to be over 200whp. Well... ;D

20141229_094651 by 2mAn

https://youtu.be/3DjzQhihQ64

And the plot
20141229_130240 by 2mAn


:nice: