some ofest pics. enjoy

[rward325]

I'm definitely liking the new 6, and the 5. I like old school just as much as the next guy but if you had that kind of change to throw around all you guys talking trash would be out lining up to buy one.

(insert flame here)

[rwh11385]

Since this has become a flame thread about the new 5/6 series, :shock: here's an interesting article.

It's called "Why we'll see more ugly cars" and talks about more wild designs will help sales, even if some people hate the looks. http://www.msnbc.com/news/978276.asp?cp1=1

I personally like the new 5..... i think you gotta see it in person for a while to get used to it. And the new 6 is going to be sexy if you let it grow on you. (The new 7 is still too bulky, but looks a whole lot less ugly that it used to)

Anyway, if BMW continued produces subtle or bland design, they would lose out in the industry. "Classic" bodystyling would not float right now in this queer auto industry of ours......( WHO NEEDS A NEON SRT, or why is there a SLK-rebadged as a Crossfire? :evil: )
Only cars like the Mini Cooper will win out with classic styling - but only for nostalgia. If BMW made more bodies that look like the plain brick E36, they could be losing money (Even tho the E36 M3 is dead sexy ).

The market demands more modern looking cars. Even if some believe they are ugly. BMW for a long time has had a conservative leader, but i think someone else took over a position in the heirarchy and thing are different, maybe it started with the Z4, but only the old guy - - none of these designs would have happened.

I personally love the Z4, it looks badass 8) , as the Z3 is bland and plain and wimpy looking.

BMW's new models may not be subtle.......and that may be the point. :?

[e9nine]

I personally love the Z4, it looks badass 8) , as the Z3 is bland and plain and wimpy looking.

The m coupe is the nicest looking and most underestimated of the BMWs IMHO... Its a love it - or hate it kind of car. I wish to own a z coupe or m coupe as part of the stable..Damn Sexy Cars :twisted:

..Now the Z4 is another sharky looking car!! I was watching them in some race on Speed over the weekend and these cars were running in stock motor form!!! The caged car looked ooooh sooo sexy :shock: I'd still take the m coupe before the Z4 as I don't really like soft tops

[e9nine]

The saddest part about all these new car is they have really advanced motors and electronics; the dealers and shops will now have more money as the days of DIY are over for most of the newer cars

I hear this all the time now, that "new cars are pretty much impossible for DIY jobs"

My question is, what sort of DIY jobs are necessary on these new vehicles? These motors are pretty much bulletproof. The valves are hydraulic, hence no adjustment. There's no distributor cap & rotor, so no replacement of that or need to adjust timing. There's a timing chain, so no belt to change. Most of the garbage rubber feeder hoses of ancient motors like the M20 & M30 are long since gone, so much less to crack & break, destroying the idle properties. Hell, the plugs they run in these motors are good for 80-100k easy, so you're practically only changing oil and coolant.

Hell, in my opinion, even OBDII is a good thing. 180 bucks gets you a port scanner & software, hook it up to a laptop, and you can run a full diagnostic check on the motor, and excellent tool. The old "oh, it affects performance mods" is utter BS, since for any serious mods (ie cams, headwork, higher comp pistons, etc) you would be reprogramming the ECU anyway. The only thing it would really effect would be the poser bolt on mods like intake & exhaust, which as we know don't do squat on these motors anyway.

-Charlie

I hear you about the motors being virtually free of the petty components that fail and are able to adapt to each condition but we all know when technology gives you something you are trading off some other issues for it...it could be as simple as your LCD screen not lighting up or some sensor to working well and triple A has to come rescue your car with a nice tow..if they included some limited kind of free roadside assistance and towing then its a step forward but even then when you are in some remote place you're SOL

This is kinda like how people used to hate on FI when it was becoming popular over carbs...the only difference here is they are actually not easy to tinker with....yes you can pull your Handheld or whatever gizmo and pull the fault code but what happens when you actually have to replace a part!? Thats where its not easily done, the manufacturers make the car such that not any ordinary "Joe Schmoe" or "Jenny Shoe" off the street can tinker with the car in their garages...the avg. indep. shop cannot even afford the equipment as pointed out...

Let's see what happens....

[Jand3rson]

Looks like I won't be buying any new Bimmers...ever.

Rebadged Ponitacs.

My sentiments exactly.

Charlie, you do make a valid point. I will agree that there is somethint to be said for a car you never have to worry about. But I bet you can't even change the spark plugs on one of those new bimmers by yourself. I love sports cars from the 70's, 80's and eraly 90's because YOU can do almost all the work on them! And there's so much now available to modify them! I mean, what's going to be available for the new 6? An AC Schnitzer carbon fiber engine cover and a shift knob? Sure, one of these days, I want to have a brand new model sports car sitting at home that I take out and drive like a maniac and don't have to give a quick check underneath when I get back. But it's not going to be the car I love the most. That's the problem with new BMW's (save the M3 CSL), they aren't driver's cars anymore.

[///M42 sport]

I just have to chime in here on the aesthetics. Even though I didn't like the six in pictures, in person it looked dead sexy first hand. Doesn't really have a outrageous design, in fact I didn't even notice the six at first (too busy drooling over the M1) :) I was like most you guys hating the new designs, but they'll start to grow on you once you see them in person.
________
Effects of depakote

[Charlie]

Charlie, you do make a valid point. I will agree that there is somethint to be said for a car you never have to worry about. But I bet you can't even change the spark plugs on one of those new bimmers by yourself.

From what I've seen on the new 4.5 litre V8's, remove the plastic covers, unhook the coil packs, and remove the plugs. No different than any of the 24v six cyls or V8's.

I love sports cars from the 70's, 80's and eraly 90's because YOU can do almost all the work on them! And there's so much now available to modify them! I mean, what's going to be available for the new 6? An AC Schnitzer carbon fiber engine cover and a shift knob?

I imagine open element air filters, exhausts, cams, headwork options, pistons, etc. Just like the current crop of V8's and all other motors. I don't see what would be different on a car like the new 6er. For a cost, places like Dinan and Schnitzer will get you all sorts of real motor goodies. You'd have to get the OBDII unit tuned, which is no different than an OBDI setup if you're looking for optimal performance.

Sure, one of these days, I want to have a brand new model sports car sitting at home that I take out and drive like a maniac and don't have to give a quick check underneath when I get back. But it's not going to be the car I love the most. That's the problem with new BMW's (save the M3 CSL), they aren't driver's cars anymore.

Have you driven the Z4? The mini's, hell even the new 5 series? The new five has been called the most tossable and best feeling 5 series ever by a number of people. They say it has the best road manners and delivers much better feedback than the previous cars.

I spent all weekend driving my mom's e46 325xi, and I loved it. It's got the sport package setup, and while not as raw and frantic as my tweaked e30, I can't say it handled any worse. As a matter of fact, in stock configuration like that, I'd say it had just as quick, if not quicker responses than the e30, with a much nicer ride. The steering in the newer e46's is excellent, granted, some early 2001 cars had issues, but it's much more responsive and transmits way more feel than the rack in the e30.

Going off on a bit of a tangent, I see a number of people getting upset over all of the computer controlled elements of the motors, and expounding how failure in on of those could leave you stranded. This ignores the fact that these systems have multiple redundancies, fail-safe "limp home" modes, and have not caused any "stranded" cases that I have heard or read about. (even if, BMW does have 24 hour roadside assistance on their new cars). Tell me how that's worse than a timing belt that lets go and destroys the head on your motor.

-Charlie

[modifiede30]

All I have to do is quote my wife - after looking through my most recent Roundel.

"that's a nice looking Saturn" (ie, the new 5 series)

I would have blown this statement off in most cases since women tend to have "eye" for car designs like I have an eye for art work, but given that BMW's have always been able to obtain unique designs that are unmistakable, her statement has begun to make me realize that BMW is no longer in this "design mode". Sell to the masses I guess. After doing so well with the newer 3 and 5 series, they've lost their roots if you ask me. While the cars still perform like no other, their looks have gone mainstream in my opinion. I don't think they look like shit, as most would say, but I will definitely state that they are no longer unique. If you want unique these days, go to Audi, MB, or sad to say, Saab. BMW now looks like a very well performing US car. Maybe Ford or Chrysler bought them an nobody has been told yet.

[LarsG]

I must say, the new designs are growing on me. Escpecially the 6er. Good stuff. 8)

[808BMW]

How much will these cost?

http://maddox.xmission.com/c.cgi?u=ugly_cars

[Erick]

What's up with the Pontiac festival there?

I dig the white one in the back though, is that one available at the dealers as well? :roll: ( How I WISH it was )

[Jon325i]

I've had a pretty difficult time warming up to any BMWs latest offerings....with two acceptions. The Z4 I like....its art in motion....a very attractive car from practically every angle. The new X3 looks pretty neat too. I've never been a fan for the big SUV thing. The X3 has a nice style and good proportions all around plus its not a freakin' beast-sized ride. A 3.0L with a manual would be my drivetrain of choice for this one......ditto for the Z4.

Jon

[808BMW]

I actually liked the new 5... but seeing it in commercial and more pics now, the whole grill area just dominates too much attention, leaving the badass headlights as something your eye catches as an afterthought.