Tough questions of a bullshit ticket! (update post 102)

[mrsleeve]

yeah your right 1/4 million mile of rail, still the point remains unchanged

[Rsully70sev]

Millions? Try thousands.

And the same could be said about speed limit signs on standard roads.

[mrsleeve]

Once again no.

By your logic, of "that's what the cop was doing"...then why do we have speed limit signs? Why don't cops just pull people over and inform them of the speed limit by handing them a citation or giving them a warning?

There should be a sign.

on the millions of miles of rail in this country, really how often should it posted every mile, every 10 miles, every 30 feet??

Besides this is common knowledge. EVERYONE knows the train tracks are a NO NO to trespass on period. People still do it and OP maybe should have been warned but......

3) Ignorance of the law is not a satisfactory defense for breaking it.

[Rsully70sev]

Once again no.

By your logic, of "that's what the cop was doing"...then why do we have speed limit signs? Why don't cops just pull people over and inform them of the speed limit by handing them a citation or giving them a warning?

There should be a sign.

[mrsleeve]

Your right, Union Pacific makes tons of money off tickets, STFU! We make an average of 100k per train load, fining someone is peanuts and does not validate the cops jobs. What validates there job is when they saved someone's life or kept someone from causing 100 of thousands of dollars in damages.


As for the OP, like I said earlier good luck with this, Federal Railroad Administration's laws will supersede any California laws on trespassing because the railroads are much like an airport's laws with the FAA. The Union Pacific police are not like your typical city cops, there job is to protect and serve the Railroads, not the public.

listen to the guy that works for the rail road in question

[CleanAzzE30z]

And thats where the crux of the situation is.... there are many ways to handle a situation. They handled it aggressively and poorly IMO. But does that make them accountable? not likely. Whatever their reasons or methods are, the fact remains they may have been on semi-solid legal grounds for issuing the citation, but I still think there can be ways to minimize the damage to criminal record and wallet...

[dvck]

e30e, the sad thing is for Iron-E and I, that you make alot of sense.

I do understand everything you are saying and it makes perfect sense, had the officer made
any mention of any of what you're saying i wouldn't have been as mad.

Still per what you are saying as far as distances, safety, etc, we were not breaking any of those
rules, and i think i can speak on behalf of us both when i say we would have fully understood
what we were ignorant to, and have been on our way, making sure not to come back.

[CleanAzzE30z]

The officers that gave the citation have some federal power, much like TSA agents. I highly doubt Union Pacific is setting quota's to catch trespassers as I've personally seen similar insistence where warnings are given.

I am asking this purely out of curiosity and for the benefit of my own knowledge because I am always looking to learn from people that know (not in a sarcastic endeavor). Do even the LA Metrolink attendants/officers have federal powers? Again, I say that the rails are a whole different ballgame and was applying my extensive felonious criminal/traffic authority knowledge experiences. :)

[e30e]

then build a fence or have a sign so the 99.9999999999% other people in the world get it.


Metapwhore:
How can you know you're trespassing in some else's woods if there aren't any markers to tell you so?

Read my editted post, RR was there first, there is a Railway for Railcars and Trains, not for civilians and cars; this isn't nature. Plus that is what the cop was doing, his job. Just like a forest ranger will tell you in the forest your trespassing.

[Dozyproductions]

As for any comments of the Railway was empty, its open access blah blah blah....The FRA and the UP don't see things that way.

then build a fence or have a sign so the 99.9999999999% other people in the world get it.


Metapwhore:
How can you know you're trespassing in some else's woods if there aren't any markers to tell you so?

[e30e]

WHat he means is that they write enough bullshit citations to keep the funds rolling in so that the police force (or in this case the railroad authority be they Amtrak or L.A. Metrolink which wouldnt fall into the federal jurisdiction I believe since thats a city/county entity) doesnt have to be scaled back by budget cuts. Having a secondary effect of justifying their existence as well. Im not saying I agree in this particular case (although I dont disagree, seeing as there are constantly stories of "quotas" leaking out) but I dont find it preposterous, either. Im simply clarifying what I believe his point was trying to state in case clarification was needed although you seem like you have a handle on it.

In any case, every response posted here is conjecture and hearsay in relation to this specific case. Its best to check it out in case any number of these things posted are true.

Mariano

I agree, being an employ of this company I can tell you this. The officers that gave the citation have some federal power, much like TSA agents. I highly doubt Union Pacific is setting quota's to catch trespassers as I've personally seen similar insistence where warnings are given. A lot of it has to do with the person's responses receiving the warning or there actions. I'm not saying the OP was was rude. You guys also have no clue what was going on that rail line or how busy it was maybe or if the Federal Rail Road Administration was in the area and he's on bitch detail to clear the area. Union Pacific can be fined a lot more having non-certified railway workers or people in the area by the FRA, hence probably why the officer did what he did. Its not so much a trespassing issue like crossing the line as much as its a safety/vandalism issue that gets treated as trespassing.

As for any comments of the Railway was empty, its open access blah blah blah....The FRA and the UP don't see things that way.

I think it would be cheaper to put up a fence than to employ these 2 douches if protecting the railroads is so important.

That train line doesnt look like its seen a train in a long time either as mentioned.

I think your 4th and 5th pics are very relevant and you should most definitely present these at court.

Another thing you may want to mention is the fact that they have not put the correct address on the notice, technicalities like that have helped me in the past

Wrong on many many accounts, Union Pacific has 33,000 miles of track, it'll cost millions of dollar to fence an area plus it would have an negative effect on the environment.

If the RR is in LA chances are it see's trains as LA Ports are one of our highest flow area's of train traffic. Our tracks look like shit because there old, were in the process of ripping out all old track and replacing it.

Being on property without proper safety gear is a violation of FRA rules will get Union Pacific fined, hence why the officer's job is get people off property.

[CleanAzzE30z]

WHat he means is that they write enough bullshit citations to keep the funds rolling in so that the police force (or in this case the railroad authority be they Amtrak or L.A. Metrolink which wouldnt fall into the federal jurisdiction I believe since thats a city/county entity) doesnt have to be scaled back by budget cuts. Having a secondary effect of justifying their existence as well. Im not saying I agree in this particular case (although I dont disagree, seeing as there are constantly stories of "quotas" leaking out) but I dont find it preposterous, either. Im simply clarifying what I believe his point was trying to state in case clarification was needed although you seem like you have a handle on it.

In any case, every response posted here is conjecture and hearsay in relation to this specific case. Its best to check it out in case any number of these things posted are true.

Mariano

[IRON-E]

You're not understanding what I'm saying...at all.

By your logic, you're telling me that the only way police substantiate their job is when they save a life. Not with speeding, seat belt, red light, tespassing, fix-it, stop sign, dwb, DUI, exhaust modification, etc etc tickets.

Fortune 500 companies want to know WHY the police are there, why they are paying them salary, and what they are doing on a daily basis. Yes, it substantiates their job. You're right, I'm sure UP could give a fuck about $1,000 but writing tickets like this keeps the cop(s) employed. They don't just let employees run free to save the world, or else everyone would be getting blow jobs in cart #3...and getting paid at the same time.

Bingo!

[Rsully70sev]

You're not understanding what I'm saying...at all.

By your logic, you're telling me that the only way police substantiate their job is when they save a life. Not with speeding, seat belt, red light, tespassing, fix-it, stop sign, dwb, DUI, exhaust modification, etc etc tickets.

Fortune 500 companies want to know WHY the police are there, why they are paying them salary, and what they are doing on a daily basis. Yes, it substantiates their job. You're right, I'm sure UP could give a fuck about $1,000 but writing tickets like this keeps the cop(s) employed. They don't just let employees run free to save the world, or else everyone would be getting blow jobs in cart #3...and getting paid at the same time.

[greanthumb]

E30e...no, just no.

Of course their motive is revenue. Why do you think it's a billion dollar industry? They KNEW these guys weren't here for vandalism or theft, they saw an opportunity to make a quick thousand and substantiate their jobs.

I'm sure they got a hand job when they got back to HQ for writing these guys up.

:giggle::giggle::giggle::nice::nice::nice: