Michael Moore :SiCKO

[blunttech]

If I think that drug companies are ripping off sick people I should move to a different country? Give me a break. Even the mega rich with awesome healthcare would admit that there is a bit of gouging going on.

do you know why the "mega rich" have awesome healthcare?
because they busted their ass to be successful so they are able to afford whatever THEY CHOOSE to purchase. why does everyone want to penalize success? its like a bunch of fucking communists. this is the land of opportunity. if you dont like your status in society change it.

[uofom3]

do you know why the "mega rich" have awesome healthcare?
because they busted their ass to be successful so they are able to afford whatever THEY CHOOSE to purchase. why does everyone want to penalize success? its like a bunch of fucking communists. this is the land of opportunity. if you dont like your status in society change it.

Blunt for president '08.

I'd love to buy you a beer... but sadly, I'm nowhere near "God's country"

[Tavern Gnome]

do you know why the "mega rich" have awesome healthcare?
because they busted their ass to be successful so they are able to afford whatever THEY CHOOSE to purchase. why does everyone want to penalize success? its like a bunch of fucking communists. this is the land of opportunity. if you dont like your status in society change it.

Yeah I know what you're saying Blunt and I only used "mega rich" as an example of the opposite end of the spectrum. I'm certainly not the type hand out free money to a dumbass who wants to sit on the curb and drink thier life away but at the same time we can't all be rich. There are plenty of good people out there who have fallen on hard times. There is no reason why those people should be overlooked or taken advantage of. I'm really not looking for an argument. I just can't stand when people say "if you don't like it, get the fuck out". That not very American, or maybe it is nowadays.

[blunttech]

Blunt for president '08.

I'd love to buy you a beer... but sadly, I'm nowhere near "God's country"

Thanks man but thats alright, i dont drink. just draw a cock n balls on something and make the world a little bit better place

[uofom3]

^
fair enough.

It could be a bottle of water i guess, work with me here ;)

[speedhop]

Yeah I know what you're saying Blunt and I only used "mega rich" as an example of the opposite end of the spectrum. I'm certainly not the type hand out free money to a dumbass who wants to sit on the curb and drink thier life away but at the same time we can't all be rich. There are plenty of good people out there who have fallen on hard times. There is no reason why those people should be overlooked or taken advantage of. I'm really not looking for an argument. I just can't stand when people say "if you don't like it, get the fuck out". That not very American, or maybe it is nowadays.

^^This hits the nail on the head. America is too far past the idea of government health care because a large number utilize the benefits of our current system and hard working as a tool for their own laziness. In fact the government shouldn't have anything to do with it...look at how corrupt every portion of our American existence is. The point of the movie (however ridiculously skewed it was) was to inform the public of a problem. I think it makes a bold statement when in order to notify our public we must do it via entertainment...

[Ray McCooney]

do you know why the "mega rich" have awesome healthcare?
because they busted their ass to be successful so they are able to afford whatever THEY CHOOSE to purchase. why does everyone want to penalize success? its like a bunch of fucking communists. this is the land of opportunity. if you dont like your status in society change it.

Wow, someone who actually grasps the concept that is the framework of this Republic that we are all so fortunate to enjoy. Well played sir.

[Ryan Stewart]

If I think that drug companies are ripping off sick people I should move to a different country? Give me a break. Even the mega rich with awesome healthcare would admit that there is a bit of gouging going on.

These evil "gouging" health care companies GIVE my girlfriend a $1400/month perscription because she is deemed unable to afford it because she is a grad student who only works 30 hours a week in a lab (making mid 20s/yr).

Just in case you didnt hear that I said GIVE, as in free. And the govt has nothing to do with it outside of making the tax form she sent in to the company to prove she only made 24k last year.

The companies arent gouging either. The reason it costs 10x as much to buy a drug than it costs the company to PRODUCE is because companies have a shitload of sunk research costs to recoup. A patent only lasts 18 years and companies have to get patents the second they think they have a viable drug. It still takes 10-15 years of testing and approval before the drug makes it to market.

That means they only have 3-8 years in which to recoup those costs before the drug is open to generics meaning it has to sell them basically at cost from then on out to compete.

[1991 318is]

A very basic concept that gets overlooked by the term "universal" healthcare is that it immediately makes the issue one pf politics. That makes it easy to overlook the question from any other perspective. Healthcare is rationed in all countries because it, like everything else is a limited resource. How it is rationed is the question. Anyone who thinks the decision should be left to corporations is accepting the fact that the criteria should be what maximizes profits. There are three big players in the field - the government, the medical industry, and insurance companies. The only thing they agree on is that the consumer should have no say in the process.
We expend a far greater proportion of our healthcare assets on treatment prolonging the last year of insured men's lives. It's where the money is - expensive procedures, drugs, and high tech equipment. That's why we suffer from a statistical standpoint compared to those other countries, especially in those areas impacted by pre-natal care, infant and women's health, etc.

[PiercedE30]

name one thing the government has done efficiently and successfully.

Taxes

[bolognablake]

Ugh. Micheal Moore is a waste of space.

[e30sd]

i remember when blunt and i went to gayfest '02 in ibiza and he caught the clap we took him to the male clinic in barcelona and he received only the best service at pretty much no cost (well he had to service the doctor)...

[mikeedler]

yep, I have to agree with blunt on this one.

here in germany, my wife and I have to pay 30% of our income to "healthcare" every month! No choice in the matter!

I have been to the doctor about 4 time in the last 5 years (except my finger in an electric fan) incident.-- so I have lost so much money in comparision to a retiree that goes to the doctor everyday just because they have nothing better to do and it costs nothing (and that is a BIG problem here in Germany)

[trashcop 80s 80s]

The companies arent gouging either. The reason it costs 10x as much to buy a drug than it costs the company to PRODUCE is because companies have a shitload of sunk research costs to recoup. A patent only lasts 18 years and companies have to get patents the second they think they have a viable drug. It still takes 10-15 years of testing and approval before the drug makes it to market.

That means they only have 3-8 years in which to recoup those costs before the drug is open to generics meaning it has to sell them basically at cost from then on out to compete.

+1, most people don't realize that companies must regain all the money to pay back all their loans for research, and patenting in a small period of time. After the drug is put on the generic market it is basically sold at no profit.

Universal healthcare would absolutely suck. People would abuse the system, demanding this test or this scan since everything would be free. Then they would be looking to sue when their free healthcare that they didn't pay a cent for was not as good as they expected. People with money will end up paying for healthcare anyway because they will not want to wait for the free shit care. Physician's salaries will drop if government takes over, therefore all the quality students will be less drawn towards the headaches of medicine and we will turn out less quality physicians.

[kroberts]

Any adult Finns, Norweigans, or Danes on this site? Northern European countries are supposed to have excellent healthcare. Ask them about their income tax rates.

Cuba?

Michael Moore hates America. IMHO he's damn lucky he lives here. There are civilized countries in this world that wouldn't put up with his sort of tripe. The local stasi officers would toss his fat ass off a bridge.

kr