Muscle VS. Ricers ----> Hahahaha

[Jarvis]

doesn't the M3 CSL have the highest HP/liter out of any naturally-aspirated engine in the world? and I'd hardly call it anemic. :)

The first Honda S2000 engine (2.0L, 240hp) had the record, but then they up'ed the displacement to 2.2L w/ the same hp, so now it's not as impressive. 355hp from the CSL's 3.2L is about the same hp/liter figure as the 2.2L Honda engine. But then again the M3's 3.2L is 3246cc and I'm not sure of the exact displacement of the 2.2L.

[Psychomofo]

Personally, I like the old muscle cars. I would actually like to own one some day. I'm not posting to be flamed, but just to state my opinion. I very rarely see imports with 600hp, but the 600hp domestics are more plentiful than some of you might think. A lot of it depends on where you live I guess. The domestics are more of a big bang for the buck rather than a little bang for more bucks. The imports aren't the only ones using technology in their engines anymore. The domestics are using it too. I'm sure you guys have seen that new Cadillac with 1000hp. How many imports can boast that much horsepower from the factory? Not many if at all. I think that the main point of that post was another way to put down the "ricers", and not all imports as many of you seem to think. This thread went from "muscle cars vs. 'ricers' " to domestic vs. import. This is just my opinion that I have stated just as you all have stated yours. So, no flaming...please. :)

Edit: Another thought that just entered my mind is that you can't get a 426 Hemi for less than 8000 bucks, but you can get an S50/S52 fully swapped in with some mods to boot. So, I guess BMWs get a bit more bang for their buck than even some domestics. Sort of. This is leaving out the horsepower and torque differences of the two motors. Just going by price here.

[Stu]

Personally, I like the old muscle cars. I would actually like to own one some day. I'm not posting to be flamed, but just to state my opinion. I very rarely see imports with 600hp, but the 600hp domestics are more plentiful than some of you might think. A lot of it depends on where you live I guess. The domestics are more of a big bang for the buck rather than a little bang for more bucks. The imports aren't the only ones using technology in their engines anymore. The domestics are using it too. I'm sure you guys have seen that new Cadillac with 1000hp. How many imports can boast that much horsepower from the factory? Not many if at all. I think that the main point of that post was another way to put down the "ricers", and not all imports as many of you seem to think. This thread went from "muscle cars vs. 'ricers' " to domestic vs. import. This is just my opinion that I have stated just as you all have stated yours. So, no flaming...please. :)

Edit: Another thought that just entered my mind is that you can't get a 426 Hemi for less than 8000 bucks, but you can get an S50/S52 fully swapped in with some mods to boot. So, I guess BMWs get a bit more bang for their buck than even some domestics. Sort of. This is leaving out the horsepower and torque differences of the two motors. Just going by price here.

Honestly though. Any car manufacturer could build an engine to the HP levels of the 426 Hemi's. Keep in mind what we are talking about----Four Hundred and Twenty Six cubic inches. The S50 engine you mentioned is 182 cubic inches. That American Hemi is well over twice the size as far as displacement is concerned. People build all-motor S50's to 275-300hp all the time------now do the math.

And like you said, it is NOT cheap to get that sort of serious HP out of the American V8's. It not only takes money, but it also takes the technology of todays ignition, fuel, and electrical systems. The muscle cars of the 60's, in original form, fouled spark plugs on a bi-weekly basis......and I'm not kidding.

I could talk for hours on this subject......
;)

[Digitalwave]

Personally, I like the old muscle cars. I would actually like to own one some day. I'm not posting to be flamed, but just to state my opinion. I very rarely see imports with 600hp, but the 600hp domestics are more plentiful than some of you might think. A lot of it depends on where you live I guess. The domestics are more of a big bang for the buck rather than a little bang for more bucks. The imports aren't the only ones using technology in their engines anymore. The domestics are using it too. I'm sure you guys have seen that new Cadillac with 1000hp. How many imports can boast that much horsepower from the factory? Not many if at all. I think that the main point of that post was another way to put down the "ricers", and not all imports as many of you seem to think. This thread went from "muscle cars vs. 'ricers' " to domestic vs. import. This is just my opinion that I have stated just as you all have stated yours. So, no flaming...please. :)

Edit: Another thought that just entered my mind is that you can't get a 426 Hemi for less than 8000 bucks, but you can get an S50/S52 fully swapped in with some mods to boot. So, I guess BMWs get a bit more bang for their buck than even some domestics. Sort of. This is leaving out the horsepower and torque differences of the two motors. Just going by price here.

Yeah, well how many domestics come with 1,000hp factory anyways? The new Bugatti is an import with over 1,000hp.

[george graves]

US:Showing off a 500hp Dyno sheet
THEM:Boasting that their 150hp 4 pinger makes more hp per liter

That's just lame.

[diegom6]

Personally, I like the old muscle cars. I would actually like to own one some day. I'm not posting to be flamed, but just to state my opinion. I very rarely see imports with 600hp, but the 600hp domestics are more plentiful than some of you might think. A lot of it depends on where you live I guess. The domestics are more of a big bang for the buck rather than a little bang for more bucks. The imports aren't the only ones using technology in their engines anymore. The domestics are using it too. I'm sure you guys have seen that new Cadillac with 1000hp. How many imports can boast that much horsepower from the factory? Not many if at all. I think that the main point of that post was another way to put down the "ricers", and not all imports as many of you seem to think. This thread went from "muscle cars vs. 'ricers' " to domestic vs. import. This is just my opinion that I have stated just as you all have stated yours. So, no flaming...please. :)

Edit: Another thought that just entered my mind is that you can't get a 426 Hemi for less than 8000 bucks, but you can get an S50/S52 fully swapped in with some mods to boot. So, I guess BMWs get a bit more bang for their buck than even some domestics. Sort of. This is leaving out the horsepower and torque differences of the two motors. Just going by price here.

Yeah, well how many domestics come with 1,000hp factory anyways? The new Bugatti is an import with over 1,000hp.

and one Cadillac V16 too.....Hemi owns the rest of the US V8s!!!

[Rob]

the cadi v16 is definately not a production car

[Psychomofo]

Stu, since I can't do the math I'll just take your word for it. I didn't know that Bugatti had made a car with 1,000hp. Although, it is true that the Cadillac V16 probably will never go into production. I mean how many people need 1,000hp anyway? I don't think I really NEED 1,000hp, but I surely wouldn't mind having it. ;)

It takes a lot of money and technology to make a lot of horsepower no matter what kind vehicle you use. So, what have we solved? I'm confused. :oops:

[Jarvis]

new Cadillac with 1000hp.

First of all, (like a few others have stated) it was a concept car - not for production
Secondly, 1000hp out of 16 cylinders and 13.6 liters is not that big of a deal. 73.5 hp/liter isn't all that impressive nowadays - 73.5 hp/liter is roughly what BMW gets from their standard (non-M) engines in their production cars. So for a concept car, that power output should be nothing special considering the size of the engine.

[Rob]

careful jarvis, thats ricer match nowadays.... :P

[Psychomofo]

new Cadillac with 1000hp.

First of all, (like a few others have stated) it was a concept car - not for production
Secondly, 1000hp out of 16 cylinders and 13.6 liters is not that big of a deal. 73.5 hp/liter isn't all that impressive nowadays - 73.5 hp/liter is roughly what BMW gets from their standard (non-M) engines in their production cars. So for a concept car, that power output should be nothing special considering the size of the engine.

I noticed where others had already talked about it being a concept car. I realize that now, and you people don't have to keep telling me that. You also should think of this. The power potential of that motor. I mean they are probably putting out 1000 conservative horsepower. Not that it really matters anyways since it will never be produced. Just a thought though.

[Jand3rson]

The Muscle heads are upset because the European/Japanese car scene has almost completely wiped out the American muscle in the last decade.

Go to the news stands....look how skinny a Hot Rod magazine is. Look how many pages are in Super Street or something similar.

[Stu]

It's the truth.