what happens to our E30's if we run out of oil?

[MOTOREN]

Sigh... I wonder when someone is going to come out with a torque monster electric motor. Conversion.

:D

Tesla...redlines at what, 13,500 rpm or something? Electric will be fun as hell to drive but boring from the sound and maintenance standpoint...Probably the wave of the future though...

[Funkmasta]

Sound? Im all about the sound... Stealth all the way!

[golde30]

If I had the cash, I would have the motor from a 324td shipped over here, and convert by car to run biodiesel. We have a co-op here in town that makes it, it's a little over $3 per gallon. My friend Seth has a MkII Golf that runs on Biodiesel, and he gets 60-70 MPG, and his car is quick!

MMmMMmMm....french fry exhaust FTW!!:roll:

[Funkmasta]

Conservation and economy FTW? :D

[nando]

I don't think any 324TD could be considered "quick"

[track6]

Okay, first of all DO NOT BELIEVE THE HYPE! There is more than enough oil in territory currently owned by the US for domestic needs for the rest of your life and that of your children and grandchildren. We just are not allowed to remove it from the ground.

Second - if you disagree or don't believe that, then start DEMANDING that the world automakers improve fuel economy. I had a '68 Mustang 289 V8 and I have a '96 Cobra 281 V8. Guess what? The '96 gets the same mileage as the '68. Now in 30 years of development - computer controlled this, fuel injected that, emissions, etc. I refuse to believe that there were no gains made in fuel economy.

The current Guinness Book of World Records for fuel efficiency was set this year in the annual Shell Challenge. It amounts to a lab experiment in an ultralight vehicle with a kid driving. The record was broken in 2005 during the SHELL OIL Eco Marathon. The new record stands at 12,665 mpg. YES, that is correct, over 12,000 MILES PER GALLON OF FUEL.

http://www.eere.energy.gov/news/archive.cfm/pubDate=%7Bd%20'2005-07-06'%7D

So if it can be done in a lab experiment, why can't a street car get 80-100?

Third, if you really are concerned about oil, then consider converting to Hydrogen. And not the hydrogen the oil companies are pushing - it's still derived from oil. Nope, I'm talking about hydrogen from WATER.
I know there is a lot of bogus info on the internet, but sometime you're bored, Google "water powered car". You'll be amazed. It just can't all be made up:

http://waterpoweredcar.com/

http://wave3.com/Global/story.asp?s=4934566

http://www.gasandoil.com/GOC/features/fex51230.htm

And there are already people SELLING hydrogen from water kits for your car:

http://www.hydrogen-boost.com/index.html

I'm not suggesting that a car can run completely on water. I'm suggesting that as a hybrid concept, it could significantly improve fuel economy. And the more people that pursue the concept, the sooner it will become commonplace.

[CarsSuck]

If I had the cash, I would have the motor from a 324td shipped over here, and convert by car to run biodiesel. We have a co-op here in town that makes it, it's a little over $3 per gallon. My friend Seth has a MkII Golf that runs on Biodiesel, and he gets 60-70 MPG, and his car is quick!

Josh is on the ball here. Biodiesel is the way to go as far as consumption and production. It takes much more energy to create ethanol than biodiesel, it offers performance nearly equivalent to diesel with no sulfur, 70% less co2 and fewer hydro carbons. NOx is nearly the same. Pure biodiesel begins to cloud around 32 degrees F. But blending helps a great deal, especially with cold additives used in the petroleum diesel.

A more resourcful and enterprising person can produce it from used cooking oils for about 50 cents a gallon on a relatively cheap setup and can use it eight months out of the year.

[BimmerToad]

I'm not worried ... my 318 is set to self destruct in 2012 anyway

[Eliminator]

Second - if you disagree or don't believe that, then start DEMANDING that the world automakers improve fuel economy. I had a '68 Mustang 289 V8 and I have a '96 Cobra 281 V8. Guess what? The '96 gets the same mileage as the '68. Now in 30 years of development - computer controlled this, fuel injected that, emissions, etc. I refuse to believe that there were no gains made in fuel economy.

It would cost more, or vehicles would need to be smaller than they are now. Currently, not many people are willing to pay more for a smaller vehicle. Even at $3, gasoline is relatively inexpensive.

Third, if you really are concerned about oil, then consider converting to Hydrogen. And not the hydrogen the oil companies are pushing - it's still derived from oil. Nope, I'm talking about hydrogen from WATER.
I know there is a lot of bogus info on the internet, but sometime you're bored, Google "water powered car". You'll be amazed. It just can't all be made up:

http://waterpoweredcar.com/

http://wave3.com/Global/story.asp?s=4934566

http://www.gasandoil.com/GOC/features/fex51230.htm

And there are already people SELLING hydrogen from water kits for your car:

http://www.hydrogen-boost.com/index.html

I'm not suggesting that a car can run completely on water. I'm suggesting that as a hybrid concept, it could significantly improve fuel economy. And the more people that pursue the concept, the sooner it will become commonplace.

Ah, yes. The old Brown's gas scam. Do a google search, this has been covered time and time again over the past couple of decades. IT is not a viable technology and never will be. It's about as feasible as turning lead into gold.

http://www.phact.org/e/bgas.htm

As for hydrogen, it is a means of STORING energy, NOT A SOURCE of energy. It either needs to be extracted from fossil fuels or from water by electrolosis, which takes an enormous amount of electricity. And where do we get the electricity from? A coal or gas burning power plant, perhaps? Sorry, but hydrogen isn't going to solve any of our problems.

[BigD]

What will happen is:

Everyone will finally start using synthetic oil and not worry about switching to it after dyno like an idiot.

And combustion cars will be converted to hydrogen, or they will synthesize gasoline. edit: reading article posted above... :P

But as has been said many times already, you won't see it. All the E30's will turn into shadows and dust before they run out of oil. E90's will be sitting out in redneck backyards, rusted out, growing weeds.

[Funkmasta]

I have learned WAAAAAAAAY more from forums than I ever could have dreamed of in school...

[MikeE30325i]

I'm not worried ... my 318 is set to self destruct in 2012 anyway

hahahahha!

[Eliminator]

too bad E85 at best means a 1:1 energy in to energy out ratio in terms of production, too bad corn is the most energy intensive crop, too bad switchgrass and wheat grass contain dangerous levels of chlorine, too bad the above crops along with others require natural gas from Saudi Arabia for both energy and fertilizer purposes and finally too bad E85 plants need miniature coal-powered plants to operate...ok I've ranted enough...

Yes, at BEST a 1:1 ratio. But I don't see that happening anytime soon. Currently I believe it takes way more energy to create ethanol than the ethanol is worth. Think about it, the process is something like this:

• Farmer tills field with DIESEL tractor
• Farmer plants crop with DIESEL tractor
• Fertilizer/insecticide is applied via airplane or DIESEL tractor
• crop is harvested with DIESEL tractor
• crop is trasported to the farm in DIESEL truck
• grain may need to be dried, using a furnace powered by FOSSIL FUELS
• crop is transported to and sold to local facility in DIESEL truck
• local facility is powered (directly or indirectly) by FOSSIL FUELS
• grain is then transported to ethanol plant in a DIESEL truck or train
• finally, grain can be converted to ethanol, in a plant powered (directly or indirectly) by FOSSIL FUELS

So, if we were to run out of fossil fuels, what are we going to run all the trucks, tractors, trains, and electric power plants on? Hydrogen? Brown's gas? Flubber?

We are better off putting the fossil fuels DIRECTLY into our cars and eliminating the wasteful process shown above.

*EDIT* Fortunately we will all be long gone before we "run out" of fossil fuels.

[BigD]

Ah, yes. The old Brown's gas scam. Do a google search, this has been covered time and time again over the past couple of decades. IT is not a viable technology and never will be. It's about as feasible as turning lead into gold.

http://www.phact.org/e/bgas.htm

As for hydrogen, it is a means of STORING energy, NOT A SOURCE of energy. It either needs to be extracted from fossil fuels or from water by electrolosis, which takes an enormous amount of electricity. And where do we get the electricity from? A coal or gas burning power plant, perhaps? Sorry, but hydrogen isn't going to solve any of our problems.

Hydrogen is the most abundant substance in the world and it has 4x the energy volume that gasoline does. Electrolysis requires 50 kwh per 1kg of hydrogen produced. Here in BC, 1kwh is 0.0633 cents, so this would cost the fuel companies a bit over 3 cents per kilo to produce, and they can have most of their raw materials back after combustion. I think you can see where this leads...

The only roadblock is replacing the network of gasoline stations with hydrogen and putting gas companies out of business. The only way this will happen is when oil becomes too expensive to be reasonable. BMW has been working on this for decades and in the 90's showed it's hydrogen E38 fleet. Now they're releasing a dual power car so you can run it on hydrogen if you find some but otherwise you can run it on gas. This is a clever way to ease people to switch.

http://www.bmwcca.org/node/5349

[Eliminator]

Hydrogen is the most abundant substance in the world and it has 4x the energy volume that gasoline does. Electrolysis requires 50 kwh per 1kg of hydrogen produced. Here in BC, 1kwh is 0.0633 cents, so this would cost the fuel companies a bit over 3 cents per kilo to produce, and they can have most of their raw materials back after combustion. I think you can see where this leads...

Let me rephrase: If all our cars were powered by hydrogen, an enormous amount of electricity would be required. Cumulatively.

http://news-service.stanford.edu/new...en-071305.html

Here's an excerpt: "The cost of making hydrogen from wind is $1.12 to $3.20 per gallon of gasoline or diesel equivalent ($3 to $7.40 per kilogram of molecular hydrogen)?on par with the current price of gas"

So, yes, I agree that it's technically feasible. But it won't happen within our lifetimes.