Originally posted by BoxDriver86
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ETA won't idle, runs awful. **Video pg.2** FIXED
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Originally posted by timninja View Posthave you checked fuel injection/delivery system?
Whoops re-read it sorry,did you check your injector o-rings too?
Originally posted by dnguyen1963 View PostHey, we are all proud of our cars. Don't be offended, but expect to get responses from forum members when you post things in your signature. Back to the technical issue, you should nail down the source of that whistle at high rpm. Did the shop plug up the exhaust when they perform the smoke test? Smoke test should be performed at 2-4 psi with the exhaust closed. Small leak can cause all kinds of problems. Good luck.
To be honest I am not sure if he plugged the exhaust or not. Are you saying that an exhaust leak could cause this? I have not replaced my exhaust manifold gaskets yet and may have a small leak after the cat.
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The point of plugging the exhaust when doing a smoke test is to allow a smoke pressure of 2-4psi to be reached and held. That is necessary so that smoke will work it's way to any and all leaks. If the exhaust wasn't plugged or smoke pressure not held for a while there could be leaks that the test didn't find.The car makes it possible, but the driver makes it happen.
Jim Levie, Huntsville, AL
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I called the shop, he claims he did plug the exhaust when he ran the test.
I hate to be the guy who just throws parts at a car, but I am going to go ahead and get a new CTS. I keep testing it with different results and since the car idles better with it unplugged I am going to at least try.
I know for fact that I haven't replaced it in 150K miles of ownership. I think it's one of the few things I haven't replaced to be honest.
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Replaced CTS this evening, along with a coolant flush. Went through every possible point of the car where there could be a vacuum leak and all checks out visually and with carb cleaner, and a second smoke test. Vacuum is in spec, fuel pressure is in spec, every single Bentley test run and all looks good. I will try to snap a video tomorrow to see if there are any last ditch ideas based on what others see.
Looks more and more like my e30 days are over...so freaking bummed.
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New Idle Control Valve. At least borrow one from a working car. Cleaning often will ruin them.Mine tested good once but was bad. New valve fixed problem.
There also is an idle control unit. A small green or grey unit located next to the computer in the glove box.
Put a hose to your ear to find the whistle.Last edited by bddog; 07-01-2012, 10:15 AM.
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Originally posted by bddog View PostNew Idle Control Valve. At least borrow one from a working car. Cleaning often will ruin them.Mine tested good once but was bad. New valve fixed problem.
There also is an idle control unit. A small green or grey unit located next to the computer in the glove box.
Put a hose to your ear to find the whistle.
When I hooked the ICV up to 12V, the plunger went nuts going back and forth like a piston. According to the Bentley, it is just supposed to move once and stay. I'm guessing I jacked it up when I cleaned it.
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I had this isssue plus more. Engine would warm up then idle would fluctuate or just stop when warm. The final phase over 3 months was over-fueling - black smoke pouring out of the tailpipe and dropping 2 cylinders.
I checked everything to no avail FIC, vac hoses etc, took it to my mechanic (BMW specialist who races E30s) who immediately plugged in another ECU and watched everything smooth out to run beautifully. He'd seen it before. I'm not saying it's your E30s issue, but maybe try borrowing one just to rule it out.'90 BMW E30 318is
'99 Honda DC2R
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Originally posted by Pete_E30 View Post
I checked everything to no avail FIC, vac hoses etc, took it to my mechanic (BMW specialist who races E30s) who immediately plugged in another ECU and watched everything smooth out to run beautifully. He'd seen it before. I'm not saying it's your E30s issue, but maybe try borrowing one just to rule it out.
Originally posted by 5Toes View PostPlug wires in correct order? Coil okay???
Fuel injectors alright? Pull the rail and crank the car and see if they squirt okay
Originally posted by Cronopoulos View PostI assume this was running good previously? What changed?
Check your CPS, try a different DME if you have access to one.
The car has been running great for a while now. I had a grounding issue that required a new battery ground that initially took the car off the road. It was taking forever to start and occasionally wouldn't spin the starter. On the way home from work two weeks ago, I stopped at a red light and it just stalled out with the clutch in. I figured it was attributed to my ground issue and wrote it off. I decided to clean my ICV and things just got worse after that. My spare ICV was a 3 wire so I had to order a new one (none in the junkyards locally). It's supposed to be here tonight so I will post back if that works.
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Start at the top of what follows and work through to the bottom. Don't skip anything.
Idle or hard starting problems are most commonly caused by intake leaks and/or
a sticky or defective Idle Control Valve (ICV). The only reliable method of
locating intake leaks is to have a smoke test run on the intake and crank case
and to test the brake booster with a gage and vacuum pump. The complete list
of possible causes of an intake leak is:
Intake boot
Throttle body gasket
ICV hoses & connections
Brake booster, hoses, and connections
Crank case breather hose
Evaporative control hoses, valve, and expansion tank
Fuel pressure regulator & hose
Injector seals
Valve cover gaskets & bungs
Oil filler cap
Dip stick o-rings
Oil return tube o-rings
While leaks in some of those can be found by inspection or by spraying carb
cleaner on suspect areas, not finding leaks that way doesn't eliminate the
possibility. Only a smoke test will really work.
Once the possibility of intake leaks is eliminated, the ICV needs to be
removed and cleaned with carb cleaner until the vane inside moves freely. When
the ignition is switched on you should be able to feel vibration from the
ICV. If no vibration the ICV is bad, there's a problem with its wiring or
connector, there's a problem with the TPS, or the DME (or Idle Control Module
(ICM) on an ETA car) is faulty.
For the DME (or ICM) to control idle, the idle switch in the TPS must work
correctly. The switch should close when the throttle stop is 0.030-0.060" off
the idle stop screw.
The fuel system should be tested via the suite of tests in the Bentley manual
as invalid rail pressure can be a contributor to idle and starting problems. A
simple injector check is to pull the injectors, jumper the fuel relay to run
the pump, and see if the injectors are leaking. You can also point the
injectors into a towel, remove the coil wire, and crank the engine to see if
all of the injectors appear to be spraying in a similar fashion. The best
approach to possible injector problems is to have the injectors cleaned and
flow tested. Since raw fuel can or will be released in these tests, have a
fire extinguisher handy.
While a bad check valve in the high pressure pump can result in longer than
normal cranking, if the fuel system is working as it is supposed to the rail
will reach normal pressure in a few turns of the engine. A weak pump, clogged
filter or leaking FPR in conjunction with a failed check valve can result in
longer cranking.
The O2 sensor can be a contributor to idle problems. The O2 sensor is a
scheduled maintenance item with a useful life of no more than 100k. If the
sensor has that mileage or more (or is of unknown age), replace it.
The AFM can be a contributor. If the vane doesn't move freely or the
resistance track is worn the DME may be receiving invalid data from the
AFM. And if someone has fiddled with the bypass air adjustment the DME may be
unable to stabilize idle. The bypass air adjustment should only be adjusted
per the procedure in the Bentley and with an exhaust gas analyzer. And even
then everything else associated with engine management has to first be
operating properly. If the AFM becomes a suspect, replacement with a good used
unit is the best approach.
Improperly adjusted or malfunctioning valves will affect idle and starting. As
can compression issues from ring or cylinder wear. A valve adjustment is
called for every 15k. A useful diagnostic is to run compression (dry and wet)
and leak down tests on the engine. Aged ignition wires, plugs, distributor
cap, or rotor can cause problems. Insulation does break down with time and
heat. And since the youngest E30 is going on 20 years old, if the ignition
system is original or the plugs are old replacement is indicated.
Although not usually a problem, a bad DME temp sensor is a possibility. That
generally won't cause an unstable idle, but can cause hard cold or hard hot
starts and/or a rough idle. As can problems with the timing reference
sensors. Although not commonly encountered, a bad harmonic balancer on an
M20B25 or M30 engine will cause problems.
When all other possibilities have been eliminated and idle or starting
problems persist, replacement of the DME, or if applicable the ICM, is
indicated.The car makes it possible, but the driver makes it happen.
Jim Levie, Huntsville, AL
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Jlevie, I actually found the catch-all you posted a few weeks ago when this started. I'll go back through it this weekend.
Bddog, I understood what you were saying. I had just ordered an ICV out of a desperation move since the old one wasn't in spec.
Honestly folks, I think this is a wiring issue. I'm going to do a little digging around and see if I can find a clean E car wiring harness and ICM. I just need to find a junkyard with an eta...
**If anyone has an eta ICM they don't need, please let me know. There are no e cars in the junkyards in my immediate area. Thanks!**Last edited by BoxDriver86; 07-06-2012, 06:28 AM.
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