What if Jesus wasn't a white dude?

[Vrbovan]

So, Jesus did existed. He was Jewish and had an "enlightment". One day, he pretended he was God's son and his messiah. Everyone listened to him and books were written about him. Great. But not wanting to be "blaspheming", but what if he were simply schizophrenic, was hearing voices and pretended to be "our savior"? Just as tens of loonies, standing on wooden crates in NYC's Time Square, claiming the end of the world is near and that we should suffer for our sins... Was that worth basing another religion on a Jewish crack pot? Even his temporaries were in disbelief. Roman and Jews.

The Bible and Torah are full of metaphores: Virgin Mary, Moise splliting the sea in two, multiplication of breads, eating his flesh and drinking is blood, the talking/burning bush. That's a lot of nonsenses. And if his whole life as it is written was also just another metaphore serving some persons' purpose? Let's not forget that religion was (and still is) used as a tool of power for some manipulators to get rich and keep the power. Fat and rich monks in castles while poor peoples were starving. Religions were (are) a parallel government, and mythological texts can be interpretated to anyone's purpose.

So Jesus as a science stripped of any religious content? Not sure it works. And where there's religion, there's nonsense.

What I forgot to point out again is that, I am not talking about religion or theology here.

we all accept that History is written by the winners right? well what if you try to read between the lines of a history and try to get out information that is hidden behind flowery language and drummed up lies.

this is the method we apply to the synoptic Gospels. we remove any editorial additions and seek to find out what these documents are saying to us, not as religion or theology, but a simple Greco-Roman Biographies.
we seek to undo the 2000 years of BS and find the base form of these documents. its quite effective and there are now about 40 authenticated sayings of Jesus. Just so you know NONE of them talk about him being the Messiah, that is a later early Christian addition.

[Massive Lee]

Hi Vrbovan

Have you ever asked yourself if all those "real" stories may in fact be invented metaphores used to impress common uneducated people from the dark ages. Things that scientifically don't make sense, and simly are answers to questions all men on earth ask themselve. Per exemple. Good and bad. Where do we come from? What's our purpose on life. What do we become after death? Each existing religion will have different answers and interpretations.

For antique Greeks and Romans, there was a deity for everything: sky, thunder, sea, hunt, love, etc. In the European middle ages, plagues were wrath of God, earth was flat, the world was created in 6 days from scratch. Concepts we all laugh at now. How long until everyone realizes there's no heaven, no hell, no purgatory, and that religions are only very personal options that don't need bibles, Corans or Torahs, and that any human speaking in the name of those gods, or interpreting "truths" taken from those scripts are simply imposters.

[Dillinger]

My only question is why do these threads get so much attention?

[Massive Lee]

My only question is why do these threads get so much attention?

Maybe because many peoples ask themselve the same questions. Some will base Jesus' existence on science, while some will use science to negate it, some will base its existence on their faith. Religions are great sociologic events that deserve to be studied. I don't think anyone was unrespectfull and we all had different points of view. Some perhaps more cynical than others.

It is interesting that in Jerusalem, Jews have their Wailing Wall, Muslims have their Great Mosque, and Christians have their scepulcre. 3 major religions in the same place. Each claiming exclusivity. That's a strange occurence that deserves an historian's study.

[Vrbovan]

Maybe because many peoples ask themselve the same questions. Some will base Jesus' existence on science, while some will use science to negate it, some will base its existence on their faith. Religions are great sociologic events that deserve to be studied. I don't think anyone was unrespectfull and we all had different points of view. Some perhaps more cynical than others.

It is interesting that in Jerusalem, Jews have their Wailing Wall, Muslims have their Great Mosque, and Christians have their scepulcre. 3 major religions in the same place. Each claiming exclusivity. That's a strange occurence that deserves an historian's study.

are you even reading my responses?

we know when the gospels were written, we know who they were written about, we use science and scientific methods to read them. I've never said anything about heaven, hell, good, bad, sin, theology, or any faith.

read my posts, then maybe do some research.

I'm not talking about the Gospels as articles of faith, I'm talking about them as historical documents and applying a scientific historical analysis... whats so difficult to understand about this?

[Vrbovan]

Massive, can I use 15" euro weaves with your brake kit or would i need to up-size?

[Vrbovan]

My only question is why do these threads get so much attention?

LOL i'm just interested because I'm a professional historian and I do a lot of work in early Christianity and Jesus History... and I'm happy that I get to talk about it!

[neighborhood]

After briefly scanning over this thread, and in all SRS BZNS have you ever had the chance to read a book titled "Born in Blood'' by John J Robertson, Lee? There is a couple of Chapters dealing with this topic.

[Massive Lee]

Is "Born in blood" the history of Franc-Maçonnery or is that a fiction similar to "Da Vinci"s Code"?

[neighborhood]

Its main topic/subject deals with the Masons and their history, but it touches on other topics such as the depiction of Jesus and how the Roman Catholics wanted him to be depicted.

[Massive Lee]

For all that Wiki is worth, I found this interesting link about the image of Jesus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Images_of_Jesus

[Liam]

Jesus was definitely a white guy, had a flat top crew cut as well.

[Vrbovan]

Pillars of the Earth is a fantastic read too...

[Massive Lee]

Jesus was definitely a white guy, had a flat top crew cut as well.

Actually, Jesus is portrayed as a black dude in Ethiopia, and as an Asian in the far East...

Lee