I'm learning how to drive stick!

[ELVA164]

Alternatively, depress clutch, engage 1st gear, dial up 4k rpm, dump clutch, hang on for your life!

Haha, that's a different type of standing start!

[AndrewBird]

Only 4k? I was thinking 6.

Practicing starting form a stop without using the throttle might be a good way to learn where the clutch engagement point is. Basically just let the clutch out very slowly until it starts to grab, then slow down even more until you are able to release it completely out. You'll likely stall the car several times, but with practice, you should be able to take off without any throttle input. This will teach you and your muscles (read: muscle memory) where the engagement point is.

[15Michaeljoseph]

wait come on guys don't flood our brother with double clutching and heel-toes (or 'toes/side of foot' ,for me) yet!

best thing to do is to let the clutch out until the car starts to roll. then you found the engagement point.

double clutching... i still don't understand myself....off gas while clutching in just past enagement point, go up a gear, let clutch out fast and press gas pretty much simultaneously... it's always smooth (except going from 1-2 SOMETIMES)... so what else i gotta do?


--Mike

[Das Delfin]

double clutching... i still don't understand myself

Since like 5 people have chimed in about the clutch grabbing point, can we have a discussion on what double clutching is and how/why? Do I have to use 4 pedals now? :firehop:

[pandaboo911]

typically you shouldn't coast in neutral because some transmissions don't oil properly with just the neutral gear spinning.

Also preserve your brakes :)

Double clutching is only used when your trans has worn synchros or none at all. Normally the synchros serve to match the gears to the same speed. When you double clutch you are using the engine to speed up the gears between clutching in and out, essentially doing the work that the synchros would normally do. It's pointless unless you have a bad trans or no synchros.

[Massimo]

Since like 5 people have chimed in about the clutch grabbing point, can we have a discussion on what double clutching is and how/why? Do I have to use 4 pedals now? :firehop:

double clutching is a waste of time and was something used in very old cars.

All you do is go to neutral first before going to the next gear. Takes longer to change gears and has no benefit.



Better yet just rev match so you don't need to use the clutch

[roguetoaster]

Since like 5 people have chimed in about the clutch grabbing point, can we have a discussion on what double clutching is and how/why? Do I have to use 4 pedals now? :firehop:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_clutch_%28technique%29

You don't really need to use double clutching on a near stock E30. On a high powered car, it will probably help you drive more smoothly and avoid damaging the drive line.

4 pedals are for serious race/rally cars, where the driver needs to control front/rear pressures with their foot. Imagine being able to have a hydraulic handbrake in the pedal box.

[Das Delfin]

So I'd only really want to do that if I wanted to go from 4th to 2nd, when the synchros may be "out of range" so to speak

[socalife]

If you want to move from a start, you should put it in neutral and apply gas. Also don't use the clutch when up shifting, it's a waste of time.

[roguetoaster]

So I'd only really want to do that if I wanted to go from 4th to 2nd, when the synchros may be "out of range" so to speak

That's when you might want to heel toe, or at least let it coast down to speed and rev match it in to 2nd. The gear would probably be mostly out of useful range going from 4-2, not so much the synchro gears/dogs.

If you want to move from a start, you should put it in neutral and apply gas. Also don't use the clutch when up shifting, it's a waste of time.

Please fuck off you rather useless troll, people are trying to learn.

[15Michaeljoseph]

Since like 5 people have chimed in about the clutch grabbing point, can we have a discussion on what double clutching is and how/why? Do I have to use 4 pedals now? :firehop:

I'm in for this. I want to know the secrets. why not triple clutch as well?


--Mike

[roguetoaster]

The clutch grab point is simple, it's just where you first feel the friction of the clutch disc, frequently you'll feel this as the car just starting to move forward, or starting to buck if you haven't applied enough throttle.

An example of double clutching:

Going from 3rd to 2nd; fully depress clutch and disengage 3rd gear, gear lever in neutral; allow the clutch to come about half way back up, right about where you feel grab; fully depress clutch, engage 2nd gear. If you did it correctly you will have matched speeds of the engine, transmission and road speed/diff or trans output speed.

What's the point? Ideally, to reduce wear on the gears themselves (especially in transmissions with no synchronizer rings) you ideally want all rotating parts (PP assembly, engine, both transmission shafts) to be spinning at the correct speed for the gear you are about to engage and the current road speed. The clutch sort of acts as a brake for the system in the same way as service brakes do and facilitates the reduction in speed of the forward end of the system.

Ideally, on downshifting you will use the cars service brakes and possibly throttle (a heel toe downshift) to fully match system speeds. During an upshift you will only need to use the clutch and throttle (to match road speed to trans speed) to double clutch.

Again, this is not necessary to do on cars that have synchronizer rings as long as you have reasonably matched road speed to desired gear speed.

[ELVA164]

Okay, so some different stuff floating around here about double-clutching. I feel it should get addressed, but the OP is a NEW DRIVER. Double-clutching is not relevant to him nor most of the people here. As mentioned, it is a synchro-saving technique in any E30 (including mine, since POs were apparently not too friendly with the poor thing...). I double-clutch from 1-2, 2-3, 3-2, and 2-1 (if I'm moving, which is rare). I'll also be double-clutching in the Courier when I get that done as it'll have a synchro box and not a dog box.

You must completely release the clutch pedal in the middle of a double-clutch.

How to double clutch:

Disengage clutch (push down) fully.
Move shifter to neutral.
Engage clutch fully.
Rev match.
Disengage clutch and select next gear.
Engage clutch in a manner similar to a regular shift (e.g. smoothly, not abruptly).
High-five all bros within arm's reach.
Receive BJs from all chicks within dick's reach.

....What were we talking about? :D

For fun, here's a blast from the past when I asked about double-clutching: http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=266520

[15Michaeljoseph]

hmmm. seems complicated.
TIME TO TRY IT!


--Mike

[Dirty325ix]

Not trying to thread jack but how does fuel consumption work with a manual transmission....when I'm cruising up a hill and I put the pedal to the floor but don't feel any extra power (because i didnt drop a gear) is that just wasting fuel?