Handouts Make Up One-Third of U.S. Wages

[mrsleeve]

I paid a 5 figure sum to the IRS last year and I am not rich. But I am a little guy, so I can't afford to buy my own politicians, nor do I have the budget for an army of tax attorneys.

SO DID I, whats your point???? You pay your taxes????

I am no where near rich either, and I could really use those 5 figures in my own account for all the assistance I get outta the federal govt for anything in my life but we are stuck with it. Form the bulk of your posts on here, one would only draw the conclusion that you should be happy to pay your taxes and upset that you dont have to pay more

[joshh]

Part of the problem is large corporations are now used to getting these tax breaks. I wonder what would have happen had we made them pay 10-15% (at least but at least they are paying something) taxes this whole time.
I'd worry that if we made them start paying taxes they would just out source more and more. In the mean time small business sucks a cock on taxes, city state and Fed.

[mar1t1me]

SO DID I, whats your point???? You pay your taxes????

I am no where near rich either, and I could really use those 5 figures in my own account for all the assistance I get outta the federal govt for anything in my life but we are stuck with it. Form the bulk of your posts on here, one would only draw the conclusion that you should be happy to pay your taxes and upset that you dont have to pay more

I'll pay any tax that is fairly and justly levied and be happy to do so.

Just because it is somehow legal for billionaire companies to indefinitely hide their true wealth in deferred overseas earnings, or force their workers onto public largess because they refuse to pay a living wage doesn't mean it's just or ethical.

Oddly, our leaders, even as people making $50K a year in Wisconsin are viewed as leeches that should have their wages and benefits curtailed, refuse to revisit the billions spent propping up these corporate welfare recipients.

Boehner is busy cutting out Head Start programs that will put 55,000 teachers out of work. Not gonna touch his corporate leash-holder's wallets, though.

[bmwstephen]

Part of the problem is large corporations are now used to getting these tax breaks. I wonder what would have happen had we made them pay 10-15% (at least but at least they are paying something) taxes this whole time.
I'd worry that if we made them start paying taxes they would just out source more and more. In the mean time small business sucks a cock on taxes, city state and Fed.

the big problem is those taxes shouldn't have been instituted to begin with. now government and society are dependent on them. I mean look at how hard it is to go back to 2008 spending levels. Gosh I everytime I travel to places in Asia, I envy their flat tax systems. barely anyone over there complains because its fair game for the individual, the collective, and the government.

[bmwstephen]

I'll pay any tax that is fairly and justly levied and be happy to do so.

Just because it is somehow legal for billionaire companies to indefinitely hide their true wealth in deferred overseas earnings, or force their workers onto public largess because they refuse to pay a living wage doesn't mean it's just or ethical.

Oddly, our leaders, even as people making $50K a year in Wisconsin are viewed as leeches that should have their wages and benefits curtailed, refuse to revisit the billions spent propping up these corporate welfare recipients.

Boehner is busy cutting out Head Start programs that will put 55,000 teachers out of work. Not gonna touch his corporate leash-holder's wallets, though.

if you can't reduce their pay for crappy performance then fire them. for too long have they been catered to the luxuries of union-ship. their competitive spirit is gone. any more entitlements for them only leads to bigger problem in the future. Out here in California, our teachers are a joke. they are not willing to sacrifice anything and their quality of education sucks. honestly when the hell have you seen a kid worry about their teacher's pay or pension contribution.

[mar1t1me]

if you can't reduce their pay for crappy performance then fire them.

Yeah, those wealthy Head Start teachers with their average annual salary of less than $30K are really a drain on the system.

I have long been a believer that if children aren't well prepared by their parents to learn, which means a good meal in the morning, exercise and early bedtimes and plenty of sleep, there's only so much a teacher can do. One of my acquaintances is a school principal and he will tell you that when he started in the 70's, there was much more support from home. You simply didn't have the kind of "drop off a dumb kid, pick up a smart kid", school-as-factory mentality we seem to have now.

I happen to have known quite a few teachers in my 47 years on this planet and none of them have fit the description you lay out. Sure, there are bad apples in every basket, but if you want good teachers, then paying less isn't how to get them.

Tying performance to pay is dangerous, unless you want little walking automatons that know only what the politicians who love standardized tests say they should know.

And frankly, for a guy who got re-elected on a promise of creating jobs and not killing them, this kind of action is a disingenuous slap in the face. Especially given that canning someone making $30K as a teacher is a surefire way to increase welfare dependence.

[e30e]

Blame the teachers LOL, thank god I'm gave that up. Fucking idiots wanna blame TEACHERS for being leaches. 30k to 55k isn't enough to deal with 30+ asshole kids poorly raised with retarded expectations and unbelievable entitlements.

Don't get me wrong a kindergarten teacher shouldn't make 80k but to blame a performance of any kind of them is like yelling at a retard in the special olympics for getting silver; your only as good as what your working with.

[tjts1]

I have long been a believer that if children aren't well prepared by their parents to learn, which means a good meal in the morning, exercise and early bedtimes and plenty of sleep, there's only so much a teacher can do. One of my acquaintances is a school principal and he will tell you that when he started in the 70's, there was much more support from home. You simply didn't have the kind of "drop off a dumb kid, pick up a smart kid", school-as-factory mentality we seem to have now.

:up:

[bmwstephen]

Yeah, those wealthy Head Start teachers with their average annual salary of less than $30K are really a drain on the system.

I have long been a believer that if children aren't well prepared by their parents to learn, which means a good meal in the morning, exercise and early bedtimes and plenty of sleep, there's only so much a teacher can do. One of my acquaintances is a school principal and he will tell you that when he started in the 70's, there was much more support from home. You simply didn't have the kind of "drop off a dumb kid, pick up a smart kid", school-as-factory mentality we seem to have now.

I happen to have known quite a few teachers in my 47 years on this planet and none of them have fit the description you lay out. Sure, there are bad apples in every basket, but if you want good teachers, then paying less isn't how to get them.

Tying performance to pay is dangerous, unless you want little walking automatons that know only what the politicians who love standardized tests say they should know.

And frankly, for a guy who got re-elected on a promise of creating jobs and not killing them, this kind of action is a disingenuous slap in the face. Especially given that canning someone making $30K as a teacher is a surefire way to increase welfare dependence.

come out to california and you will see plenty of them. you can argue parenting is an issue but I can counter argue that lack of parenting can be a god send. case in point on in the coastal areas with large immigrant families like mine, never had parents that can feed me 3 times a day, help me out with my homework, and know english for the fact of that matter to help me with the american culture period. Did I turn out poor in socioeconmic and academic status no! I excelled because i know my way to success was to work as hard as they do so all and all its a personal choice!! Finally when I was able to attend a private school midway through high school, I can see the night and day difference between public school teachers and private school teachers where they had every incentive to ensure a high graduation rate. BTW regarding pay, most teachers make 30-50k starting out but consider this, it'll only get higher when they are tenure and they work 7 months out of the full year. If you divy up the salary by wage hours they make more than most accountants. Not to mention there is no restriction for them to take side ventures (plenty of my public school teachers did that) for added income.

In regards to automation... open your eyes its already happened weather you like it or not. That is a unavoidable evil of a public education system, you learn what they want you to learn. But let me ask you, how does a variable wage scale lead to automation? If anything those who deserve a higher pay but don't receive it tend to lack the incentive to go beyond the call of duty.

[joshh]

the big problem is those taxes shouldn't have been instituted to begin with. now government and society are dependent on them. I mean look at how hard it is to go back to 2008 spending levels. Gosh I everytime I travel to places in Asia, I envy their flat tax systems. barely anyone over there complains because its fair game for the individual, the collective, and the government.

Good point. I'm all for the flat tax. I believe it very well could bring in more money as well.

[bmwstephen]

Good point. I'm all for the flat tax. I believe it very well could bring in more money as well.

exactly it worked in the US for a while before the entitlement programs and government spending was heavily justified and out of control... but in asia such a low tax environment allow business to literally bloom overnight and thus allowing for more revenue via economies of scale. Now, skeptics here will argue otherwise that this type of phenomena commonly known here as the The "Laffer Curve" or "Reagonomics" was tried here and didn't work but what they failed to see is that the public spending outpace the revenue that was coming in at the time and the new administration simply took advantage of that weak moment of the policy and considered it a failure.... well its working in other countries thats for sure.

[joshh]

exactly it worked in the US for a while before the entitlement programs and government spending was heavily justified and out of control... but in asia such a low tax environment allow business to literally bloom overnight and thus allowing for more revenue via economies of scale. Now, skeptics here will argue otherwise that this type of phenomena commonly known here as the The "Laffer Curve" or "Reagonomics" was tried here and didn't work but what they failed to see is that the public spending outpace the revenue that was coming in at the time and the new administration simply took advantage of that weak moment of the policy and considered it a failure.... well its working in other countries thats for sure.

And other countries don't buy at the same hog rate American consumers do. I see it working very well.

[5Toes]

Yeah, those wealthy Head Start teachers with their average annual salary of less than $30K are really a drain on the system.

I have long been a believer that if children aren't well prepared by their parents to learn, which means a good meal in the morning, exercise and early bedtimes and plenty of sleep, there's only so much a teacher can do. One of my acquaintances is a school principal and he will tell you that when he started in the 70's, there was much more support from home. You simply didn't have the kind of "drop off a dumb kid, pick up a smart kid", school-as-factory mentality we seem to have now.

I happen to have known quite a few teachers in my 47 years on this planet and none of them have fit the description you lay out. Sure, there are bad apples in every basket, but if you want good teachers, then paying less isn't how to get them.

Tying performance to pay is dangerous, unless you want little walking automatons that know only what the politicians who love standardized tests say they should know.

And frankly, for a guy who got re-elected on a promise of creating jobs and not killing them, this kind of action is a disingenuous slap in the face. Especially given that canning someone making $30K as a teacher is a surefire way to increase welfare dependence.

Yes! Being a high school student now... its sad how many kids dont care. How many kids have ruined their lives through weed and popularity. Sometimes I wanna barf

come out to california and you will see plenty of them. you can argue parenting is an issue but I can counter argue that lack of parenting can be a god send. case in point on in the coastal areas with large immigrant families like mine, never had parents that can feed me 3 times a day, help me out with my homework, and know english for the fact of that matter to help me with the american culture period. Did I turn out poor in socioeconmic and academic status no! I excelled because i know my way to success was to work as hard as they do so all and all its a personal choice!! Finally when I was able to attend a private school midway through high school, I can see the night and day difference between public school teachers and private school teachers where they had every incentive to ensure a high graduation rate. BTW regarding pay, most teachers make 30-50k starting out but consider this, it'll only get higher when they are tenure and they work 7 months out of the full year. If you divy up the salary by wage hours they make more than most accountants. Not to mention there is no restriction for them to take side ventures (plenty of my public school teachers did that) for added income.

In regards to automation... open your eyes its already happened weather you like it or not. That is a unavoidable evil of a public education system, you learn what they want you to learn. But let me ask you, how does a variable wage scale lead to automation? If anything those who deserve a higher pay but don't receive it tend to lack the incentive to go beyond the call of duty.

This too. I know so many smart kids who dont apply themselves. So many, and it is depressing, because later in life they are truly gonna regret it.

This country in a few years will be ran by today's self centered youth. Oh god

[z31maniac]

Fairtax > Flattax

Taxes are really irrelevant at this point. Even if the Federal Income tax was DOUBLED (Leaving spending as it is, which it needs to be cut) we would still have a $500 billion deficit.

Really no point in talking about taxes until SERIOUS spending cuts are made.

Pain for everyone, nothing is sacred. Starting at the new fiscal year every dept/agency/etc of the gov't gets a 15% reduction in budget, across the board, for everything.

[bmwstephen]

Fairtax > Flattax

Taxes are really irrelevant at this point. Even if the Federal Income tax was DOUBLED (Leaving spending as it is, which it needs to be cut) we would still have a $500 billion deficit.

Really no point in talking about taxes until SERIOUS spending cuts are made.

Pain for everyone, nothing is sacred. Starting at the new fiscal year every dept/agency/etc of the gov't gets a 15% reduction in budget, across the board, for everything.

1) how much money do you make out of curiosity?

2) I agree. I'm all for tax cuts but it makes no sense unless we cut spending first because all we do is add to the deficit. What's worse about that is the interest and principal added as a result