E30 M3 S62 Build - Loads of queries about 4x4 drivtrains

[The Dark Side of Will]

#2 appears to be the strut tower. Buying new is a cool idea.

The frame rail is also different in order to allow clearance for the axle. I think that's #11 in the diagram.

[JGood]

You may want to call BMW to make sure they are still available. I just replaced my drivers side strut tower (non-ix), there were only 7 left in the world (now 6), and the passenger side was already NLA. Although they can also be removed from a car without damage.

[Turk]

They are available at the moment. to be honest though I only enquired out of curiosity. I am more likely to try make this work with less drastic mods.

Does anyone have pictures of the underside of the rail showing where the bolt holes for the subframe are???

[Turk]

So finally got the s62 oil pump and gubbins out. I have ordered an x5 oil pump so hopefully will all bolt together. we shall see....



x5 sump above, s62 below


sump off, hopefully this sprocket is the same size as the x5, part numbers don't match but may be identical like many other bmw parts.


nice and clean.

[The Dark Side of Will]

So finally got the s62 oil pump and gubbins out. I have ordered an x5 oil pump so hopefully will all bolt together. we shall see....

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/ademergen/IMG_2906.jpg

x5 sump above, s62 below

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/ademergen/IMG_2907.jpg

sump off, hopefully this sprocket is the same size as the x5, part numbers don't match but may be identical like many other bmw parts.

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy49/ademergen/IMG_2906.jpg

nice and clean.
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/y...n/IMG_2912.jpg

Bolting together and working are two different things.

Does the M62 pump have the VANOS oil connection in the right place to mate up to the VANOS connection on the S62 block? Does the M62 pump provide enough volume of high pressure oil to operate the S62's dual VANOS when the M62 only had single?

I'd be *very* cautious about changing out the oil pump...

I was expecting to use the S62 pump with the E53 pan and at a minimum modify the E53 pickup tube as required. The idea had also occurred to me to machine/weld the E53 pan to accept the S62's active sump valves.

[Turk]

I don't think Its gonna be possible to use the s62 pump. The architecture Of the sumps are quite different. The pump fouls the e53 pan in all the wrong places. There are 5mm valves in the side walls of the s62 sump leading back and forth from the rear of the pan. This would be extremely tricky to get right if u plan on transferring the features into an x5 sump.

The m62 pump should be up to the job. I am awaiting some detailed figures to make a better judgement. But without the gmeter on the e39 chassis the switches won't work anyway. Unless you plan on changing abs rings and fully integrating the s62 dsc system it's just not worth it!

Next option is partial dry sump. Not quite looked into this yet as I'm still hopefull.

[The Dark Side of Will]

How many teeth are on the E30 vs. E39 ABS rings?

Since I'm going to end up doing a 5 lug conversion *anyway*...

[Turk]

e30 m3 has 48 teeth. no idea of how many the e39 has.

From what I understand the m5 and x5 oil pumps have similar internals, its the valves and different oil ports which make the difference from what I can tell. How you would calculate the pressure feeding the vanos though is a difficult task. no one releases this sort of info. without actually fitting it and doing a live read through the OBD2 port I can't see another way round it.

[Turk]

The obvious solution to the oil pump could be to use the N62 pump and sump... Dual vanos after all..

[The Dark Side of Will]

I'd guess that the VANOS actuators on the M62 and S62 would operate at the same pressure. The question in my mind is whether the single VANOS pump stage can supply the volume necessary to operate the dual VANOS. If the high pressure pump stage and regulator parts are the same (verify via RealOEM), then it should be OK.

[Turk]

I can't find anything on realoem to that description. This will be a tough one to answer without actually testing the bastards in situ.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Hmm... it doesn't show internal parts for the oil pump. Bummer. The S62 is an expensive engine for a "try it and see" course of action.

E39 S62

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=DE93&mospid=47592&btnr=11_2663&hg=11&fg=30

E53 M62

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=FB93&mospid=47748&btnr=11_2820&hg=11&fg=30

It does depict a dogleg in the M62 VANOS oil supply line, so you may need that part... the "oil pipes" that supply the rest of the engine's oil needs are also different part numbers.

[Turk]

you've copied same link twice. No worries I have found what you mean.

Yes I certainly think it will will need all of the pictured piping to work, but looking at the diameters of the pipes I would say theres a good chance of pressures etc being correct!

[Jonsku]

How many teeth are on the E30 vs. E39 ABS rings?

Since I'm going to end up doing a 5 lug conversion *anyway*...

E30 and E36 have same number of teeth on the ABS-rings ;)


Regarding the oil-volume/pressure, I wouldn't bee too concerned as the pumps are anyway overdimensioned and at least to my understanding VANOS does not require large amounts of oil (there could be some indication on this on the technical documents by BMW). Though I do agree that S62 is quite a expensive engine to test this kind of things...

[The Dark Side of Will]

you've copied same link twice. No worries I have found what you mean.

Yes I certainly think it will will need all of the pictured piping to work, but looking at the diameters of the pipes I would say theres a good chance of pressures etc being correct!

Fixed... you get it.

E30 and E36 have same number of teeth on the ABS-rings ;)

Regarding the oil-volume/pressure, I wouldn't bee too concerned as the pumps are anyway overdimensioned and at least to my understanding VANOS does not require large amounts of oil (there could be some indication on this on the technical documents by BMW). Though I do agree that S62 is quite a expensive engine to test this kind of things...

Any how many teeth is that?
I checked RealOEM briefly and didn't find that it had any info on E39 ABS reluctors.

Dual VANOS will need twice as much oil as single VANOS. I'm not sure if the S62 would operate at a higher pressure than the M62 for "faster response" of the VANOS actuators or not. Not sure if the M62 has it, but the S62 has an accumulator for the high pressure VANOS oil.

Also, does the M62 have piston oil squirters like the S62? That's a big requirement for oil volume.