The R3V Bicycle Thread

[quikveedb2]

Built this up for myself;



2014 Specialized Enduro Evo. I swapped the OEM parts for i-spec XTR/Saint hybrid brakes, i-spec XT shifter, XT cranks (no logos), a 34t Saint chainring (that I'm already topping out, I've got a Saint 36t to swap on), a Zee DH (short cage) derailleur, Shimano DX pedals (not pictured, and to be replaced with Saint pedals when I go to work Tuesday), and a DT 440 front hub/DT 3-something hoop. I've got a custom built SR Suntour Duralux coming this week as well to replace the OEM X-Fusion Venagance, so I can have an air spring & high and low-speed compression adjustment, and then I'll just ride it. But really, I'll probably keep swapping parts. It's fun on the Trestle Bike Park trails, which I work 100 feet from.

[BlackbirdM3]

Built this up for myself;



2014 Specialized Enduro Evo. I swapped the OEM parts for i-spec XTR/Saint hybrid brakes, i-spec XT shifter, XT cranks (no logos), a 34t Saint chainring (that I'm already topping out, I've got a Saint 36t to swap on), a Zee DH (short cage) derailleur, Shimano DX pedals (not pictured, and to be replaced with Saint pedals when I go to work Tuesday), and a DT 440 front hub/DT 3-something hoop. I've got a custom built SR Suntour Duralux coming this week as well to replace the OEM X-Fusion Venagance, so I can have an air spring & high and low-speed compression adjustment, and then I'll just ride it. But really, I'll probably keep swapping parts. It's fun on the Trestle Bike Park trails, which I work 100 feet from.

I'd say put a double if not a triple chainring up front and have a more versatile bike. I look at a bike like that and just scratch my head wondering why run a middle ring that restricts you from actually going fast? You have all the suspension travel, but no top end gear. I keep finding that I run away from guys on setups like this with my 1996 era Voodoo hardtail with 3 inches of travel up front simply because I have taller gears. Put some big gears on that thing so you can go fast! Its one thing if you are riding the North Shore of Vancouver, and need a bash guard, but if you don't need a bash guard, put a big ring on there and roost!

Will

[quikveedb2]

I'd say put a double if not a triple chainring up front and have a more versatile bike. I look at a bike like that and just scratch my head wondering why run a middle ring that restricts you from actually going fast? You have all the suspension travel, but no top end gear. I keep finding that I run away from guys on setups like this with my 1996 era Voodoo hardtail with 3 inches of travel up front simply because I have taller gears. Put some big gears on that thing so you can go fast! Its one thing if you are riding the North Shore of Vancouver, and need a bash guard, but if you don't need a bash guard, put a big ring on there and roost!

Will

I'm not trying to build a versatile bike. I'm building this bike around riding the bike park I work at. Who buys a 180mm bike for trail riding? Triples and doubles are for XC bikes, this is not a bike for riding XC, this is a gravity bike. Thanks for the thoughts.

[Joe G]

My dad's old Schwinn Super Sport. Hasn't seen much use in the past decade or so. I gave it new tires, cables/housing, cassette, chain, and a full tune up and a lot of love from a wire wheel.

It is a 1966, he bought it in '67 after my grandpa gave him the extra money to get the next step up from the bike he had initially saved for. I'm pretty stoked to be riding it.

[bumster22]

I'm not trying to build a versatile bike. I'm building this bike around riding the bike park I work at. Who buys a 180mm bike for trail riding? Triples and doubles are for XC bikes, this is not a bike for riding XC, this is a gravity bike. Thanks for the thoughts.

I concur 100% with the above statement. Awesome bike!

[BlackbirdM3]

I'm not trying to build a versatile bike. I'm building this bike around riding the bike park I work at. Who buys a 180mm bike for trail riding? Triples and doubles are for XC bikes, this is not a bike for riding XC, this is a gravity bike. Thanks for the thoughts.

Hence my statement that you need bigger gearing if you wish to go fast. If it were mine it would have an 11/28 cassette in the back and a 46 tooth big ring up front, or perhaps a 50 tooth. A 36 tooth ring up front is useless unless. With that gearing you are spun out at what 20mph? Less? What is the point, I can go that fast on the flat. If you want a gravity bike that doesn't go uphill, ditch the mega wide gearing in the back, put a real big ring up front and roost. Dicking around with a tiny front ring on a bike built to go downhill fast is counterproductive.

Just my view.

Will

[quikveedb2]

I'm easily hitting 35+ on single track with the 34-11 combo and clearing jumps of equal footage, 36-11 should be plenty aggressive. I could run a tighter cassette, but WP has a few quick climbs here & there that having a little low range is nice for. Take a look at any modern 1x set up on the market from SRAM or Shimano and tell me how many 50t chainrings you see. I've been a bike mechanic for over a decade, I think I know how to build a bike. Sam Hill didn't use a giant chainring to win Mt St. Anne, and I guess he still managed to go fast, faster than the rest if the fastest people in the world. Come on up for a visit & we can see if your hard tail with a 3" travel fork can keep up ;)

On an unrelated note, here's a pic of Cedric Gracia & me in the shop from a week or so ago during the EWS. One of my favorite pros I've met by far. He's not slow, and he doesn't have a 50t on his bike, either.

[LateFan]

Just a philosophical musing here, but this is the very nature of the bicycle industry. There is always something new that's faster, lighter, stiffer, cooler, or whatever. And, by extension, whatever you're currently riding is outdated, heavy, flexy, and uncool. Without fail. Look at the Guru Photon. It's a 670g 54cm frame.

Me, I'll just be running a 20 lb steel road bike with 9 speeds until I wear out the drivetrain in another 5000 miles.

We are traveling on the same boat.

The basic 2-triangle bike frame has evolved to perfection long ago as far as geometry, efficiency, and use of materials. The only way to improve that is to advance material science and weight. Unless they come up with "air cogs" there's only so light you can make gears.

My 18 lb steel Colnago will probably last me until I can't ride. Someone says "nice bike" almost every day - it's weird. And so fun to ride, which is why we do it.

[LateFan]

A long time ago I was frequently in a cool & funky bike shop / co-op in Seattle called Wright Bros, in Fremont. You could take a bearing class in the evening, and it would get later, and later, and someone ordered pizzas, and then the wine came out… It's midnight, my bike's in pieces, I've got to ride it home, and I need it for work in the morning! But I loved that shop.

A guy the shop guys knew came in one Saturday morning, with a completely sweet, bad-ass road bike. He had spent the last year building it to perfection and it was finally finished. Custom painted. Campy everything. Like me, he was a weight weenie - he shopped and machined every part down to the minimum. It was light / stiff / fast.

He came in to show it off. Everyone was impressed.

The old guy behind the counter pointed to his chest and said, "y'know, it ain't the bike, it's the pump!"

[BlackbirdM3]

I'm easily hitting 35+ on single track with the 34-11 combo and clearing jumps of equal footage, 36-11 should be plenty aggressive. I could run a tighter cassette, but WP has a few quick climbs here & there that having a little low range is nice for. Take a look at any modern 1x set up on the market from SRAM or Shimano and tell me how many 50t chainrings you see. I've been a bike mechanic for over a decade, I think I know how to build a bike. Sam Hill didn't use a giant chainring to win Mt St. Anne, and I guess he still managed to go fast, faster than the rest if the fastest people in the world. Come on up for a visit & we can see if your hard tail with a 3" travel fork can keep up ;)

On an unrelated note, here's a pic of Cedric Gracia & me in the shop from a week or so ago during the EWS. One of my favorite pros I've met by far. He's not slow, and he doesn't have a 50t on his bike, either.

A bike mechanic for over a decade? Really? Guess what, I started riding in '91, before there was suspension on 99.9% of the mtbs out there. I remember when the Rock Shox Mag 10 was released, and shortly there after the Mag 21. A few years later when a downhill bike was 3 inches of suspension on both ends, Miles Rockwell was doing about 60 mph with a 60 tooth big ring (I think, Its been a few years.) I watched all the cool aftermarket companies come and go through the early and mid 90s, and still have a lot of the best of the best on my bike from that era. Yeah, it still works and hasn't broken. Oh yeah its light, lighter than much of what is on the market now. Yes, I still ride Shimano M900 and 950 8spd on the dirt because I seriously don't need any more gears than that, oh yeah, with an 11-28 cassette in the back and a 24 tooth bailout gear and either a 34 or 36 middle ring and either a 46 or 48 tooth big ring depending on what bike I happen to be riding.

I took this out a couple weeks ago for a ride. I dropped everyone up the hills, and when it came time to go down the hills all the guys on the big hit bikes told me to go ahead because they were just going to slow me down...



Sure enough I was waiting at the bottom of every decent for them. That tells me either the bike setup sucks, or they suck, because I'm rusty as hell. I'm far slower on a dh then I was 15 years ago when I actually raced. Oh yeah, those are the 2 inch travel early Mag 21s and real cantilever brakes on the S-Works.

The bike industry doesn't know how to spec a bike correctly anymore. A $10K road bike comes with the same gearing I run on my mtb, (Why do I want Juniors gearing on my roadbike? Seriously a 36/50 with an 11/28 cassette for the road? Its USELESS unless you are a very green beginner woman.) Its all gimmicks and BS now. Its all about an image, not about having a properly setup product that is well thought out. Sure micro drive (Coined by Suntour about 1992 for compact gearing) has its place for the road if you happen to be doing mega hard core touring in the Rockies with 100lbs of stuff on your bike while pulling a trailer. But on a race bike that has two water bottle mounts? I see crap like that and think Face-palm. WTF?

The bike industry is driven by wannabes now. The bikes are built for people who want to look like they are riding the real deal but lack the fitness to actually ride the real deal. I've seen all the current fads come and go before, just as they will again. Height adjustable seatposts? They had those in the late '80s. 650C, 29inch wheels? Yep came and went before the '80s were over because they weren't as good as a 26 inch wheel. Oval chainrings? Yep, those were over and done with in the '80s as well (Shimano Bio-pace, the idea actually has merit and wasn't a bad idea. My point is, the ROTOR rings are far from a new idea.) Mavic had electronic shifting in the early '90s, again, not a new idea.

These days I just shake my head and wonder what happened to the industry that I knew back when the goal was to build the best parts/bikes $ could buy rather than things that have a shelf life of 6 months due to planned obsolescence. I used to love going to Interbike to see who had the latest and greatest cool stuff. Now there is nothing cool, just junk made of plastic (aka carbon fiber). Its a bad thing when you walk into a bike shop with a big wad of $$$$$ in your pocket looking to buy a new bike, someone asks "Can I help you?" and you answer "No, you don't have any bikes with real gearing on them." To which you get a blank stare with the question "what do you mean real gearing?" To which I respond, something with a 24/36/46 combo up front and an 11-28 cassette for the dirt, and a 39/53 11-23 for the road. This is then followed by a blank stare and the comment, "thats not standard..." Those ratios have been the standard for road for the past 30 years, and was the standard for dirt for years as well.

I'm calling epic fail on the whole bicycle industry.

Will

[eduTechnic]

Huge Ds up in here. The retard fight is outside boys. Lose the attitude and enjoy your hobbies. I can throw a football a quarter mile.

[bumster22]

A bike mechanic for over a decade? Really? Guess what, I started riding in '91, before there was suspension on 99.9% of the mtbs out there. I remember when the Rock Shox Mag 10 was released, and shortly there after the Mag 21. A few years later when a downhill bike was 3 inches of suspension on both ends, Miles Rockwell was doing about 60 mph with a 60 tooth big ring (I think, Its been a few years.) I watched all the cool aftermarket companies come and go through the early and mid 90s, and still have a lot of the best of the best on my bike from that era. Yeah, it still works and hasn't broken. Oh yeah its light, lighter than much of what is on the market now. Yes, I still ride Shimano M900 and 950 8spd on the dirt because I seriously don't need any more gears than that, oh yeah, with an 11-28 cassette in the back and a 24 tooth bailout gear and either a 34 or 36 middle ring and either a 46 or 48 tooth big ring depending on what bike I happen to be riding.

I took this out a couple weeks ago for a ride. I dropped everyone up the hills, and when it came time to go down the hills all the guys on the big hit bikes told me to go ahead because they were just going to slow me down...


Sure enough I was waiting at the bottom of every decent for them. That tells me either the bike setup sucks, or they suck, because I'm rusty as hell. I'm far slower on a dh then I was 15 years ago when I actually raced. Oh yeah, those are the 2 inch travel early Mag 21s and real cantilever brakes on the S-Works.

The bike industry doesn't know how to spec a bike correctly anymore. A $10K road bike comes with the same gearing I run on my mtb, (Why do I want Juniors gearing on my roadbike? Seriously a 36/50 with an 11/28 cassette for the road? Its USELESS unless you are a very green beginner woman.) Its all gimmicks and BS now. Its all about an image, not about having a properly setup product that is well thought out. Sure micro drive (Coined by Suntour about 1992 for compact gearing) has its place for the road if you happen to be doing mega hard core touring in the Rockies with 100lbs of stuff on your bike while pulling a trailer. But on a race bike that has two water bottle mounts? I see crap like that and think Face-palm. WTF?

The bike industry is driven by wannabes now. The bikes are built for people who want to look like they are riding the real deal but lack the fitness to actually ride the real deal. I've seen all the current fads come and go before, just as they will again. Height adjustable seatposts? They had those in the late '80s. 650C, 29inch wheels? Yep came and went before the '80s were over because they weren't as good as a 26 inch wheel. Oval chainrings? Yep, those were over and done with in the '80s as well (Shimano Bio-pace, the idea actually has merit and wasn't a bad idea. My point is, the ROTOR rings are far from a new idea.) Mavic had electronic shifting in the early '90s, again, not a new idea.

These days I just shake my head and wonder what happened to the industry that I knew back when the goal was to build the best parts/bikes $ could buy rather than things that have a shelf life of 6 months due to planned obsolescence. I used to love going to Interbike to see who had the latest and greatest cool stuff. Now there is nothing cool, just junk made of plastic (aka carbon fiber). Its a bad thing when you walk into a bike shop with a big wad of $$$$$ in your pocket looking to buy a new bike, someone asks "Can I help you?" and you answer "No, you don't have any bikes with real gearing on them." To which you get a blank stare with the question "what do you mean real gearing?" To which I respond, something with a 24/36/46 combo up front and an 11-28 cassette for the dirt, and a 39/53 11-23 for the road. This is then followed by a blank stare and the comment, "thats not standard..." Those ratios have been the standard for road for the past 30 years, and was the standard for dirt for years as well.

I'm calling epic fail on the whole bicycle industry.

Will

Will, it's 2014 now! Welcome! Step away and learn from the past, embrace the future and live in the moment.

48,50 or 60 tooth rings are stupid on any MTB.

[BlackbirdM3]

Will, it's 2014 now! Welcome! Step away and learn from the past, embrace the future and live in the moment.

48,50 or 60 tooth rings are stupid on any MTB.

I usually run a 46 tooth big ring, and use it all the time. Anything less is worthless.

The future has nothing for me. The materials used is crap (carbon fiber) the parts cost entirely too much and don't last for shit. I don't need 11 speeds in the back, and I don't want to be replacing my group every year. I'm sticking with my titanium frames, M950 8 spd XTR and Campy Record 10 spd (on the road obviously) I don't need disk brakes, electronic suspensions or derailleurs. Hell, I'd be more than happy to show up to a cross country race on my S works that I posted above and I'd beat a good portion of the field. My Ti Voodoo would do even better, mostly because its not like riding a wet noodle.

I'll race you down the Kamikaze at Mammoth I'll at least ride my Klein Adept (its only 12 years old) full suspension with a 50 tooth big ring, you can have fun with your 34. We'll see who gets to the bottom first. You'll be spun out at 25, I'll be spun out at about 40. Have you done 50+ off road? I have. Its been years, but I've done it, on a hardtail no less. Guess what, I had a 50 tooth big ring on the bike. Am I a bad ass fearless downhiller who chucks his bike of buildings or cliffs? Nope, I'm a shitty climber XC racer who gets down the hill as fast as absolutely possible and rips everywhere else.

My point is, the bike industry now sucks. I'd love to get back into it, except there is nothing in it for me. I can't think of a single product that gets my attention, that I would want to own, and therefore want to sell. Not a damn thing (Ok, I lied, some of the Time trial stuff is kinda cool, mostly because its all about going fast.) I also don't want to work on the modern crap as well.

Have fun with your gear limited downhill bike. Don't let me slow you down.

Will

[bumster22]

I usually run a 46 tooth big ring, and use it all the time. Anything less is worthless.

The future has nothing for me. The materials used is crap (carbon fiber) the parts cost entirely too much and don't last for shit. I don't need 11 speeds in the back, and I don't want to be replacing my group every year. I'm sticking with my titanium frames, M950 8 spd XTR and Campy Record 10 spd (on the road obviously) I don't need disk brakes, electronic suspensions or derailleurs. Hell, I'd be more than happy to show up to a cross country race on my S works that I posted above and I'd beat a good portion of the field. My Ti Voodoo would do even better, mostly because its not like riding a wet noodle.

I'll race you down the Kamikaze at Mammoth I'll at least ride my Klein Adept (its only 12 years old) full suspension with a 50 tooth big ring, you can have fun with your 34. We'll see who gets to the bottom first. You'll be spun out at 25, I'll be spun out at about 40. Have you done 50+ off road? I have. Its been years, but I've done it, on a hardtail no less. Guess what, I had a 50 tooth big ring on the bike. Am I a bad ass fearless downhiller who chucks his bike of buildings or cliffs? Nope, I'm a shitty climber XC racer who gets down the hill as fast as absolutely possible and rips everywhere else.

My point is, the bike industry now sucks. I'd love to get back into it, except there is nothing in it for me. I can't think of a single product that gets my attention, that I would want to own, and therefore want to sell. Not a damn thing (Ok, I lied, some of the Time trial stuff is kinda cool, mostly because its all about going fast.) I also don't want to work on the modern crap as well.

Have fun with your gear limited downhill bike. Don't let me slow you down.

Will

It's funny how you are challenging someone you have never met.

Just for reference, I started MTB 3 years before you did. I have own many XC and DH MTB and gears through all those years. And I still do own many of them. I still am very much active in biking activities.

Yes, I have gone faster than 50+ on a MTB. And that is back in the 90's when we were racing on old fire road pretty much. Riding a modern downhill bike with 38 or 40 tooth ring, racing down the old Kamikaze course at Mammoth. I WILL run your ass over with your antique 50 tooth ring bike. The suspension and bike design had come a long way from the early days. It truly is for the better.

It's ok not to buy newer stuff and use what you have. Two of my DH bike still got 8 speeds drivertrain. During my DH run, I use 4-5 gears max. Go ride the new Rockshox Pike, it's amazing. It has come a long way from the RS1 days. Suspension and disk brake is a heaven sent creation for MTB. All the newer bike and gears the technology are light years better than it had ever been.

I do get what you are saying about too many choices and standard. It's getting out of hand on new standard for BB, cranks, headset, drivetrain, wheel size, axle size and spacing.

Ride on, regardless if it's newer or old classic bike.

[burkey001]

Wow, such anger, much angst over past glory.

I like bikes :) I have only been riding 20 years, so excuse me for being new :)

This is my new toy. There are many like it, but this one is mine.