Another Stimulus-Backed Energy Company Files for Bankruptcy

[Vedubin01]

someone granted the approval of the loan, that is someone inside the Department of Energy gave the go ahead.

Sometimes Ill just post a link to start topic, or bring to light something new to the topic.

The fact is that this administration is approving gigantic loans to companies that should not be getting such loans! But that is coming from an Administration that has never ran a company or knows how to read a P&L. Sounds more like community organizing to me.

[rwh11385]

yet another one bites the dust.... taxpayers in for $2.1 billion on this one



Solar Trust for America received $2.1 billion in conditional loan guarantees from the Department of Energy -- "the largest amount ever offered to a solar project,"


http://campaign2012.washingtonexamin...es-loan/459621

Are you SURE about that? Or just read the headlines and assume they fact-check. Fox News had it wrong.

They were offered the $2.1B loan, but turned it down in favor of private lending:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/toddwood...oan-guarantee/

Taxpayers may have not lost anything! Who knows what the conditions were, or if money was lost on these loans?

But my point is that you don't say anything...you imply bullshit things that aren't true.

Look, the government probably made a bad choice here - just like the private companies funding this endeavor. And it's intentions may have been even worse - friends of friends, favors, yada yada. I don't have a fucking clue.

But the shit you post and imply, simply isn't true. Doesn't look like in this case that the taxpayers lost anything. If you do more than extrapolate false information and post links, people will start to listen. Until then, they will roll their eyes.

The right-wing crazies won't let facts get in the way of the news!

[Bill 84 318i]

someone granted the approval of the loan, that is someone inside the Department of Energy gave the go ahead.

Sometimes Ill just post a link to start topic, or bring to light something new to the topic.

The fact is that this administration is approving gigantic loans to companies that should not be getting such loans! But that is coming from an Administration that has never ran a company or knows how to read a P&L. Sounds more like community organizing to me.

Regardless of whether I agree or disagree with you, this is more interesting. You basically straight up said that the government wasted 2.1 billion of our dollars. And they didn't. So I didn't take any of it seriously. Just Vedub bein' crazy, as usual.

Now this matter of what the government might be encouraging people/companies to do is worth discussing. If it wasn't, we wouldn't be fighting about it.

As for why "sounding like community organizing" is evil, I'll need some more substantive persuasion there, too. "Obama was one" doesn't count. I mean LOL seriously, community organizing sounds exactly like something I'd do once I settle down.

[Vedubin01]

Are you SURE about that? Or just read the headlines and assume they fact-check. Fox News had it wrong.

They were offered the $2.1B loan, but turned it down in favor of private lending:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/toddwood...oan-guarantee/

Good find dude, I read the article and moved on. Posted it here not saying it was sound fact. You come along and find another article that contradicts the story I posted.

Isn't that the beauty of forums?

[rwh11385]

Good find dude, I read the article and moved on. Posted it here not saying it was sound fact. You come along and find another article that contradicts the story I posted.

Isn't that the beauty of forums?

It would be MORE beautiful if the news and opinions of voters were not the result of the propagation of misinformation and misconceptions.

If people don't understand the actual facts of the situation and believe whatever pundits spit out, how is the voting populace supposed to make informed decisions?

[Vedubin01]

how is the voting populace supposed to make informed decisions?

Maybe they should come to R3v politics and religion section. ;)

[HarryPotter]

Regardless of whether I agree or disagree with you, this is more interesting. You basically straight up said that the government wasted 2.1 billion of our dollars. And they didn't. So I didn't take any of it seriously. Just Vedub bein' crazy, as usual.

Now this matter of what the government might be encouraging people/companies to do is worth discussing. If it wasn't, we wouldn't be fighting about it.

As for why "sounding like community organizing" is evil, I'll need some more substantive persuasion there, too. "Obama was one" doesn't count. I mean LOL seriously, community organizing sounds exactly like something I'd do once I settle down.

Doesn't negate the fact that the administration attempted to hand them 2.1 billion dollars. They might have turned it down but the attempt was made. The fact that our government is offering (sometimes doing) this kind of money to projects that keep going under is a bit worrisome no?

[herbivor]

It would be MORE beautiful if the news and opinions of voters were not the result of the propagation of misinformation and misconceptions.

If people don't understand the actual facts of the situation and believe whatever pundits spit out, how is the voting populace supposed to make informed decisions?

Not to get off topic but I'm curious if you feel this applies to the global warming deniers too.

[HarryPotter]

Way to set the tracks for a derailment herby.

[rwh11385]

Not to get off topic but I'm curious if you feel this applies to the global warming deniers too.

I think that the Dunning–Kruger effect is applicable here, we can all try to keep informed on research (well, some people try...) but that doesn't mean we'll understand it like someone involved would be.

And there are two different levels to debate - climate change / global warming... and whether or not it is caused by human industrialization. Belief that the world will always remain at the same temperature (higher or lower) is a little demanding, since the world has experienced many different eras of climate... but I don't believe this change occurs at a fast rate.

I also don't think the alarmist mentality is needed either, as even if carbon dioxide or methane contribute to a greenhouse effect... it's not at a great pace. One thing that man has been capable of, and increasingly more skilled at, is developing innovations. (Of course, we need open-minded world citizens and STEM-educated people to develop these things). But given our ability to produce gas from plastic trash or make a lot of things happen cooler than that (just a matter of cost), I'd say we could always produce sustainable energy and reverse small effects we may or may not have if we were so concerned. Obviously, recycling and composting are important to sustainability - and should be increased... as well as anaerobic digestion, and renewable energies... but being a snob and attacking people won't necessary be helpful either. Clearly the right can be closed-minded, unscientific, and simple... but those who believe in GW ought to educate themselves with the skills to create the solutions necessary to make a difference, not just slap a bumper sticker or buy a T-shirt. Buying a lot of Starbucks coffee in 50% post-consumer content cups and blogging about the environment doesn't do much to fix the problem or lead us into the future. (Less talk, more do)

[herbivor]

^Since you like graphs, I'll save mine for the GW threads, but respectable answer nonetheless. Thankyou.

[rwh11385]

^Since you like graphs, I'll save mine for the GW threads, but respectable answer nonetheless. Thankyou.

Remember, people have always doubted what was possible or practical... and yet innovation and science has repeatedly proved them wrong. I posted this somewhere (Volt thread?) but good list - http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/neverwrk.htm

"Flight by machines heavier than air is impractical and insignificant, if not utterly impossible."
-- Simon Newcomb, Director, U.S. Naval Observatory, 1902

He was proved wrong a year later obviously.