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The 5 lug swap truth thread!!!!!!!!!!

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    #31
    no need for name calling. never said i was tricked either.
    over 3 years ago when I put this all together there was no site to go to either for info. well, if your car is handling good at the 60 mph your driving-- great.
    can you post a few side pics of your front wheelwells?

    Comment


      #32
      Honestly didn't mean it to sound as harsh as it did (for which i apologize). By tricked i should have used "sucked into" as you had stated.

      I currently do not have pictures of the inner wheel-wells, I will be able to provide them this September when I'm done with my Praktikum and back stateside.
      Last edited by psyber_0ptix; 06-08-2011, 03:37 PM.
      Originally posted by FredK
      However, in your absence, I will likely sit in your seat buck naked while making racecar noises as if I were maxing your E30 out on the Mulsanne Straight while allowing the perforated vinyl to soak up my butt sweat (going 200 mph does that to you).

      My year in Germany
      Feedback

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        #33
        Originally posted by mikeedler View Post
        I posted that as a joke because you posted earlier that as a tech.... I should know, anyway.. enough of that.

        Better yet, please prove to me that there is a difference in the caster with the M3 kingpin. If the CASTER was different due to that piece, there would be no difference in the control arms or lollipops , please show me how you have this info.
        not trying to be argumentative here. just trying to get a solution for you. if your here to whine and complain, i can easily ignore..... i apologize for interrupting your rant.

        if your looking for a solution or info from someone with a little experience........

        i had great success w/ e36 5-lug 6+ years ago. Tracked the car heavily.

        from memory.....
        non-m e36 front kings
        castor was 9.8, then modified to 9.0.
        wheel was perfectly centered in e30 (non-m) arch. running 235/40/17 stickies w/o rubbing.


        as far as knuckle differences.....

        it appears the e36 kingpin is located to decrease castor.
        stolen from somewhere here on the web. (ignore measurements shown.) notice location of lower ca mount vs hub center. looks to be about 10mm of difference.
        i mis-spoke..... while there is a difference, the e36m appears to create greater castor.



        please post some pics of what you've got.
        interested to see your castor specs. easiest way to fix castor is on the top side. my first time, i modified e36m upper bearing caps.


        j
        Last edited by Jason89i; 06-09-2011, 07:07 AM.

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          #34
          Originally posted by etxxz View Post
          what do you mean?? there's a thousand ways to skin a cat ;)
          Here's an e30 M3 with the e90 (non-m3) suspension: http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2929437

          Now that's extreme.
          Originally posted by nervousmini
          Break My Wallet
          Bring My Wallet
          Bring Money With

          and the M cars are a multiplier

          regular repair Money * 3 = M3
          regular repair Money * 5 = M5
          regular repair Money * 6 = M6

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            #35
            Originally posted by psyber_0ptix View Post

            I currently do not have pictures of the inner wheel-wells.
            I was meaning side view of the car-- found your build thread- looks to be really centered






            thanks so much for the pics. Guess you are right by the looks of it. need to change my title to e36non M components.

            a solution is great. Looks like I am on the search for e36 front components......
            my main point with this thread is I have read so much misinformation over the last 3 years, that I just want people to know that what was earlier and still said that works is deadly unsafe at higher speeds. and to vent a bit about the love hate relationship I have with this car!

            I have to say though, over the last week of driving the car it is feeling alot more stable (maybe tires) but still not right at speeds above 70 mph in long curves

            Comment


              #36
              Mikeedler, yes the E36 M3 96+ knuckles are different than the non-M AND the 95s. Vorshlag went through a hell of a lot of issues getting their non-M e36 5 lug to work on their GRM car, read through their thread in the project forum. IIRC, their caster was ~15.

              The correct knuckles are $35/ea though, plus shipping: http://store.bimmerworld.com/invento...les-p1066.aspx

              good luck.
              2017 Chevrolet SS, 6MT
              95 M3/2/5 (S54 and Mk60 DSC, CARB legal, Build Thread)
              98 M3/4/5 (stock)

              Comment


                #37
                My non M knuckles are slightly forward of centre... With adjustable tubular arms

                Without them I had the same problem as Mike, I found that offset bushes, with slotted holes and drilling new holes in the strut tower would have sorted these issues out.

                Comment


                  #38
                  FYI, here is my alignment sheet... Decent caster, no?
                  Keep in mind the following:
                  -E36 M3 (1997) knuckles and brakes
                  -E36 M3 (1997) control arms
                  -E30 offset control arm bushings
                  -E30 stock front strut mounts
                  -Mild lowering on E30 325is H&R Sport springs (about 1.3" to 1.5")
                  -Bilstein sport shocks/struts (E30 rear, E36 M3 front)
                  -rear toe and camber are "odd" (a.k.a. AWESOME) for a lowered car due to weld-on camber/toe correction kit from Ireland Engineering


                  "BMW Style 32 Poster-Child"
                  HTTP://WWW.CLAVINZERO.COM/e30-5-lug
                  **(My Guide to E36 M3/Z3 1.9L 5-lug Swap)
                  **

                  Comment


                    #39
                    This thread is scaring the crap out of me, I invested tons of money into a 5 lug swap, now I am scared it will drive like crap. Haven't installed anything yet but this is what I have so far:

                    - Groundcontrol 5 lug E30 kit (adj konis f/r) with camber/caster strut plates
                    - treehouse CABs
                    - new OEM M3 96+ control arms
                    - 96+ M3 front spindles, calipers/rotors

                    rear:
                    - Z3 I6 hubs
                    - 318ti carriers
                    - E36 rear calipers
                    - Z3 I6 rotors
                    - E30 new wheel bearings

                    wheels:
                    17x7.5" ET41 style 5s or 16" RS bastardize mix/match set 8" and 9"
                    (havent decided which set to run yet)

                    I plan to install a porportioning valve, but besides for brakes, think this will drive ok?
                    www.eurowinnipeg.com
                    www.E30S38.com
                    E30 Mtec2-S38 | V10 TDI treg | E34 M5 | E39 M5 | Corrado turbo VR6

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Ive got
                      Gc E36 for E30 coils
                      97 M3 kingpins
                      97 M3 Control arms
                      Thr fcab
                      Rear is all E30 M3 stuff.

                      Wheels 17x8.5 kosie K1 with 235/40/17 all around.

                      Other then the brake ballance being off (im going to install a proportioning valve) setup is great and i do track my car aswell.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        oh well, I tried compiling as much info as possible, but you guys win...


                        I have: e36m front and e30/z3 hybrid rear. IE 25/22 sway bars, coilovers (400/550 with progressive helper shock spring). e30 m3 lollipops, SPC camber plates, RD strut bar. Working ABS, 944 brake booster, e32 master cylinder (part of m50 swap). Wheels are e38 16x7.5" ET20 with 205/50-16 tires.

                        On e36 Billies, car rode on bumpstops all the time. Made the ride unbearable. With my coilovers, my housing are 3" shorter and ride comfort (ever with 400 springs) is incredible. Love the swap, would not go back to 4 lugs. Adore brakes.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          96-99 m3 front knuckles and brakes
                          96-99 m3 control arms
                          eyeball arms
                          e36 konis
                          h&r sport
                          redrilled strut towers for 96-99 m3 strut mounts, left mount on right side and vice versa.
                          washers between strut and knuckle for tiny bit more camber

                          results?
                          wheel is pretty centered but does rub in back first, can't run 225/45/17's at this height, too tall and hits the rear of wheel well when I turn hard.
                          caster 11-12*, camber around 2*. Going to install adjusters in back and realign.



                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Aptyp View Post
                            oh well, I tried compiling as much info as possible, but you guys win...


                            I have: e36m front and e30/z3 hybrid rear. IE 25/22 sway bars, coilovers (400/550 with progressive helper shock spring). e30 m3 lollipops, SPC camber plates, RD strut bar. Working ABS, 944 brake booster, e32 master cylinder (part of m50 swap). Wheels are e38 16x7.5" ET20 with 205/50-16 tires.

                            On e36 Billies, car rode on bumpstops all the time. Made the ride unbearable. With my coilovers, my housing are 3" shorter and ride comfort (ever with 400 springs) is incredible. Love the swap, would not go back to 4 lugs. Adore brakes.
                            It was your time and effort that inspired me to carry my swap out. For which you have my gratitude.
                            Originally posted by FredK
                            However, in your absence, I will likely sit in your seat buck naked while making racecar noises as if I were maxing your E30 out on the Mulsanne Straight while allowing the perforated vinyl to soak up my butt sweat (going 200 mph does that to you).

                            My year in Germany
                            Feedback

                            Comment


                              #44
                              Guys, there's a lot of slinging going on here about how the E36 method is no good. Wrong. It just needs some decent thinking and work put in.
                              I put the suspension from my wrecked E36 into my E30, but made sure it all worked. And when it didn't I designed the one component needed to make it happen.

                              My track E30 runs the following:
                              E36 Front coil-overs, c/w 500lb springs
                              E36 M3 96+ control arms
                              E36 standard spindles
                              E36 M3 rotors and callipers
                              Adjustable camber plates
                              Control Arm Mounts of my own design
                              17 x 8 wheels with 215-45-17 tyres

                              It is perfectly stable up to 220kmh

                              Here's a pic from the side showing the wheel perfectly centered

                              And these are the Control Arm mounts that make it work:


                              I started a thread on them late last year. UUC have made them for me. Although I'm down in Australia, I have 3 sets at over there in the US for sale. They come with a spare set of Delrin bushings as well.

                              Let me know if you are interested...
                              sigpic
                              BumbleE30 M52 2.8i

                              Comment


                                #45
                                As for the brake issues between the 315mm front rotors and the smaller rears, I have a solution in the works for that as well.
                                E32 front rotors, along with E28 535i front callipers

                                sigpic
                                BumbleE30 M52 2.8i

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