Question for Mac guys only.

[Tvan]

Obviously reading comprehension is not an admissions requirement or even a "deans list" requirement at Purdue.

Hey there, not all of us have the same mental capacity as Heeter.

Just wait 'till the intel macs are released. I wish they had announced the switch before I bought my powerbook, I would have waited.

[george graves]

I know only a little about mac's. But I have bought a lot of re-furbished and "b-stock" equipment - I've never been let down from factory re-furbished stuff from major brands (IBM, Dell, Sony, ect....)

Just make sure it's not a used re-furbished item.

A factory re-furb Item should still come in factory packaging(more or less)...

[grapedrink]

I am glad this thread has been posted. I am also considering a Mac here in the next month.

Few questions that you guys could clear up for me.

Mainly I just use the computer for internet, songs and school work. You guys would recomend the ibook correct?

If I wait 1-6 months for a new Mac I would be getting one with an Intel chip. The advantage of this is? Downside to buying one now?

[permit]

Intel-chipped Macs will be much cheaper because now they don't have to make their own chip. They (especially laptops, I am predicting) will be running faster speeds. They just increased resolution on Powerbooks, and they with a new laptop design, they should introduce a book with an even higher resolution.

Negative to buying one now is they'll be outdated in about 7 months, max. The first of the Intel Macs may have a few bugs and faults, but they'll still be much better than what they have now.

I will be buying a new lappie once the Intels prove to be successful. iBooks though are a nice introduction to Apple, especially if you're just looking to do internet, songs, and school work. Safari/Firefox are great on the Macs, no popups, everything is very secure. iTunes is awesome...I'm sure you know that by know since PCs have it too. Microsoft Office 2004 is a great investment for school work.

Refurbished computers directly from Apple will work like new, and they'll fix it if it happens to have a fault.

[grapedrink]

Damn. Looks like it would be wise to hold off for a few months to see what Mac and Intel are doing. Why coulden't they make the announcement before christmas and sell them this holiday season :(

Also looking at the refurbished computers. Seems like a good deal to me and everything of a new one can also be added.

[grapedrink]

I herd a long time ago that Mac specs like a 1.5ghz computer is equal to a 1.8-2.0ghz PC. Is that true? The way Macs are setup and made they can get away with less speed but still be as functional and peform the same?

[Tvan]

Intel-chipped Macs will be much cheaper because now they don't have to make their own chip. They (especially laptops, I am predicting) will be running faster speeds.

Actually, the G4 chips were made by Freescale. The intel based macs will be cheaper because Intel has about 10 times as many production plants as Freescale, and they are funded by all of the major pc makers, so they can afford to pay out the ass for research and development. The processor itself will run at comparible speeds to the current G4, because that is how fast the current intel centrino processors are.

If I wait 1-6 months for a new Mac I would be getting one with an Intel chip. The advantage of this is? Downside to buying one now?

The downside to buying one now is that the intel x86 architecture demands that programs be written in a different manner than G4/G5 chips. If you buy a mac now, it will be emulating newer programs written for intel macs on-the-fly, meaning a consiterable loss in computing power.

Why coulden't they make the announcement before christmas and sell them this holiday season

They made the announcement over the summer because that's when IBM gave up on developing a G5 (64 bit) mobile processor. They kept melting laptop cases because they couldn't get them to run cool enough. In July Apple announced that they would switch to intel, which was a freaking huge change. What they didn't tell us until later, is that Apple had developed a version of OS X in secret to be used on the intel x86 platform. It is exceptional that they will be able to make such big a change in less than a year. Also, January has historically been a big release month for new products,mostly because no one else releases at this time, ususally landing them good press coverage.

I herd a long time ago that Mac specs like a 1.5ghz computer is equal to a 1.8-2.0ghz PC. Is that true? The way Macs are setup and made they can get away with less speed but still be as functional and peform the same?

Due to the Unix base and excellent programming, OS X is able to run on much less powerful processors than Windows PC's. Unfortunatly, instead of demanding as much computing power, they do typically require more RAM than comarible PC's do. If you ever want to be impressed by how fast a computer can run on old hardware, look as some running linux, most distros will run hella fast on a pentium III.

Mainly I just use the computer for internet, songs and school work. You guys would recomend the ibook correct?

Yes, the ibook will definatly work for you.

[grapedrink]

Thanks Permit and Tvan. I will hold off for Intel chips in the laptops so it doesn't get outdated in less than a year.

[Tvan]

You should check the news at macworld.com and macaddict.com for updates on expected release dates.

O yea, I'm an idiot. Freescale is a semiconductor firm that split off of Motorola, they make the G4. IBM makes the G5.

[permit]

I didn't mean that Apple physically made their own chips...but they bought from someone far less popular than Intel.

Macs are able to be faster on less processor performance; for example, PCs have been running on 3ghz+ for some time now, and Mac has yet to cross the 2.7 mark, yet they still out perform the Dells, IBMs, Gateways...whatever you guys use, Sonys, etc.

Yeah, January is usually when they put new products out, and June is when they announce future products. I got my lappie two years ago for XMas, and ~12 days later, it was completely outdated. Thats how they get your money though, great marketing skills.

[Tvan]

Macs are able to be faster on less processor performance; for example, PCs have been running on 3ghz+ for some time now, and Mac has yet to cross the 2.7 mark, yet they still out perform the Dells, IBMs, Gateways...whatever you guys use, Sonys, etc.

Intel has not been able to cool anything faster than 3.8 ghz without making it extremely innefficient. Their new plan is to use multiple cores running at lower speeds in order to increase processing power and not dramatically increase heat. Each core acts as an indivisual processor, which makes a computer able to multitask better (this is why a dual core processor is actually not ideal for gaming.) Pentium D and AMD X2 processors are the current dual core models for household PC's. Currently Apple offers dual-core G5 processors in their powermacs, which is why they don't need to run faster than 2.5 ghz.

[permit]

G5s are now optional with quad 2.5Ghz processors.

Powerbooks NEED Intel chips...they can't run any faster than the current 1.67Ghz without overheating. They were actually considering water-cooled laptops, and there were some crazy drawings made for a possible G5 lappie, just so it would keep cool. As an example of how hot the laptops already run...my buddy tuned his 1.5Ghz Powerbook to run at 1.83Ghz (which is totally possible, the 1.33/1.5/1.67 processors are all the same, just limited for each stage, 1.83 is the absolute max for that processor when completely unleashed of limitations), and it lasted about half an hour before it completely fried itself from overheating. The G5 tower can pull off quads because they're stuffed with heatsinks and about six fans. Apple is doing the right thing by going to Intel.

[Tvan]

They made the announcement over the summer because that's when IBM gave up on developing a G5 (64 bit) mobile processor. They kept melting laptop cases because they couldn't get them to run cool enough.

And for clarification, the quad G5 is just two dual-core processors on the same board.

I actually would have prefered Apple go with AMD for the Athalon XP/FX/X2, but the Turions and mobile Athalons just plain and simple aren't up to par with the centrino.

[Beej '86 325es]

Negative to buying one now is they'll be outdated in about 7 months, max. The first of the Intel Macs may have a few bugs and faults, but they'll still be much better than what they have now.

I think we'll be surprised with a smooth transition. Since Apple came out with OSX, they've been simultaneously developing OSX and all of their software on Mac and Intel machines. They plan to release versions of software that will support both processors for quite a while.

[Julien]

I'm the fence too at the moment. I own a ibook g4 800 which is going to be replaced by warranty (machine has been declared un-repairable) .. Either i get a new iBook this winter when i go back to america for christmas. OR i wait for the YONAH based macs to come out next quarter and possibly have issues getting software for a while... such as VLC, Photoshop, Macromedia Suite, Final Cut Pro etc. perhaps the yonah's will emulate the environment for these to come out at first?


Sorry for the thread jack
Julien