Ethos Gas reformulator?

[NOMAD]

It's not cynicism, it's skepticism.

If I ask for evidence of increased MPG don't show me an emissions test and say that "a change here means there must be a change there". Then show me the verified change. Results of "reformulated gasoline" should also be tested on a modern fuel injected vehicle in tip top running shape and should show an increase in a controlled environment as well.

[E30_fiend]

You guys raise very good points. I'll talk to marketing via email to see if they can arrange this type of testing. It seems like it would yield very good results to prove or disprove its effectiveness.

One question though, if I can get them to do this type of testing, should I ask them to go through a few tank driving at say 70 or 75mph and then have them go through a few tanks at a different speed? Or should I just worry about freeway driving?


E30_Fiend

[NOMAD]

It has to be consistent and continuous speed, same conditions each time. One car doing a continuous speed on a dyno. It can be two identical cars with several runs to establish a baseline for each car prior to the additive. They should be modern cars in premium state of tune. No difference should be realized due to defouling spark plugs, decarbonizing combustion chambers or unclogging injectors. We already have stuff for that.

An OBDII scanner or datalogger can be hooked up to the car to monitor the MPG numbers in real time and verify with imperical results.

In order for the results of the "fuel reformulator" to be valid the results must be independently verifiable and reproduced.

They had the time and money to develop a complex chemical in a laboratory that will bond and alter (reformulate) current gasoline formulas. That means they had to test that product in order to verify their chemical formula worked as they planned to extend gas mileage in automobiles without causing catastrophic failure or adverse results. So they should have already done tests and gathered a lot of data, or at least recreate the exact tests themselves.

[E30_fiend]

I have taken all those points into consideration and I will see what they say.

Just for reference, what kind of gains would you guys say would be substancial enough to recruit some of you?


E30_Fiend

[nando]

more than the statistical error?

[E30_fiend]

more than the statistical error?

I can promise it will be precise. I still have to talk to them but I hope this shows some good data. This could be a huge step for Ethos.


E30_Fiend

[NOMAD]

I'd say that if I were to buy a "gasoline reformulator" the savings in MPG would have to pay for the amount of product I put in, PLUS 5 mpg of consistent savings.
Say I get 30mpg @ $4/gal assuming a 10 gal refill.
So if I put in $4 of product the mileage would have to jump to 33mpg just to cover the $4 of product I dropped in. That's a savings of $0.
In order to make me happy enough to drop $4 in every tank it should make me at least another $4 in savings, so my mileage should be at minimum a consistent 36mpg.
That's a minimum of a consistent 20% improvement in fuel mileage.

Even then it's a lot of hassle for me to worry about and I may not be so tempted by it if someone said after going through all the ordering, remembering, applying etc that I'd save $4 per tank of gas I may not care too much.
Once the numbers hit 25% people will really perk up and listen.
If you can get my car to jump from 30mpg to 36 or 37.5 mpg I'll say it's great.

[clavinZERO]

My results from driving down to Bimmerfest and beyond:

26.7 MPG on the first leg of the trip... 267 miles to 10 gallons almost on the dot. To put that in perspective, I got around 28 MPG or so coming home from Oregon in 2005. Stock motor on a 325iS with a 3.73 and a JimC chip. The only difference in the car now (mechanically) is the 5-lug swap with the slightly wider rubber. The drive down to Bimmerfest this year was definitely more "spirited" than the easy drive home from Oregon. The drive from Oregon is longer and more "steady" than a Bimmerfest caravan, hehe.

I put it in for a few more fill-ups and then I quit...

I didn't put it in for a few tanks after Bimmerfest because after all that long driving, my car was running like SHIT when I would first start her up. I wondered if it was the Ethos, so I rode it out for a few tanks and everything got better WITHOUT THE ETHOS in the tank. I was still curious if the Ethos was causing the problem, so I put some more in recently (after about 2 tanks or so). What happened? The first or second time I started the car after putting it in again, it ran like butt... SHITTY. Then, all of a sudden (the next day, with the Ethos in the tank) my rough starts (like barely idling, dying, etc.) cleared up and it has been running SUPER EXCELLENTLY DELICIOUS since.

I am thinking that the issues I was having before the car was warmed up may have just been from heat-soak from the long caravanning, and maybe not the Ethos. What worried me is that the symptoms returned right after putting it in again. But, they may have been a fluke since all is well now... well and GREAT actually, running-wise.

As far as the numbers go, I am still writing down my figures from mostly city driving. I am one of those people who likes to "whooop whooop" on the throttle, so I am not babying it to fudge the numbers at all. I will post up later about the real world tests. I know it's been kind of a mixed bag with my experience so far.

</long-winded post>

[Farbin Kaiber]

I have not read anything in this thread, as I see this product the same as the FFE tabs you put in your tank that ended up via independent tests to be mothballs, ye, mothballs. You heard about how much they got a lawsuit slammed up on 'em for, right?



You still have to be weary of snake oil in the twenty first century.

[2Big4a3Series]

Not to pile on here but I gotta go with the majority and call shananigans on it. Exactly what AREN'T you telling us? Do they require you to become a distributor in order to redeem the cards? Do they require you to make lists of the names and numbers of your family members and friends? Do they require you to sell it to your family members and friends in order to get the rewards? I'd be willing to bet that the "step-by-step" instructions involve re-selling it in some form or fashion.Maybe the product works. Maybe it dosen't. But I am leery of any company that utilizes the Multi-Level Marketing business model to sell/promote it's products. Not since Amway has there ever been a product or service that went completely mainstream after being promoted via a pyramid scheme.

[E30_fiend]

Not to pile on here but I gotta go with the majority and call shananigans on it. Exactly what AREN'T you telling us? Do they require you to become a distributor in order to redeem the cards? Do they require you to make lists of the names and numbers of your family members and friends? Do they require you to sell it to your family members and friends in order to get the rewards? I'd be willing to bet that the "step-by-step" instructions involve re-selling it in some form or fashion.Maybe the product works. Maybe it dosen't. But I am leery of any company that utilizes the Multi-Level Marketing business model to sell/promote it's products. Not since Amway has there ever been a product or service that went completely mainstream after being promoted via a pyramid scheme.

You dont need to do anything but buy the product. In order to redeem your coupons all you need to do is mail them your gas receipts. I got mine after I mailed them and my mom did as well.

It may sound like a fluke but I run it in all my cars and I love the stuff. I run it in my 90' iS, in my 03' Saturn Vue and I also run it in my girlfriends 01' Neon. My mom runs it in her 00' 323i. We all like the stuff. But honestly, the only way you can disprove it is to try it. If you aren't willing to try it then don't comment on it.

[DCColegrove]

[E30_fiend]

??

[DCColegrove]

By what mechanism is this stuff supposed to increase MPG?

[e30sd]

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/autos/aut10.shtm

http://www.fuelsaving.info/ethos.htm