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Killer Vert Install with PCN (Pic Heavy!)

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    Killer Vert Install with PCN (Pic Heavy!)

    Wanted to share an install with all you 'Vert fans, but this is also applicable to all E30s.

    In fact, this is how we do E30, E28, E24, E21..shortly here, an E10 too.

    The car is a very clean fresh-from-the-paint-booth beauty, shown here under construction:



    Many thinks to our client, Haris for his excellent hosting and trusting us with his car.

    So, first thing we did was tear apart the car. This means the left side of the dash, the rear seats, side panels, trim panels and kick panels. Basically everything but the seats, center console and glovebox.

    Of course, this also means stripping the trunk and performing a whole bunch of work inside the space between the trunk and the back seat. If you have not read the install tutorial on our E3028 boxes, it is both incredibly difficult and vitally important to the performance of the system, so getting into the job is crucial. Here is Justin doing work:



    You can see all of the cutting in the trunk has been done, the port tube holes are also cut and the ports test fitted. This process is critical to performance, as is proper mounting of the subwoofer enclosure.

    Basically, what is happening here is the cavity is being used as a tuned part of the speaker enclosure, that is why it is so crucial to get it right:



    If you have skills and patience, when you are done running wires, cutting holes and applying the sound deadning material, your trunk will look like this:



    Those of you with a sharp eye will detect a bundle of 4 white cables on the left...well, that is our speaker wiring for this project.

    Let me introduce the German Audio Specialties 8 Channel Passive Crossover Network, shown by the lovely and charming Amber Alvarez.




    She really is a charming girl, I hope she has a great career.


    What we have done is develop a crossover network intended to use all new wiring, which we supply as part of the kit. The wiring is actually intended for "in wall" use, and is a CL2 rated 16ga 4 conductor high quality wire.

    Since all of the filtering of the signal for each speaker is done in the trunk, running all new wire is a necessity. We used the stock wire routes as we do in all BMW installs. Here are some progress examples.

    RCAs and Speaker Wires (normally would have sub level control cable too, but not on this install):



    Note the three pair of RCAs



    and the speaker plugs from the GAS crossover harness:



    inside the car, they should be all tidy too:



    Note length of speaker wire from stock location:



    Tidy RCA routing prevents damage and is always noise free. Of course, the stock grommets are always installed properly, this one just had not been done at this point:



    One thing we always seem to forget to take pictures of is the wire routing from the front of the car. We basically take the time to take apart the stock wire retainers and use the wire channels as provided by BMW. Its tedious and doesn't show much, but just do a tidy job and run them right with the factory wire.

    Yes, that means pulling up that stupid plastic wire protector and routing them just like BMW does. Don't be lazy, do a good job...and take some pics!

    Since we also forgot to take pictures of the wire before being stripped, it has a heavy white insulation intended for protection. Each "corner" of the car gets its wire routed, then stripped and twisted. We will be posting a video on how to do it, but is it very simple: carefully cut the insulation jacket back about a foot, separate the wires, cut the thread (supposed to be used to take the jacket off, I dunno) and twist the wires into 2 pairs consisting of Red and Black plus White and Green, as shown.

    Crimp the supplied terminals to the red and black pair. Use a 1/8" for the Black and a 3/16" for the Red:



    Next, connect the factory tweeter wire to the new wire you just installed.

    Currently we are discussing changing our standard wiring to match the BMW color code, but for now the Green goes to the Gray/Yellow and the White connects to Gray/Green. Check your wiring diagram to make sure, you will be able to tell from the plugs which is correct.

    Use small butt connectors here:



    That is all of the front speaker wiring. The front midbass driver we used is from the E34 chassis. They are a perfect fit, of course, as they are OE, and quite "burly". They are physically larger than the Infinity Reference, and due to their being engineered to work in the tiny cavity of a BMW rather than the door panel of a chevy truck, they have a far better bottom end than any aftermarket speaker regardless of price. I have installed everything from Diamonds to Infinity to el-cheap-o walmart junk to top end Focals, Quarts, GTi Series JBL and Morel, these have a better bottom end than any of them. Here is an E34 midbass driver next to an Infinity Reference:



    Basically, this is about as good as it gets if using the stock location is the goal. They are top notch and can still be had brand-new.

    Now, lets talk about tweeters. Believe it or not, the ideal tweeter for this application is the stock late model E34 tweeter. Blending it to the E34 midrange was a perfect match, the performance is amazing.

    In an effort to produce the cleanest midrange we could we wanted to use a 12db/oct low-pass filter on the midrange. BMW uses a 6db/oct filter at 4Khz on its Premuim Sound package, we found that exact same crossover point was perfect (and use it in our "Local" crossover with a different tweeter) but that we had a little more "presence" when we used a 12db/oct low pass at 5Khz. In effect, this raises the midrange about 3db at 4500Hz, making a minor difference in the frequency response, but quite a jump in sound quality, but you pay the price with less overall efficiency. We had to find a less efficient tweeter with a smooth response that fit in the E30 housing, so the late E34 tweeter is it.

    Just so we are clear, the late E34 tweeter is a very good quality neodymium magnet 1" Silk soft dome. It is well damped, has great power handling and a very smooth top end.

    I am not going to get into much more of this, but if anyone has tech questions feel free to post them. Yes, I know this isn't what everyone else says, but I have installed all of those and I was always dissatisfied with the end results. This was designed, tuned and built for this exact car and I find it very satisfying to listen to.

    So, the midbass in the front fit and look just like stock. Tie up your stock speaker wires (you will not need them on this install) and put the midbass driver in (remember to use three screws!) and now the tweeters.

    When you pop off the tweeter, you should see the orange sticker. I used a small "spoon" tool to pop the tweeter out including its outer casing, like this:





    If you don't have good condition foam, the sound will be roughly 3db brighter from about 6Khz and up. if you find yourself turning up the treble you may wish to remove it, but generally I recommend keeping it.



    Glue the E34 tweeter in using a high-grade crazy glue or silicone, whatever is good and re-install the sail panel as stock. Installing the front tweeters is the easiest part of the whole job, 20 minutes max.





    Since the fronts are now complete, lets move to the rear.

    The rear midranges are also the E34 speaker. Simply connect the red and black wires and you are done, just as the fronts.

    However, installing tweeeters in the rear is a different story.

    What we did was use the stock rear E34 housing. The one shown here has a broken tab, sorry about that, but no matter, we cut the tabs off anyway.



    The principle is this: First, solder wires on the tweeter, cut a hole in the plastic frame, glue the tweeter in, drill a hole (we did a notch, oops) to run the wires through, connect the wires and boom, you are done. Install as normal, except for tucking the wires in.





    Justin used Snap On flush cut for this part, they worked well



    We used a front tweeter to make sure it fit, then glued the rears in using a high grade crazy glue. Here is a shot of the several dots of crazy glue holding in the rear tweeters:



    Rear tweeters almost done, the housing creates a slight bump on the side panel grille:



    Here is the left rear going together, it is a tight fit, but it clears. Some black shrink tubing was added to the green and white wires to not be seen through the grille.





    As you can see, the look is not quite stock, but very clean and simple.

    Of course, the sound from the tweeters is slightly affected, but as the stock system has no tweeters in the back at all, this is a huge improvement.

    Now, back to the trunk.

    We installed a pair of Infinity Reference 860W woofers in our "V2" vert box.





    Its a fairly simple thing to install a pair of woofers in a box, we did not get pictures, sorry...but once we put this into the trunk and bolted it down, it was time to assemble things.

    So, for those that have not caught on, this is a really unusual design. it is extremely critical to screw the box in place. There is a 1/2" thick layer of closed cell foam under the upholstery. If you have done a thorough job of cutting the ports and the rear wall, the face of the box seals quite effectively against the bulkhead.

    If you do a thorough job of sealing the inside of that compartment including the top, both sides and all potential air leaks (we use a flashlight, it really helps) are closed up, you can put the trunk liner back together and bolt the box in using the supplied 2" drywall screws. Make sure to get all 4 screws tightly through the bulkhead into the box.

    If your box is not screwed down, you are screwing yourself!

    So now, we will get the amp rack, crossover and amplifiers installed.

    We are using an Alpine 4 channel to power the interior speakers through our crossover and a JL 1000.1 to power the subs. We ran a single 4GA to a distribution block. Unfortunately, we did not have enough black wire, so we used blue wire and appropriate boots:



    Let me tell you right now, there is no need to use a separate amp for bass. We used this pair because Haris already had them, so we were looking to conserve money. Looking back, I wish we had convinced him to use a standard 5 channel! An Alpine PDX5 or an Infinity Kappa5 would be a much better choice IMO.

    So, the last phase of the install is the face of the amp rack, and building a mount for the JL. Essentially, building this mount took us an entire day, that is another reason we would highly recommend using a 5 channel.



    As you can see here, the amp is mounted to an upholstered MDF panel. It is quite sturdy!



    We used some scrap material and some thick posterboard to make a curved panel, just for looks. The long-term plan is to have a second battery here, then something nicer could be made.



    So, the face of the amp rack is the last thing to do. By this time we had been in this car for 3 solid days and were beat, so we didn't take a lot of pictures...but it sure came out pretty!








    Closing SOON!
    "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

    Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

    Thanks for 10 years of fun!

    #2
    😳 another awesome install luke
    You have. A great crew


    OO ||| OO + O w O + 😳

    Comment


      #3
      One day I'm gonna graduate from college and have a lot of money and I'm gonna drive up to WA and have you cut my trunk space in half. Looks great.
      The first car I ever rode in was an e30

      Originally posted by Cabriolet
      Wish you the best and hope you don't remember anything after 10pm.
      1992 Mauritiusblau Vert
      1991 Brillantrot Vert

      2002 540i/6 Black/Black
      2003 GSX-R 750

      Comment


        #4
        Killer install indeed! :up:

        COTM

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Vivek View Post
          One day I'm gonna graduate from college and have a lot of money and I'm gonna drive up to WA and have you cut my trunk space in half. Looks great.
          No way...do it your damn self! We will be happy to help, but everything we do is built for DIY. We are actually talking about opening a BMW only install facility, but this really is something almost anyone can do.

          Originally posted by e30blitz View Post
          😳 another awesome install luke
          You have. A great crew


          OO ||| OO + O w O + 😳
          Thanks! Two guys isn't much of a crew, but we do try our damndest! Your location says PNW, any chance you will be at 5erWest this Saturday or GASFest this August 10? If so, my car is never hard to find (just follow your ears) so come take a listen.


          Originally posted by N2MYE30 View Post
          Killer install indeed! :up:
          Thanks!

          I just wish it were possible for everyone to hear this thing. We played all kinds of music during tuning, from Jazz and Blues to Zydeco, even a little Country.

          While we were doing the final tuning, we were kicking some Tech N9ne for some big boom (oh man..."The Beast" LOL) and then we played "Caress Me Down" by Sublime. The performance was absolutely amazing...loud, clean, clear, absolutely stunning for any audio system, but especially in a car with no roof. The intensity of bass in this particular system is amazing by any standard, but knowing it was $100 worth of woofers in a $200 box made it all the better.

          Oh hey, almost forgot to mention: for those that are curious, the box itself is on sale right now, it's $189 SHIPPED! We have a few built and ready to go, too. All you need to do is go to our site and look for the E308 V2 "Big Boy", click the buy it now button and we will get it off to you ASAP!

          http://www.germanaudiospecialties.co...2-big-boy.html

          Thanks for the kind words, fellas!

          Luke

          Closing SOON!
          "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

          Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

          Thanks for 10 years of fun!

          Comment


            #6
            The e34 magnet looks pretty big. These fit the rear without any issues?
            "I'd probably take the E30 M3 in this case just because I love that little car, and how tanky that inline 6 is." - thecj

            85 323i M TECH 1 S52 - ALPINEWEISS/SCHWARZE
            88 M3 - LACHSSILBER/SCHWARZE
            89 M3 - ALPINEWEISS II/M TECH CLOTH-ALCANTARA
            91 M TECHNIC CABRIO TURBO - MACAOBLAU/M TECH CLOTH-LEATHER

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by reelizmpro View Post
              The e34 magnet looks pretty big. These fit the rear without any issues?
              On a 'vert? Nope, front only

              Closing SOON!
              "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

              Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

              Thanks for 10 years of fun!

              Comment


                #8
                Group buy possibility?
                Seriously, this is great, will be copying this when it's time for that part of the car... Thank you for sharing!
                sigpic
                Streetable poly mounts, trans mounts are here!
                http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/show...ght=streetable
                '94 318i
                '07 335i
                '11 X5
                '89 325ic m30b35

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by G-Man the Visionary View Post
                  Group buy possibility?
                  Seriously, this is great, will be copying this when it's time for that part of the car... Thank you for sharing!
                  Hey Gman, thanks for the kind words!

                  We don't do group buys, but this is a normal special order item for us. Typically, once a paid order has been placed it is about 3 weeks until shipping.

                  The box and amp rack are in stock now.

                  Closing SOON!
                  "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

                  Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

                  Thanks for 10 years of fun!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Several things...

                    First off, I see that you went with the e34 tweeters over the Parts Express-sourced Dayton ND25FN-4 tweeters that you had discussed in the "premium sound upgrade feeler" thread. Any particular reason for that?

                    Next, regarding the midranges in the rear, I am a little confused...

                    You made this statement about the rear use of the e34 midranges:

                    Originally posted by StereoInstaller1 View Post
                    Originally posted by reelizmpro View Post
                    The e34 magnet looks pretty big. These fit the rear without any issues?
                    On a 'vert? Nope, front only
                    But in Post #1, you stated this:

                    Originally posted by StereoInstaller1 View Post
                    Since the fronts are now complete, lets move to the rear.

                    The rear midranges are also the E34 speaker. Simply connect the red and black wires and you are done, just as the fronts.

                    However, installing tweeters in the rear is a different story.
                    So you said that they don't work but that you used them. I know that you and I had discussed a different rear driver, which matches up with what you stated to reelizmpro but it looks like you did use the e34 drivers in the rear.

                    Can you shed some light on the rear drivers? Are they stock e34 REAR drivers? If so, do you have P/Ns for those?

                    So all that said, since I already have the Dayton ND140-4 midranges and the e34 midranges seem to be back in stock, would it make sense to get a set of the e34 midranges for the front and use the Dayton ND140-4 set in the rear location with either e34 or ND25FN-4 tweeters?

                    Thanks!
                    Patrick Henry

                    1989 325iC build: http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=316880


                    Comment


                      #11
                      OK, I understand the confusion....the front E34 drivers will not fit in the back of an E30 vert. The rear E34 drivers do fit, that is what is used in this application.

                      Comparing the LPCN to the CPCN there is one significant difference: the LPCN uses a 6db/oct low pass on the midwoofer while the "Classic" uses a full 12db/oct crossover.

                      Both use the same filter for the tweeter. Both tweeters are acceptable, and the E34 tweeter can also be used if a less "bright" sound is desired.

                      Both tweeters sound almost identical, with the Dayton being far more efficient and much "brighter" overall.

                      Personally, with the midwoofer having less efficiency on the CPCN (its about 3db BTW) the E34 tweeter is a better match, but if you are one of those "crank the treble" types, the Dayton may be a better option.

                      EDIT: this is also part of the grand plan...we want to offer choices so if anyone is unhappy, they can swap parts out to get the tonal balance they prefer

                      Closing SOON!
                      "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

                      Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

                      Thanks for 10 years of fun!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Sorry for bumping an old thread guys. So the summary for this build was using an entire e34 system (2 fronts, 2 rears, 2 tweets) and putting them in a vert correct?

                        How would the sound quality be without the sub and crossovers? Im just looking for a good cheap replacement of my blown vert system.
                        Worlds 1st LS powered e30 cabby.
                        Cab
                        billac: 92 LagunengrĂ¼n cabriolet + cadillac LQ9 + Nitrous + rotiform SJC

                        Raphael: 88 LagunengrĂ¼n IX + Hella 500's + Red ACS type 1's

                        Shaggin Wagon
                        : 01 325xiT 5 speed


                        91 MR2 GT3076TS + E85 = 505whp + antilag = wheelies
                        88 CRX OEM+ 42mpg DD.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          You must use some form of crossovers with the E34 speakers. You can build them pretty inexpensively, or use our "budget" local setup, or, do the big sexy version, it's up to you.

                          Closing SOON!
                          "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

                          Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

                          Thanks for 10 years of fun!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Where do you get that awesome BMW style twisted pair speaker wire?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by august125 View Post
                              Where do you get that awesome BMW style twisted pair speaker wire?
                              That is CL3 rated 16/4 cable, the twist is from chucking it up in a cordless drill!

                              Closing SOON!
                              "LAST CHANCE FOR G.A.S." DEAL IS ON NOW

                              Luke AT germanaudiospecialties DOT com or text 425-761-6450, or for quickest answers, call me at the shop 360-669-0398

                              Thanks for 10 years of fun!

                              Comment

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