standalone s54 engine and DSC retrofitting into a e30

[e30ixBoost]

simple straight forward question .. what would be required in order to achieve retrofitting E46 M DSC along a standalone S54 engine swapped within an E30.

Which or what ECU and tune(s) would be best suited ?

what parts would one have to amass ?

[AndrewBird]

You want to fit stability control onto an e30?

Do you even realize what that entails?

[nando]

Yaw sensor, steering angle sensor, entire abs system diff, dsc, mss54 & probably 100lbs of wires.

It would be best if you had an entire m3, so you could remove all the E46 wiring and completely rewire the e30.

But, even transplanted, it's tuned for a bigger, heavier car. There is no gaurantee it would even work.

[Wh33lhop]

You want to fit stability control onto an e30?

Do you even realize what that entails?

Actually, I'm not sure it's SO insurmountable. I was talking to an E46 guy last week (cyberkaa, he knows his shit) and basically if you can put the E46 ABS pump in the E30 (pretty simple) the DSC is a standalone unit excepting the MSS54, wheel speed sensors which will need to be converted to E46/Hall effect, the "DSC sensor" (combined yaw and lateral acc sensor) and the LWS (steering angle sensor). The wheel speed sensors and LWS will be the main headaches here. If you figure them out and get everything in the car, hook it up and that's your retrofit. Worth it? I don't know. Would be interesting though.

With all the of the flak that it catches, E46 DSC is actually pretty cool. It battles understeer and helps maintain yaw by pulsing the outside brakes while braking mid-corner. Don't quote me on this but IIRC either the M3 or the CSL unit is also less intrusive performance-wise. Moreover, E30 ABS sucks. E46 ABS does not. So it's not entirely without merit.

Edit: nando has a point that it may not be as effective on an E30. But I think it would still do its job.

For a bit of technical info: http://www.shipkiller.com/Dynamic_St...trol_MK60.html

[nando]

he's talking about doing this to an ix, not a RWD E30. the ix has different ABS anyway.

[89AlpineM3]

I should do this since I have an entire donor car ...lol ... I'm good just with the swap but it gives me something to think about with all the other left over parts

[nando]

Actually, I'm not sure it's SO insurmountable. I was talking to an E46 guy last week (cyberkaa, he knows his shit) and basically if you can put the E46 ABS pump in the E30 (pretty simple) the DSC is a standalone unit excepting the MSS54, wheel speed sensors which will need to be converted to E46/Hall effect, the "DSC sensor" (combined yaw and lateral acc sensor) and the LWS (steering angle sensor). The wheel speed sensors and LWS will be the main headaches here. If you figure them out and get everything in the car, hook it up and that's your retrofit. Worth it? I don't know. Would be interesting though.

With all the of the flak that it catches, E46 DSC is actually pretty cool. It battles understeer and helps maintain yaw by pulsing the outside brakes while braking mid-corner. Don't quote me on this but IIRC either the M3 or the CSL unit is also less intrusive performance-wise. Moreover, E30 ABS sucks. E46 ABS does not. So it's not entirely without merit.

Edit: nando has a point that it may not be as effective on an E30. But I think it would still do its job.

For a bit of technical info: http://www.shipkiller.com/Dynamic_St...trol_MK60.html

oh yeah, wheel speed sensors are just standard 48 tooth ABS sensors. even stock E30 ones might work.

it would be interesting to look into re-coding the DSC system yourself, although you'd be pretty much on your own there.

[Wh33lhop]

oh yeah, wheel speed sensors are just standard 48 tooth ABS sensors. even stock E30 ones might work.

Whoops, I misspoke about the Hall effect sensors, they are mag type. From what I read on the subject a conversion needs to be performed and it's not entirely trivial. Complete heresay, but it's congruent with the previous link I posted ("With the introduction of the DSCIII MK60, active wheel speed sensors that operate with the magneto resistive effect are used for the first time on BMW vehicles").

I have been interested in a possible DSC reflash on my DD. Haven't gone anywhere with it though, and not sure what all you can do.

Is the ix ABS any better than RWD ABS?

[ohthejosh]

Damn I wish I knew the stuff you guys know. Its like reading stuff in spanish lol. Nonetheless useful info for me to look up and all.

[nando]

Whoops, I misspoke about the Hall effect sensors, they are mag type. From what I read on the subject a conversion needs to be performed and it's not entirely trivial. Complete heresay, but it's congruent with the previous link I posted ("With the introduction of the DSCIII MK60, active wheel speed sensors that operate with the magneto resistive effect are used for the first time on BMW vehicles").

I have been interested in a possible DSC reflash on my DD. Haven't gone anywhere with it though, and not sure what all you can do.

Is the ix ABS any better than RWD ABS?

but they are still 48 tooth sensor wheels. you could possibly use the E30 toothed wheels, or transplant the E46 ones over (if they're the same diameter). the last option would be to make new ones that match the materials/shape of the E46. You'd need the E46 sensors.

another option would be to use an adapter board that takes the E30 ABS sensor signals and outputs the signal that the DSC system wants (basically a VR to Hall conversion, fairly trivial, in fact you can buy a board that does this from Hoveringguy).

I know the M3 guys have used some of the CSL software, but I have no idea what you can do for a standard E46. I imagine it's like a DME where there are settings, maps and curves that could be "tuned" but I've never heard of anyone doing something like that.

Yes. :)

[1990m3]

Just get race logic traction control, $1200 well spent

[gobuffs]

What do you mean "standalone S54"? When I see standalone S54 and E30 I ASSuME you mean stand alone engine management. As long as the standalone computer you have can do traction control you can have it. DSC? Probably not.

I have an S54 in my E30 M3 with a Pectel that has traction control and an E46 M3 CSL MK60 ABS unit working in my car. I have not yet tuned the traction control.

Putting in an MSS4 and the Mk60 should be fairly plug and play IMO. Not sure the steering angle sensor is required (might make it work better but I think it will run without it- I could be wrong)- that would be the most difficult part of the install if required.

[Wh33lhop]

The steering angle sensor is required for any DSC functionality. The ABS will work fine without it, as you probably know, though you will need the DSC sensor for full ABS functionality.

Since you have a MK60 functioning in your car, what did you do for the wheel speed sensors?

[gobuffs]

I used the E46 M3 ones in the front and late Z3 3.0 sensors in the rear (I have M coupe trailing arms so they were plug and play). The rear on the E30 is the tricky part I hear and there is no plug and play sensor- there is some work that needs to get done to get it to fit (I haven't done it so I don't know what it is).

[nando]

are MK60 sensors VR or hall?