Porsche 951s (aka 944's) - what's your thoughts

[rwh11385]

What advice do you have on a person intrigued by this car?

I have two friends possibly looking at them. One is a male, going to pre-med and a P-car fan. Maybe his begineer Porsche in the years before becoming a doctor and getting a 911. The second is a girl. She's looking for a sports car rather than her Wrangler, and this might be perfect. (She's really hyped for BF taking her in a 2004 911 Carrera to Prom) Or I might tempt her to getting a BMW.....

Just general thoughts/opinions...... I know there are several P-car junkies on this board.

[///M42 sport]

I've always liked that style porshe. the cost for maintenence scares me though.
________
WEED VAPORIZERS

[Rob]

my roommate is on his third, and is currently pushing 300whp (on a mustang dyno) on low boost, 996 TT brakes, yada yada. Its really fast, but I dont like the ergonomics, nor the price of parts. His is highly modified, so costs of course go up. If you keep one relatively stock, it would be a good car. maintainence will hurt $$$wise, but not a lot worse than an E30.

Complicated motor and systems, so they arent very DIY friendly. When you do fuck something up, reputable Porsche shops get an assload of money to fix your mistakes.

[KenC]

The 951 is arguably the greatest handling car of all time.

Talk to Rob. His roommate has one.

[Rob]

both of the people in question would probably be better off with something else. 951s are fairly finicky, and it really takes an enthusiast to love one.

[Jonathan M3]

I've always been a fan of them. If I hadn't found an e30 M3, I was going to try to find an '88+ 944 turbo instead. Maintenance is about the same for either car, but in the end I'm glad I found my M3. :D

[M-technik-3]

I've always liked that style porshe. the cost for maintenence scares me though.

I'll second this thought, over a grand to do the cluch. If I was to get one it would be a 944 S2 or a 968 but those are both still expensive compared to the lowly 325's.

[rwh11385]

both of the people in question would probably be better off with something else. 951s are fairly finicky, and it really takes an enthusiast to love one.

Yeah, probably got a point there. I'll able to maybe pick one up when I get out of Purdue. I saw one restored yesterday, or in just awesome showroom condition, it was great.

He'll probably just keep his Accord (stock). She'll probably have eventually find something that would fit the bill......just see if she'll take a liking to E30s...... Too bad though. He's going to be close in college, and she would inevitably become closer to me when she got that car. :D And god, they are sexy cars, and fast too, and handle well I read.

[bmwannabe]

i think they are ugly in *stock form*. i dont know, that pic doesnt do much for me, but add some late model hollow spoke wheels, drop it a little, turbo, and id take it.

[natorious]

one of the few cars that would make both the e30 and the corrado go bub-bye if i found one that was in decent condition

[TIATO]

Just went through the entire 944 research thing....

Highly complex mechanicals. Preventative maintenance is cheap, major overhauls expensive. Parts much more expensive then e30 stuff.

That said, heres the stuff that would sway me
Perfect seating position, at least for me
Phenomenal handling, the cars balance is uncanny
Car feedback is amazing - steering, throttle, sound
Wonderfull motor

Here are some maintenence costs:

Every 30-40k miles: Tiiming Belt (Easy enough, but heres where it ads up) When you do the timing belt, its highly recomended that the following are changed as well - water pump, all front engine seals, guide pulleys, tensioners Figure 500-700 in parts plus another 500-700 in labor.

The 944 motor is an interference design. If the belt snaps, bye bye motor. New or rebuilt motor 3000-8000.

Clutch. The 944 has a very unique drive train layout that enabled it ti get that amazing balance. Motor and clutch are in the front, transmission in the rear. If one does the clutch, the job is so complex that its virtually mandatory to replace almost everthing in the driveline. A very complete clutch parts set will go for 500-700. Add 8-12 hours of labor to that cost.

Front control arm - about $500

The 944 is an amazing car and if one finds one that has been treated nicely and all maintence items have been kept up with, the car will be very inexpensive to own. Find a unit thats had a hard life and the bills will skyrocket. Unless the car is nechanically perfect and cheap (oxymoron) there are no real deals out there. A $3000 dollar car will need at least 2-3k to get it to mechanical parity. That said, look at cars that start at 5-6k and that have very throrough service histories.

[Jon325i]

I have a friend who runs a Porsche repair/race prep shop and whenever we start talking about water-cooled Porsches, he always reminds me of how expensive these cars can be. Over the years, he has repeatedly made a good point:

A 944 (turbo or not) may be fairly reasonable in cost when buying it, but its the maintenance costs while you own it which are the killer. You would be better off saving a bit more money and buying a 80s vintage 911SC or Carrera. Maybe not quite as fast as a 951, but regular maintenance is cheaper, it'll have better resale value, and you will be driving a legend. Only catch is learning to drive a tail-heavy car at the limit.

The last time I was at his shop, a customer had dropped off a '79 911SC for an oil change, valve adjust, and a couple of other small details. This car had 322,xxx miles on the orig. motor. Granted, for this car to go this far, its been babied most of its life. Any aggressive driving or club racing will have the engine expiring sooner, but it still should go 200K miles.

Jon

[natorious]

I have a friend who runs a Porsche repair/race prep shop and whenever we start talking about water-cooled Porsches, he always reminds me of how expensive these cars can be. Over the years, he has repeatedly made a good point:

A 944 (turbo or not) may be fairly reasonable in cost when buying it, but its the maintenance costs while you own it which are the killer. You would be better off saving a bit more money and buying a 80s vintage 911SC or Carrera. Maybe not quite as fast as a 951, but regular maintenance is cheaper, it'll have better resale value, and you will be driving a legend. Only catch is learning to drive a tail-heavy car at the limit.

The last time I was at his shop, a customer had dropped off a '79 911SC for an oil change, valve adjust, and a couple of other small details. This car had 322,xxx miles on the orig. motor. Granted, for this car to go this far, its been babied most of its life. Any aggressive driving or club racing will have the engine expiring sooner, but it still should go 200K miles.

Jon

i think you fail to realize that air-cooled porsches while cheaper to maintain for maintenance items, anything big is insanley expensive, i dont even want to think about what a clutch job costs to do on a 930

[AdamF 88iS]

I was looking at these to buy when I was E30 M3 shopping. I decided against it because the ergonomics sucked big time (non adjustable steering wheel is waaaayyy too low, pretty much in my lap) and I heard from a friend who is a porsche tech at the dealer here that they are a major PITA to work on, and cost a fortune to keep going.

[m42rowe]

A friend of mine had a NA 944(untill he rolled it) and that thing always had things that would go wrong and he payed out the ass when it came to fixing it.It was a lot of fun to drive but I would not recommend it as a daily driver.