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  • varg
    replied
    Originally posted by LEANE30 View Post
    Most dual-hobby e30 enthusiast photographers shoot with a camera lense to make PICTURES that costs more than the e30 that they DRIVE and are photographing.


    I definitely have more in the photography equipment I've photographed my car with than the value of my car. Why can't any cheap hobbies appeal to me?
    Last edited by varg; 03-29-2017, 07:29 PM.

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  • LEANE30
    replied
    The problem with e36 is that they do have better rear suspension for tracking, and subsequently they aren't as fun or challenging to drive at the same speed as e30s. E30s are not devilish, but reward you equally for every ounce of driving effort you invest or punish for foolish assumptions. An e36 doesn't get as unsettled mid corner if your timing and control isn't as precise, which makes them faster, but overall less rewarding of experience to drive. They lack some of the engineering imperfections that form the character that e30s have. Same as the e21 felt detached in comparison to the 02. I for one don't see the e36 ever being more to an e30 than the e21 was to the 2002. Is the e21 under appreciated? Absolutely. But e36 however is doomed to the same fate of always living in the shadow of the e30 for two reasons. First being especially due to the e46 being pretty much the same price and yet overall so much better in almost every way imaginable. Simply put, it was the e36 m3's game to loose, and it lost the game in spades. It had the e30 m3's reputation to uphold so it had a massive target on its back from inception. Ultimately the e36 was defeated by the era's Supra. Head to head reviews were everywhere. Look at the prices of Supras now, the e36 was banished to the status of an "also ran". Ultimately the aftermarket screwed it over by not competing with turbos and breaking the 1000hp mark with an s50 in the 90s, not one-upping the Supra benchmarks... compounded in tandem with Bmw bastardizing the m motor from the start. So I'm not holding my breath for the e36. Especially when the e46 m3 was so much more pure of a drivers car in comparison, albeit fully modernized, leaving shade tree mechanic maintenance behind with so much tighter systems packaging and ever more plastic parts.

    I do find the whole e30 valuation topic somewhat amusing now though. Originally I didn't like the price raising because it meant it was becoming more popular and I don't enjoy e30s for the fact that others also enjoy them. I like my e30s in spite of any other person's opinion. In fact I rather loath the branding purely due to the stigma it carries, people hear "Bmw" and that's what first begins to form their opinion of the car, not that it is firstly a friendly nimble fun reliable and cheap rwd sports car, but they envision the social cache.

    I like e30s purely for what they are, how they are built, how they drive, how they are to work on and maintain. Its a happy spot of modernity and yet being a classic hands-on machine, no computer nannies can come to save you. no airbags will protect your pretty face. You can get manual steering racks, manual windows, no frills still in conjunction with leather bucket seats and a manual transmission yet with an obc.

    At the end of the day however, a well maintained and good condition enthusiast car with as much to give in experiential rewards to its driver for around $5k is still a cheap ass car. Even at today's prices, it's a freaking bargain, independent of if you are wealthy or poor, especially if you can find the trim configurations and chassis colors that you want. What's a $1000.00 price "tax" or "appreciation" swing really mean to you for something you ultimately have no intention to ever get rid of? That's chump change when you are talking about any hobby, gotta pay to play. Most dual-hobby e30 enthusiast photographers shoot with a camera lense to make PICTURES that costs more than the e30 that they DRIVE and are photographing.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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  • Vincent Brick
    replied
    Originally posted by varg View Post
    It's something you should get used to. Except in rare circumstances, cars and pretty much everything that is part of a hobby always have been and always will be depreciating assets. You cannot avoid this. If you like cars and driving them, it will always be a money-sink hobby, and only "collectors" with "collectible" cars that sit undriven except to a show here and there make money off of or break even with appreciating cars.

    You can't look at these things like an accountant, the enjoyment you get out of your car has to be worth the financial loss to you.

    -poor student with hobbies

    What you say is mostly true, but I am confident my E30 has appreciated in value since I bought it, and it is not unheard of with other cars. It hardly matters though because I don't plan to sell my car, or at least least hope I don't have to, but it's certainly better than even my previous cars that had already hit rock bottom and hardly had value left to lose. Most cars are a financial loss, but appreciation is making this less of one.

    -poor old guy who had to give up all his hobbies

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  • craz azn
    replied
    Originally posted by Shock(/\)ave View Post
    Cookstown Auto. Both cars have been picked pretty clean; we got a lot of parts off of them ourselves.
    :(:(:( I need a crapton of parts for this new one I picked up... now I'm starting to regret having sold my euroweaves waaaayyyy back when lollllll... Can't seem to find a normal priced set anymore :(

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  • Staszek
    replied
    Originally posted by varg View Post
    It's something you should get used to. Except in rare circumstances, cars and pretty much everything that is part of a hobby always have been and always will be depreciating assets. You cannot avoid this. If you like cars and driving them, it will always be a money-sink hobby, and only "collectors" with "collectible" cars that sit undriven except to a show here and there make money off of or break even with appreciating cars.

    You can't look at these things like an accountant, the enjoyment you get out of your car has to be worth the financial loss to you.

    -poor student with hobbies
    I agree with this. At first when I started my build I had this budget that if I sold it I would come out even or maybe make some money.

    Then I thought, who am I kidding I am not selling it, so I stopped adding up the numbers, I have an idea of where it is but I just want the car to be what I want it to be.

    I think its the way you need to rationalize things as an enthusiast. Unless you are seriously in the business of buying and selling cars for a living dont worry about the depreciation.

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  • Shock(/\)ave
    replied
    Originally posted by craz azn View Post
    Which yard was this? :)
    Cookstown Auto. Both cars have been picked pretty clean; we got a lot of parts off of them ourselves.

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  • craz azn
    replied
    Originally posted by estoguy View Post
    E30s are already a rare commodity north of border. Although, the other day I was at a local bone yard, and found a 325i coupe (that was really rough) and a vert. I haven't seen an E30 in that yard for over a year, maybe 2.
    Which yard was this? :)

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  • varg
    replied
    Originally posted by Vincent Brick View Post
    I'm sick of everything I own depreciating
    It's something you should get used to. Except in rare circumstances, cars and pretty much everything that is part of a hobby always have been and always will be depreciating assets. You cannot avoid this. If you like cars and driving them, it will always be a money-sink hobby, and only "collectors" with "collectible" cars that sit undriven except to a show here and there make money off of or break even with appreciating cars.

    You can't look at these things like an accountant, the enjoyment you get out of your car has to be worth the financial loss to you.

    -poor student with hobbies

    Leave a comment:


  • Vincent Brick
    replied
    I still wonder about this mythical time of cheap E30s I always hear people talk about. I've seen prices go up a tiny bit over the last couple years, and i remember when M3s could be had for $10k or less, but if I had ever found an affordable 325i cheaper years ago I would have bought it because I always liked them but considered any BMW out of my budget (we're talking mid-late '00s living in a part of the midwest they are not common).

    I love my E30 but I am all for it going up in value because I have had to spend way more than it is worth to keep it on the road and I'm sick of everything I own depreciating, I'm broke as fuck and can never catch a break when it comes to finding deals or making money in general and I need every little bit of help I can get. The hard part is keeping up on the maintenance with parts so expensive, and I'm not really happy with the performance, I miss the handling of my Neons and wish it was faster.

    Cars have absolutely turned into a wealthy man's hobby, when I was growing up it was a mostly blue collar thing that transcended class lines, today too few people have the expendable income. I've worked at several shops and aftermarket manufacturers over the last decade, most of the customers are very well off, and there are always 2-3 customers that do more business than all other customers combined.

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  • MR E30 325is
    replied
    Originally posted by rturbo 930 View Post
    To be honest though, that's probably a good thing. High schoolers ruin a lot of cars.

    I do find it disappointing that pretty much every decent, fun, affordable car is going up in price, and the only cars that aren't are the ones no one wants. It's heading in the direction of the car hobby becoming a wealthy man's hobby, as I see it.
    Egh, you're probably right about the high schooler point.

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  • rturbo 930
    replied
    Originally posted by MR E30 325is View Post
    the cars becoming too expensive for the average high schooler to truly enjoy.

    /rant
    To be honest though, that's probably a good thing. High schoolers ruin a lot of cars.

    I do find it disappointing that pretty much every decent, fun, affordable car is going up in price, and the only cars that aren't are the ones no one wants. It's heading in the direction of the car hobby becoming a wealthy man's hobby, as I see it.

    Leave a comment:


  • estoguy
    replied
    E30s are already a rare commodity north of border. Although, the other day I was at a local bone yard, and found a 325i coupe (that was really rough) and a vert. I haven't seen an E30 in that yard for over a year, maybe 2.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shock(/\)ave
    replied
    Originally posted by MR E30 325is View Post
    I still feel nostalgic about those experiences. And they are becoming more and more difficult for others to duplicate. I made so many friends directly related to E30's and I feel that others are missing out on this, simply due to the cars becoming too expensive for the average high schooler to truly enjoy.
    That's why BMW invented the E36 and E46. ;D

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  • dnguyen1963
    replied
    Originally posted by MR E30 325is View Post
    Others have already touched on the counterpoint, and Varg hit the nail right on the head.

    Just to add on, I still feel a certain way about E30's and their old prices.

    I remember when I was in high school and how easy it was to convince all of my friends to buy E30's due to how much awesomeness you got for the money.

    Back in 05-06 my friends and I picked up moderately clean E30s' for 2k. We had insane amounts of fun in them together. Lots of late night drives, lots of impromptu meets in prandom parking lots, etc.

    I still feel nostalgic about those experiences. And they are becoming more and more difficult for others to duplicate. I made so many friends directly related to E30's and I feel that others are missing out on this, simply due to the cars becoming too expensive for anyone to truly enjoy.

    /rant

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  • MR E30 325is
    replied
    Others have already touched on the counterpoint, and Varg hit the nail right on the head.

    Just to add on, I still feel a certain way about E30's and their old prices.

    I remember when I was in high school and how easy it was to convince all of my friends to buy E30's due to how much awesomeness you got for the money.

    Back in 05-06 my friends and I picked up moderately clean E30s' for 2k. We had insane amounts of fun in them together. Lots of late night drives, lots of impromptu meets in prandom parking lots, etc.

    I still feel nostalgic about those experiences. And they are becoming more and more difficult for others to duplicate. I made so many friends directly related to E30's and I feel that others are missing out on this, simply due to the cars becoming too expensive for the average high schooler to truly enjoy.

    /rant

    Leave a comment:

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