M20 or M50 ?

[A_Whelan]

Hello,

Well this has been on my mind for a long time and until last night I was set with doing an m50 swap into my car. So I'm looking for advice and opinions on the two situations. And if you're a lazy reader scroll to the bottom for short version.

Background
I'm in university, have one term left and then I'll be set lose on the world. Everything I am doing will be funded through savings and working this summer, also need to share those funds with school and travel. I'm going to have around $3500 for what I need to do.

I have a 1989 325i sedan that had 268,000 km on it. Last September I drove in a hurricane, drove through a river on the road, and killed the engine. What I think happened was hydro locked it and busted a rod or piston or both, or that and more. Engine = toast. The rest of the car is in good shape, no rust, fresh paint, new brakes, rotors, few new struts, control arms, etc. The electronics inside are good, all of the windows work, heated seats, the leather is a bit cracked, etc.

Goals
1. A working car. I've owned it for 9 months and driven it for 3, it sucks.
2. Clean body painted black (currently gray). Only cost will be paint, primer, filler, etc. My uncle paints cars.
3. Low. Looking to get suspension maybe blisten and H&R setup.
4. Wheels. Want to get Borbet Type A's, 16x7 and fresh tires.
5. Clean engine bay. Taking the engine + fresh paint = obvious thing to do.

Option 1
Since I was looking at taking the engine out and replacing I thought why not get an M50 and stick in there, only a few extra parts needed and I am confident in mine (and my fathers) mechanical skill. I have a proper enclosed place to do it completed with all of the air tools I need and anything else. So I started looking up parts, prices, what's involved and worked out that the swap would run around $2000. I have to get the engine shipped to me which will be around $200 and I was expecting to pay $500-900 for an M50 + a possible Z3 or newew Getrag 260. Plus brake booster, oil pan and accessories, etc.

The problem with this option for me is that I can see unexpected problems popping up and I think if I dropped in the M50 the best option would be replacing the current 260 because it does have 260,000 km on it, might as well do it so it lasts. This adds to the costs and takes away from my list of goals such as wheels, paint, etc.

Option 2
This just popped into my head last night, maybe an M20 with a bit of refreshing and a new transmission would be better. I was happy with the power in the car before, I'm not a speed freak and I really like a good looking car. This engine would be an easier swap, cheaper and leave more money for the other goals on the list. This way I get a working car and probably everything else done. The engine bay would be really clean and get the car a bit low and wheels.

The only downside about this is the engine age. Finding a low km M20 is hard and where I am located there are very few, if any, shops where I can send the head, transmission, etc to get tuned/resealed. If I do this I was looking at going with a chop shop (the legal kind) in Ontario and seeing if I could work out a deal with them to get the head and a few other things refreshed before sending it my way.

Short Version

• University student, low funds, car is 1989 325i sedan, DD
• Have a list of goals: Paint, Low, Wheels, Engine
• M50 costs more, possible unseen problems, might spend my budget and not get other things on the list finished
• M20 easy swap, downside is finding one in good condition, few or no places around me to send engine parts for refurbishing

Conclusion
Not really sure what to do. Should I man up and drop in the M50 and have a car that doesn't look as good or try to work a deal with a chop shop to have a few things refurbished and get a M20 and transmission shipped down and have a clean looking car project.

All comments & help appreciated, can't get this out of my head.

Cheers,
Aaron

[BrownBeanE30]

I would suggest m50

[mRodiek]

for $3500 you may find it difficult for paint/suspension/body/wheels all at once, pick 2 of those and make it perfect then do some more work down the line...

My suggestion would be to go with the M50 first since your in college and can skip a day or 2 of classes with out MAJOR problems, if you do that work you may be getting canned lol

[Wh33lhop]

I would suggest m50

I bet you would :p

Honestly I'd say if you don't really want any extra power, then it should depend on what sort of deals pop up for you on either engine. The M20 is still a fun motor, although it's lacking a few ponies and the more modern look of an M50--that being said an M50 swap really isn't all that tough fundamentally. New brake booster, connect a few wires, twist your selector rod, fab an exhaust and you're pretty much there... but you will run into more annoying issues and you'll have to get your ducks in a row.

[bimmerteck]

Neither the m20 or the m50 are what they used to be, hence either pulled from a junkyard could likely use some fresh gaskets and sensors from the get go. You may want to compare the costs of the parts to refresh either of the motors before deciding.

[e30BMart]

Approximate prices:

Suspension = 900 for H&R race and Bilstein sports.
Paint = 500 max if you do all the prep and just have paint (primer, (clear maybe), ect) to buy.
Wheels = 600
m50 = 1000 (all included)
Total: 3000$

Working car: check
Low: check
Wheels: check
clean engine bay: up to you (check)
Painted: check

And 500$ for unexpected things that always happen. If you do the work yourself I don't see why this project is not plausible with your budget, good luck! I wish I knew someone that painted for a living :(

*Edit* forgot about the tires, you're screwed

[Kershaw]

i would suggest an m50 out of a z3. it has an aluminum block.

it weighs a whopping 50lbs lighter.

[A_Whelan]

for $3500 you may find it difficult for paint/suspension/body/wheels all at once, pick 2 of those and make it perfect then do some more work down the line...

My suggestion would be to go with the M50 first since your in college and can skip a day or 2 of classes with out MAJOR problems, if you do that work you may be getting canned lol

I kinda thought about that as well. Here is my guestimates for prices
Paint - $400-500
Wheels & Tires - $2000
Suspension $700
Engine & Trans + extras - $1200-1500

So I guess the budget is blown. I might have more money throughout the summer by working a second job to fund this expensive hobby.

Honestly I'd say if you don't really want any extra power, then it should depend on what sort of deals pop up for you on either engine. The M20 is still a fun motor, although it's lacking a few ponies and the more modern look of an M50--that being said an M50 swap really isn't all that tough fundamentally. New brake booster, connect a few wires, twist your selector rod, fab an exhaust and you're pretty much there... but you will run into more annoying issues and you'll have to get your ducks in a row.

I started a quick list last night and I came up with: M50B25 NV engine, E34 pil pan and throttle cable, E36 engine mount arms, E28 motor mounts, Getrag 260 or ZF 310 (not sure which is better), cross memeber from White325is, and gaskets and stuff. I might also need a new Rad, steering linkage, water pump, thermostat and a few other things I'm not 100% about yet. Oh, and probably a plug and go conversion for wiring, not too keen on doing it myself.

Also can't I keep my original brake booster and 'slot' the firewall to slide it over or is this with another type?

Thanks again for the replies

[A_Whelan]

Approximate prices:

Suspension = 900 for H&R race and Bilstein sports.
Paint = 500 max if you do all the prep and just have paint (primer, (clear maybe), ect) to buy.
Wheels = 600
m50 = 1000 (all included)
Total: 3000$

Working car: check
Low: check
Wheels: check
clean engine bay: up to you (check)
Painted: check

And 500$ for unexpected things that always happen. If you do the work yourself I don't see why this project is not plausible with your budget, good luck! I wish I knew someone that painted for a living :(

*Edit* forgot about the tires, you're screwed

How do you figure just $600 for wheels? Looking to get Borbet Type A's on it. And with this build I won't do something or change it for a product I won't bee 100% about. My Dad found two or three other cars, a lot newer, for really cheap but I just love the E30. I like your estimates better than mine though!

i would suggest an m50 out of a z3. it has an aluminum block.

it weighs a whopping 50lbs lighter.

This would probably be harder to track down. If the opportunity came along, sure, but I'm not after performance and I've heard mixed opinions about the aluminum blocks.

[Wh33lhop]

i would suggest an m50 out of a z3. it has an aluminum block.

it weighs a whopping 50lbs lighter.

404 M50 Z3 not found

[caliGreen]

wow wish i had an uncle that paints..

[Wh33lhop]

I kinda thought about that as well. Here is my guestimates for prices
Paint - $400-500
Wheels & Tires - $2000
Suspension $700
Engine & Trans + extras - $1200-1500

So I guess the budget is blown. I might have more money throughout the summer by working a second job to fund this expensive hobby.




I started a quick list last night and I came up with: M50B25 NV engine, E34 pil pan and throttle cable, E36 engine mount arms, E28 motor mounts, Getrag 260 or ZF 310 (not sure which is better), cross memeber from White325is, and gaskets and stuff. I might also need a new Rad, steering linkage, water pump, thermostat and a few other things I'm not 100% about yet. Oh, and probably a plug and go conversion for wiring, not too keen on doing it myself.

Also can't I keep my original brake booster and 'slot' the firewall to slide it over or is this with another type?

Thanks again for the replies

You can slot the firewall yes, I started doing this and realized I was going to have to remove the pedal support bracket and hack it up in order to get it to work, so $50 at a junkyard later I had an E32 booster and master cylinder.

If I were you I'd look into getting a VANOS motor. They have more midrange and are better for DD duty (not to mention are the faster motor in general). The price difference between VANOS and NV is really negligible as long as you shop around for either motor.

Don't even worry about the Z3 block, the only aluminum M5x blocks are M52s and typically fetch a pretty penny.

[Brandon12V]

Honestly, I think you should weigh you priorities a bit. A college student who is getting ready to pay for school loans, and look for a job to pay those loans, needs to have a reliable car.

As stated before get prices on replacing parts , new & used, and find out what parts are recommended to be replaced from the get-go. I can tell you right now that there are good donor long block m20's that sell on eBay, for 1000-1600 shipped worldwide, WITH a 3-12 month warranty. all you would have to do is swap over the accessories on your current block and be done with it.
when doing any motor swap that was not considered "OEM", I would suggest not taking shortcuts. Save your money if you want to do an m50 swap that bad. if you have money left over, work on the next biggest priority on your list. just remember, you need a running car first. wheels, paint, etc can always come down the road. have patience.

[mRodiek]

^ very good points. Take a chunk of your budget to get the car running flawless with the motor you really want. Save the extra money for a rainy day or until you have more disposable income

[vivalegreg]

i would suggest an m50 out of a z3. it has an aluminum block.

it weighs a whopping 50lbs lighter.

you can be so jooish sometimes