Premium Sound upgrade kit feeler

[dubdub]

View from the other side is pretty! I finished installing the local crossovers with E34 speakers, and Dayton tweeters a few months ago. Clear, loud, clean... really happy. Mixed with the 10" box and amp rack, and this is easily the nicest sounding car audio system I have owned in 30 years of loud systems!

[BMWManiac]

Ok, I'm running the $500 system already and want to replace my stock premium system. Does that mean I need 4 x tweeters, and 4 x e34 speakers, and the crossover?

[StereoInstaller1]

Yes, exactly that. If you want the sexy, order the classic. If the you want performance only, get the LPCNs.

As crazy as it sounds, both are in stock at this moment!

[Cephas]

So stupid-ish question: If I am running an amp and the local crossovers, can I run my amp in full range instead of high pass?

[phenryiv1]

So stupid-ish question: If I am running an amp and the local crossovers, can I run my amp in full range instead of high pass?

You can, but without crossing them in HP mode you are sending a lot of bass to a set of midranges.

[Cephas]

You can, but without crossing them in HP mode you are sending a lot of bass to a set of midranges.

But shouldn't the local crossovers filter it out so the speaker doesn't see those really low frequencies?

[DER E30]

But shouldn't the local crossovers filter it out so the speaker doesn't see those really low frequencies?

Not really, "if" the crossovers work the way I think they split off the highs to the tweet and everything lower to the mid. So setting your amp to high pass mode would kill the lows and send everything above to the crossover where it does its magic...

Am I right Luke/someone else that knows?

[Cephas]

Not really, "if" the crossovers work the way I think they split off the highs to the tweet and everything lower to the mid. So setting your amp to high pass mode would kill the lows and send everything above to the crossover where it does its magic...

Am I right Luke/someone else that knows?

Looking at this and thinking it through...it would seem to me that the tweeter is crossed over at 6khz and lower. Meaning 6khz and above is passed through to it since it cannot play notes lower than that.

That would mean that the mid-woofer gets notes that are 4k and higher...unless the mid-woofer is crossed over inversely, meaning only 4k and lower is passed through to it.

I don't know for sure, but the nerd in me wants to know.


Edit:
For anyone who wants to know more than they ever thought about crossovers:

http://www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/crossover

In short, the high pass network uses capacitors and inductors to cancel out the low frequencies while the low pass network uses them (in this case only uses an inductor) to cancel out the highs. So the mid-woofer will get all frequencies passed through from 4khz and below. Looks like using the amps built in HP filter will still make sense to keep the subsonic levels from getting sent to the mid-woofer.

[StereoInstaller1]

Two things here: the most important part of using a high pass filter before the amplifier is the reduction in IM (intermodulation) distortion and the roughly 400% increase in dynamic headroom.

The speaker is just a flappy thing, people get all worked up but in reality, they just aren't that damn important. What matters is the crossovers, both active and passive. Proper filtration and level matching is what makes for great sound, first and formost.

[Rev Run D]

89 sedan with stock speakers, and aftermarket JVC head unit.

So to get good sound, I need to get 4 e34 passenger side front mid bass and 4 of the parts express tweeters, 2 pair of your crossovers and the premium speaker housings for the sail panel and the rear housings?

Am I missing anything? Where do you mount the rear local pcn's for a clean but hidden setup?

[The White Guy]

89 sedan with stock speakers, and aftermarket JVC head unit.

So to get good sound, I need to get 4 e34 passenger side front mid bass and 4 of the parts express tweeters, 2 pair of your crossovers and the premium speaker housings for the sail panel and the rear housings?

Am I missing anything? Where do you mount the rear local pcn's for a clean but hidden setup?

You need a 5 channel amplifier, GAS E3010 "Lukebox" sub enclosure, 10" woofer for the enclosure and also rear premium speaker housings are needed to house the extra rear tweeters.
I mounted my PCNs on the rear parcel shelf as shown in picture...Plenty of room.
Thanks, Stan

http://www.germanaudiospecialties.com/store/p85/E30_Single_10%22_Enclosure.html

[crzylildude]

Sorry to ask this… but whats the difference in performance between your LPCN and your CPCN…? (besides the price) please explain further….

[StereoInstaller1]

Sorry to ask this… but whats the difference in performance between your LPCN and your CPCN…? (besides the price) please explain further….

Ill try, but the difference is the midrange crossover. The Classic has better power handling, and a slightly more laid back sound.

Keep in mind, we are talking like a 5% difference here, it's not at all "night and day" and having heard 2 cars that were otherwise identical, very few people could spot the difference sonically.

The E30 is absolutely bizarre in its positioning, with the mid down so low in a tiny space and the tweeter way up high, roughly 24 inches away.

Every installer who has half a clue about how music is supposed to sound will tell you that all 8 speaker BMWs are about the worst car out there to get good sound in if the factory positions are used, it's been an issue in shops all around the world, thats why we developed these.

What we did here is to minimize the tweeters output with a higher than normal crossover point so the "soundstage" wouldn't be so localized as they are with typical crossover points, and cut the mid off a little lower, to minimize the "glare" that typical car audio speakers have in the E30.

When you listen to our systems with your ear by the tweeter, it almost seems like it isn't putting anything out, its just because its a very high crossover point, but when listening in the normal seating position, there is no shortage of highs, it's quite accurate.

Let me point out that to get a car audio speaker that even has a low pass is rare, most just pass the signal through, even if they have connections. It's a dirty trick, make one think that the crossover actually controls the mid, but it doesn't. This cheeseball hackery is found even in high dollar stuff, because they sound just great in an F150 or a Camry or whatever typical car. Crossover parts like the other manufacturers use are pretty cheap, but more profit is more, right?

So, hopefully that helps, but at this point we have 2 sets of LPCNs left, and we are very likely to close the doors in a few weeks here, so its quite possible the only source will be the used market, unfortunately.

I don't think too many people would be willing to give theirs up.

Luke

[TimeMachinE30]

Ill try, but the difference is the midrange crossover. The Classic has better power handling, and a slightly more laid back sound.

Keep in mind, we are talking like a 5% difference here, it's not at all "night and day" and having heard 2 cars that were otherwise identical, very few people could spot the difference sonically.

The E30 is absolutely bizarre in its positioning, with the mid down so low in a tiny space and the tweeter way up high, roughly 24 inches away.

Every installer who has half a clue about how music is supposed to sound will tell you that all 8 speaker BMWs are about the worst car out there to get good sound in if the factory positions are used, it's been an issue in shops all around the world, thats why we developed these.

What we did here is to minimize the tweeters output with a higher than normal crossover point so the "soundstage" wouldn't be so localized as they are with typical crossover points, and cut the mid off a little lower, to minimize the "glare" that typical car audio speakers have in the E30.

When you listen to our systems with your ear by the tweeter, it almost seems like it isn't putting anything out, its just because its a very high crossover point, but when listening in the normal seating position, there is no shortage of highs, it's quite accurate.

Let me point out that to get a car audio speaker that even has a low pass is rare, most just pass the signal through, even if they have connections. It's a dirty trick, make one think that the crossover actually controls the mid, but it doesn't. This cheeseball hackery is found even in high dollar stuff, because they sound just great in an F150 or a Camry or whatever typical car. Crossover parts like the other manufacturers use are pretty cheap, but more profit is more, right?

So, hopefully that helps, but at this point we have 2 sets of LPCNs left, and we are very likely to close the doors in a few weeks here, so its quite possible the only source will be the used market, unfortunately.

I don't think too many people would be willing to give theirs up.

Luke

You're back.

[crzylildude]

Thanks for your help… but what do you mean closing doors?… are you stopping production on the PCNs?! nooooooo!