The words of a killer Santa Barbara mass shooting.

[deutschman]

A temper tantrum is stomping your feet and shouting. This is not a tantrum.

As for the rest of the comments calling the kid spoiled and entitled and whatnot, all of those things seem like they could be true, but they don't cause someone to go on a killing rampage. Mental illness does.

Edit 1: And I'm not defending this kid at all or trying to excuse his actions. When mental illness is mixed up with temper tantrums or being spoiled and entitled, these people don't get psychiatric evaluations and sometimes harm others. Cancer is not (usually) the fault of the person who has it.

Its never just one thing that causes some one to go postal.
There were quite a few things that went wrong with this kid to lead him to a place where he was shooting people.
Parents, mental illness, possible homosexual feelings, societal problems, what ever. They all snow balled into this prick.
I know kids who could have been him if a few different things had happened in their lives.

[Vedubin01]

delete...

[cale]

That's the father of one of the victims, not the murderer

[Vedubin01]

That's the father of one of the victims, not the murderer

You are right... I have been bartending all weekend this weekend and am very deprived of sleep. Thanks for the catch!

[Ether-D]

Its never just one thing that causes some one to go postal.
There were quite a few things that went wrong with this kid to lead him to a place where he was shooting people.
Parents, mental illness, possible homosexual feelings, societal problems, what ever. They all snow balled into this prick.
I know kids who could have been him if a few different things had happened in their lives.

I agree. Though I think if homosexual feelings had anything to do with it, it's because they aren't in line with his parents' (or other major influences') beliefs.

The thing is, I believe that babies are born without any of this (baring mental illness and possibly homosexual tendencies). The other things on the list are just (unfortunate as they may be) parts of the world that that baby was born into. It just bugs me that we are so quick to say things like "prick, loser, spoiled, entitled" instead of what really was the straw that broke this camels back: mental illness. I mean, the term "nut house" is horrible. Who would seek treatment from a place commonly referred to as a "nut house"?

My point is that as long as we as a society, refer to the mentally ill as "lunatics, nuts, crazies, wack jobs, losers, pricks, spoiled, entitled" and so on as if it were their fault for being mentally ill, no one will seek the treatment they need for fear of stigma.

I'm out. :?

[E30 Wagen]

I usually blame the parents in a case like this. If a kid is in their 20s and they're loners living at home, then the parents need to really step up and start having some serious conversations about their mental state and what their outlook on life is. You don't need to hire a fucking counselor to do that. I don't know how a parent can just watch their child deteriorate like that. How could they be so oblivious? He was completely delusional. I haven't read his whole manifesto but I got a strong impression that his parents were pretty self-absorbed themselves and would have been okay if he simply offed himself. Fuck them.

[deutschman]

i usually blame the parents in a case like this. If a kid is in their 20s and they're loners living at home, then the parents need to really step up and start having some serious conversations about their mental state and what their outlook on life is. You don't need to hire a fucking counselor to do that. I don't know how a parent can just watch their child deteriorate like that. How could they be so oblivious? He was completely delusional. I haven't read his whole manifesto but i got a strong impression that his parents were pretty self-absorbed themselves and would have been okay if he simply offed himself. Fuck them.

word!

[roznic]

I usually blame the parents in a case like this. If a kid is in their 20s and they're loners living at home, then the parents need to really step up and start having some serious conversations about their mental state and what their outlook on life is. You don't need to hire a fucking counselor to do that. I don't know how a parent can just watch their child deteriorate like that. How could they be so oblivious? He was completely delusional. I haven't read his whole manifesto but I got a strong impression that his parents were pretty self-absorbed themselves and would have been okay if he simply offed himself. Fuck them.

That's what I am talking about ^^^!!!! Insanity this insanity that-BS

[E30 Wagen]

That's what I am talking about ^^^!!!! Insanity this insanity that-BS

Not necessarily "insanity," but he definitely had some kind of mental disorder.

Narcissistic personality disorder.

[freeride53]

There's been a big debate on this bt a bunch of my friends/cousins.

In my opinion, I think that this was not driven (primarily) by misogyny, rather mental-illness. I think that the misogynistic aspect ties into his mental illness, but not visa versa. Think about the male victims of this crime as well. A good buddy of mine lived a block from where people were murdered. He had made eye-contact with the killer just a week ago as well. Pretty creepy shit. I am a big believer in gun-control, I don't think that this kid for instance should have had access to weapons. But I think the BIG issues here lie with the lack of treatment he received and local LAW ENFORCEMENT'S irresponsibility.

This kid's family had pleaded with the local authority who refused to give a damn about it all. This COULD have been prevented very easily. But... it wasn't.

A lot of people need to get their facts straight - I only can say that what I know is loosely accurate ONLY because one of my best buddies lives a block from where all the madness occurred, knew a girl, and had seen this kid in person.

That's all I gotta say.

[mrsleeve]

^

You have to do something illegal or be suspected of doing something illegal for the police to get involved. Its the job of the police to investigate crimes and wrong doing after it happens or it while its occurring. ITS NOT their job to PREVENT crime, to attempt to do so leads to lots of violations of the bill of rights, and ACLU lawsuits

[freeride53]

^

You have to do something illegal or be suspected of doing something illegal for the police to get involved. Its the job of the police to investigate crimes and wrong doing after it happens or it while its occurring. ITS NOT their job to PREVENT crime, to attempt to do so leads to lots of violations of the bill of rights, and ACLU lawsuits

while you are formally correct, there are still measures that need to be taken by forces that protect/serve the community to protect civilians from menaces to society

[mrsleeve]

Again not their JOB. As up held by the SCOTUS any one in a civil service position Cops, Social workers, ect..... have NO Legal or CONSTITUTIONAL duty to protect or attempt to protect you from harm

Gonzales Vs Castle Rock 2005

DeShaney Vs Winnebago County 1989

There was also one from the late 70's or early 80's from the D.C. area though I cant remember the case off the top of my head. Involving raping of 3 young women in a DC apartment house and the police not investigating thoroughly or really at all to the call for help.... Is what we have been taught to do for EVERYTHING, and while its a good thing and a great service, you need to be able to take proactive steps to take care of your own ass before help can arrive. there are 2 old saying that go with this. "No one will look our for your ass as good as you will"... And "when seconds count the police are only minutes away"



Its YOUR responsibility to help and protect your self........ Handing that responsibility over to the state is a very slippery dammed slope. This is part of the problem across the board for all partitions of society, the emergency plan is just :call 911: thats it no more no less.....

[BraveUlysses]

[evandael]

from my limited understanding:

his family knew.
he was seeing a psychiatrist, but possibly not taking the prescribed medication.
his family alerted the police after a particularly disturbing video. they couldn't do anything.


i have empathy for the family, the victims, and sympathy for him. i am not a homicidal maniac, but i know the stigma of mental illness. unfortunately his was left unchecked too long.


this is a very sad, very fucked up, and possibly preventable incident, but hardly something that's never happened before. if our culture approached mental illness and its treatment differently, it's possible that similar actions could be prevented in the future.