The 5 lug swap truth thread!!!!!!!!!!

[Jason89i]

I posted that as a joke because you posted earlier that as a tech.... I should know, anyway.. enough of that.

Better yet, please prove to me that there is a difference in the caster with the M3 kingpin. If the CASTER was different due to that piece, there would be no difference in the control arms or lollipops , please show me how you have this info.

not trying to be argumentative here. just trying to get a solution for you. if your here to whine and complain, i can easily ignore..... i apologize for interrupting your rant.

if your looking for a solution or info from someone with a little experience........

i had great success w/ e36 5-lug 6+ years ago. Tracked the car heavily.

from memory.....
non-m e36 front kings
castor was 9.8, then modified to 9.0.
wheel was perfectly centered in e30 (non-m) arch. running 235/40/17 stickies w/o rubbing.


as far as knuckle differences.....

it appears the e36 kingpin is located to decrease castor.
stolen from somewhere here on the web. (ignore measurements shown.) notice location of lower ca mount vs hub center. looks to be about 10mm of difference.
i mis-spoke..... while there is a difference, the e36m appears to create greater castor.



please post some pics of what you've got.
interested to see your castor specs. easiest way to fix castor is on the top side. my first time, i modified e36m upper bearing caps.


j

[psyber_0ptix]

Honestly didn't mean it to sound as harsh as it did (for which i apologize). By tricked i should have used "sucked into" as you had stated.

I currently do not have pictures of the inner wheel-wells, I will be able to provide them this September when I'm done with my Praktikum and back stateside.

[mikeedler]

no need for name calling. never said i was tricked either.
over 3 years ago when I put this all together there was no site to go to either for info. well, if your car is handling good at the 60 mph your driving-- great.
can you post a few side pics of your front wheelwells?

[psyber_0ptix]

i"m sorry you didn't know the correct parts to get the first time around. I didn't have to hammer anything out and my wheel sits perfectly where it should. I only invested about $800 into my entire 5 lug and e36m3 front conversion.


i dug up a link you might want to read through

http://www.extradrei.com/5lug.html

***I originally used standard e36 spindles and brakes, but caster just does not work out. Wheel sits too far back and very often rubs. However, you may use standard e36 spindles and brakes, I did for a good number of months, but you HAVE to figure out caster. I used camber plates to fix caster just enough to reduce rub. Personally, if you're going through this conversion, do it right the first time

Servus

[mikeedler]

the 96+ e36 m3 kingpins/knuckles are indeed different and are needed to do this properly. Give it a shot before you claim it won't work. what can you base your 100% assurance on?

right, I am going to spend another 500 at least on a set-up that I already know fits like crap.

I am 100% sure of this because AFTER BEATING my firewall(innerwheelwells) 8" inward with a sledgehammer to fit 205/40/17 tires-- no kingpin in the world is going to sit my wheels the needed min. of 3 " further forward.

you guys are WRONG to try to argue that this is a good set-up and this is what I am trying to get across, it sux and should be said. I got sucked int dropping a min. of 1500 dollars into crap that you guys are telling everyone is good. it doesnt fit and doesnt even drive good.

maybe, just maybe the M3 kingpins will make a bit of difference, but a real tire size on a lowered car it still is crappy geometry and will still rub like crazy.

[mikeedler]

no credentials needed.


your still wrong. there is indeed geometry differences between the e36 and e36m kingpins.

cheers, jason

I posted that as a joke because you posted earlier that as a tech.... I should know, anyway.. enough of that.

Better yet, please prove to me that there is a difference in the caster with the M3 kingpin. If the CASTER was different due to that piece, there would be no difference in the control arms or lollipops , please show me how you have this info.

[psyber_0ptix]

So glad I dont have to deal with any of this. E30 m3 bits, ftw.

This is definitely the most performance effective route, its lighter and offers perfect braking balance. It just sucks that these are golden parts.

[Jason89i]

as a tech,

no credentials needed. it is ok to come here and post opinions. just dont spread mis-information under the title "im a bmw tech."

AND I am 100% sure the kingpin will NOT change the incorrect caster it is just larger bearings.

your still wrong. there is indeed geometry differences between the e36 and e36m kingpins.

cheers, jason

[Stephen]

seems like alot of work and hassle to have a shitty wheel selection

[Van Westervelt]

So glad I dont have to deal with any of this. E30 m3 bits, ftw.

[psyber_0ptix]

as a tech, I stated I am not happy with the specs of the rear toe, but it is still within BMW's specs.
and what are the correct knuckles to use? as from what I have searched, except for M from a 318 to a 328, they are all the same. AND I am 100% sure the kingpin will NOT change the incorrect caster it is just larger bearings.

So once again, its a crappy setup that is not correct and still handles like crap. the car drove for over 20 years with that rear axle and it wasn't darty.

the 96+ e36 m3 kingpins/knuckles are indeed different and are needed to do this properly. Give it a shot before you claim it won't work. what can you base your 100% assurance on?

[mikeedler]

before you go start saying "5 lug sucks" blah blah blah.... fix your rear toe. anything close to positive rear toe will make the car EXTREMELY darty at high speeds.

as a bmw tech, you should know this.



It looks like you used the e36-325i king pins........and i bet your caster is +/- 9.8 . Might consider using the right kingpins.

cheers, jason

as a tech, I stated I am not happy with the specs of the rear toe, but it is still within BMW's specs.
and what are the correct knuckles to use? as from what I have searched, except for M from a 318 to a 328, they are all the same. AND I am 100% sure the kingpin will NOT change the incorrect caster it is just larger bearings.

So once again, its a crappy setup that is not correct and still handles like crap. the car drove for over 20 years with that rear axle and it wasn't darty.

[Jason89i]

d......
here is what I have........

L/R camber -1°54´ R/R -2°18´
toe (crapy but cant do anything 0°12´ -0°18´
...............

before you go start saying "5 lug sucks" blah blah blah.... fix your rear toe. anything close to positive rear toe will make the car EXTREMELY darty at high speeds.

as a bmw tech, you should know this.

I have been driving my 5 lug swap car for a few weeks now .....
front-- e36 coilovers (raceland)
non M brakes
97 &up control arms
E30 M3 lollipops
E36 steeringrack


wheels are 17x8 style 5 BBS e34 fittment ET 20 somrthin.

It looks like you used the e36-325i king pins........and i bet your caster is +/- 9.8 . Might consider using the right kingpins.

cheers, jason

[etxxz]

LR? I have a rear subframe at the sandblaster that will be recieving the adj. crap whenever it gets back to get the rear to reasonable specs.

Everything EVERYTHING on my front end is BRANDNEW original BMW components including the brakes front and rear. I am running coilovers too, but am already VERY low.

your rear specs look good. the e30 trailing arms have this geometry such that the camber changes A LOT as it compresses. so if you lower your e30 is the same as compression you get camber. lower one, or raise the other. that's what coilovers are for ; /

[DTM190]

So the M3 e30 setup would be the way to go for a 5 lug swap, right?

Are there any issues?

Finding the parts at a reasonable price is the main hurdle.