Global Warming is over.

[Q5Quint]

There are no papers on 'global cooling' because it isn't cooling.

You can 'deny' global warming all you want, but that would mean that there should be a temperature model predicting global cooling or global stay-the-same-temperature. But there is not.

There is only a hockey stick. And more and more research only continues to verify this while the 'deniers' desperately try to toss out as much as they can and ignore any actual theories of global temperature prediction.

There are a lot of reasons to stop pollution, so even if you are not convinced that co2 is as bad as many scientists think, you should still be against pollution and watching to see if co2 really is bad.

For a while lead was safe, tobacco was safe, ddt was safe, mercury was safe, cfcs were safe... and we decided that after noticing some issues that in fact they were not safe.


What really scares me is the thought that china could just swoop in with a communist hand and give all its factories a free super clean upgrade, thus continuing to establish their dominance in the production market until their middle class forces wages to rise. That is the 'free-market' for you and that reason alone is enough to proclaim that we need a world standard for this kind of stuff to put factories on us soil in the same ring as chinese/asain.

[nando]

that may put us at an economic disadvantage, but really, we'd all be better off if countries the size of China became environmental leaders instead of total disasters.

[gwb72tii]

Exxon fined $600k for killing birds

http://nofrakkingconsensus.com/2009/08/21/how-much-is-a-birds-life-worth-part-1/

[cale]

Agreed that's dumb and likely only enforced given that they're an oil business. Question is are they supposed to have the water netted off? I ask because there's likely a good chance something is being left out of the story given where it's posted. Willful negligence by any business should be punished.

[rwh11385]

Red herrings are wild creatures in R3V's P&R section apparently... Trolls enjoy them

[einhander]

Global warming is not over.

[cale]

Red herrings are wild creatures in R3V's P&R section apparently... Trolls enjoy them

Don't worry, if I know gwb's tactics on arguing AGW as well as I think I do, we'll be back on this topic soon enough.

[salvuhdor]

We are living in a time frame where the earth is rising in temperature.... Big whoop guys

[cale]

About as insightful and thought provoking as your last trip to this thread, I'm glad we have your wisdom back.

[nando]

http://nofrakkingconsensus.com/2009/...-worth-part-1/

Japan's politicians have a problem with 'comfort women' http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...-comfort-women

I thought it was about as relevant to the subject.

[Q5Quint]

I hate to say it but if you are defending any of the big oil/ big energy companies at this point you are hiding under a rock.

It is a matter of national security that we keep the lights on- and leaving that in the hands of some public/private monopoly supported by the tax payers is just wrong, but we do it anyway and they reap the profits. They have us by the balls because we let them.

I am against big wind too- but all my research puts the environmental damage of that type of energy production at the LEAST of all the others. Leaving energy production in the hands of those same companies that have us by the balls, even if it is 'green' energy, is still going to cause the same issues minus some pollution.

Saying that the wind industry is murdering more birds that the coal/oil industry is a odd comparison~ especially when the bird has to literally run into a wind turbine and especially since most turbines are owned by the coal/oil industry.

Where are the deaths from pollution? From destruction of thousands of square miles of habitat for mines, from oil spills, from thousands of miles of pipe?

Wind does share a location and a power line, but the impact from fossil fuels is way more than just the location of the plant. It has also been proved time and time again that wind turbines don't kill birds at any rate and the lack of sources on your article point straight to that.

"The Audubon Society says that more than 100 of those birds are golden eagles."

Weird when the Audubon society supports wind energy with correct placement studies. http://policy.audubon.org/audubon-statement-wind-power

Placing 1500 wind turbines in the brooding grounds of birds, like what happened at altamont pass in the 80s, will never happen again. I cant figure out why people keep citing it as an issue when study after study has proven that it is not and we continue having explosions and oil spills.

http://barnardonwind.wordpress.com/2013/02/15/how-significant-is-bird-and-bat-mortality-due-to-wind-turbines/

This is what a research article with sources look like. Please stop posting random shit of peoples opinions that have no source or scientific base. According to your logic we should outlaw cats, windows, pesticides, cars, communication towers, and big high tension transmission wires because they kill many many times more birds than wind turbines.

You just found a random internet post saying that wind turbines kill birds- good job. I just found a published article with 21 references and sources listed within the text that says wind turbines could save 70 million birds per year. Topic aside research is about finding true and trusted sources, so when you post anything that has no source or incorrect and misleading information it makes me feel like you are trying to trick less intelligent people into believing something that isnt true. Oh the national enquirer that says Obama is actually a mexican drug lord- it is published so it must be true! It is on the internet so it must be true! Do you think we are that dumb? Are you that dumb?

[herbivor]

^ I didn't see solar on that list. Would be curious how that rates. I assume "none" or "lowest potential" for every category.

[Q5Quint]

The silicone and aluminum in the panels, some steel and concrete for the foundation, some inverters and wires..... crazy basic compared to a coal fired boiler.

Boilers- nuclear coal or natural gas can also do odd things to the weather~

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/updraft/archive/2013/01/nuke_effect_snow_pennsylvania.shtml

We have odd fish things going on in nc because Sharon Harris (nuke plant) raises the temperature of the lake so much. Technically those temperature rises cause more water to be evaporated out of the rivers than people actually use for drinking water..... interesting that all the water conservation people would actually be doing better to be telling folks to turn the lights off isnt it?


Here is where we would need to evacuate if the nuke near our capital had a spew- luckily we would just need to evacuate our capital.
http://www.nuclearpowerdanger.com/pl...-plume-map.php

[Thizzelle]

I want global warming damn it!

[gwb72tii]

so for all you alarmists and doom predictors, do as i say not as i do i suppose
all those nasty environmental rules are ok for exxon, but when it comes to my subsidized green energy windmills, who gives a fuck if it kills raptors on the endangered species list

after all, it's green energy

and mr Q, give up the liberal fallback bullshit about anyone not in your minority view about global warming must therefore be in favor of pollution. CO2 is not pollution, it's a fucking TRACE element. you can do better than that,

oh, and THIS JUST IN (about 5 years ago). mann's hockey stick is a fraud, and there is a consensus about that.

and i like you too! ;)