Alkasquawlik, is your school going to show this?

[kishg]

l. i had a problem with the curriculum he was trying to put into effect and once that was taken away, i had no problems,

what curriculum? more nonsense.. i have no issues with debate over real issues and policy differences but this one was just one big much ado over nothing designed solely to create a huge fuss, period. it's politics at it's worst.

[trent]

Puhleeze! Turn Rush off for a day and think with your own damned minds! If you're doing a good job at home with your kids, whatever Obama says will matter very little anyway. My kids have certainly had enough cloaked Republican rhetoric in their school in the last eight years and they haven't started believing Rush is great or Palin is any less an idiot!

This is a very enjoyable comment. This shows why the left is so scared of Rush/TalkRadio/FOX, and exactly why ScareAmerica is in the tank. The left doesn't understand that we do think for ourselves and look at our own understanding of things. Most of the things I see, understand, or believe in, I have thought about myself -- and then when I am in the car I turn on Rush/Hannity/Savage and they happen to be discussing the issue in the same way that I feel about it.

The left is scared that we actually do understand our own thoughts this way instead of "following" somebody else. It is quite an interesting concept to understand things on your own level first. I think all the people who ate the "hope" and "change" are starting to realize that the thought process they possessed was incorrect.

[Alkasquawlik]

what curriculum? more nonsense..

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/10582301...ptember-8-2009

Before the Speech:
• Teachers can build background knowledge about the President of the United States and his speech by reading books about presidents and Barack Obama and motivate students by asking the following questions:
Who is the President of the United States?
What do you think it takes to be President?
To whom do you think the President is going to be speaking?
Why do you think he wants to speak to you?
What do you think he will say to you?
• Teachers can ask students to imagine being the President delivering a speech to all of the students in the United States. What would you tell students? What can students do to help in our schools? Teachers can chart ideas about what they would say.
• Why is it important that we listen to the President and other elected officials, like the mayor, senators, members of congress, or the governor? Why is what they say important?

During the Speech:
• As the President speaks, teachers can ask students to write down key ideas or phrases that are important or personally meaningful. Students could use a note-taking graphic organizer such as a Cluster Web, or students could record their thoughts on sticky notes. Younger children can draw pictures and write as appropriate. As students listen to the speech, they could think about the following:
What is the President trying to tell me?
What is the President asking me to do?
What new ideas and actions is the President challenging me to think about?
• Students can record important parts of the speech where the President is asking them to do something. Students might think about: What specific job is he asking me to do? Is he asking anything of anyone else? Teachers? Principals? Parents? The American people?


There are a ton more suggested activities on the PDF.

[Hallen]

Seems to me he's on the right track. The bailout that began while Bush was in office was all about saving the asses of a lot of big, largely unaccountable businesses all the way down to upside-down mortage defaulters. Don't blame Obama for the bailout. I hated like hell he continued it, but it was just business left over from the last bunch of idiots. My rep, Boehner is now screaming about the big, evil Obama bailout. I wrote him when the initial bailout legislation was in Congress and begged him not to support. Ol' John is pro-biz-at-all-costs to the end though, and in his letter in return stated he felt like "we've got to do something or something worse will happen". I disagreed then, and I disagree now.

By preaching accountability and self-reliance to the young, perhaps he hopes the headoff the financial collapse of 2035. :-)

Let's pause for a little political reality check.

If today, the Obama administration released a statement saying:

"For your own protection we will now monitor religious groups without their knowledge. We will toss the Sixth Amendment out as well-we will determine if you can have counsel. And we reserve the right to detain you for as long as we see fit. Your speedy trial may not be in America's best interests! The Fourth Amendment is gone too. If we decide we need to examine your person, papers or property, we will do so without needing to establish probable cause. You never know where terrorism lurks. Freedom of speech? In addition to monitoring your religious activities, we can now subpoena your library records and prosecute librarians who do not willingly cooperate. All this, remember, is for your own good."

(For those who don't know, these are but a few of the Constitutional provisions that are trampled into dust by "Patriot Act".)

....I can well imagine the screaming grand-mal-foaming-at-the-mouth seizure that would issue from the so-called Conservatives on this board.

If you weren't critical of the politics of terrorism and all the folks who got and are getting stinking rich off taxpayer's squandered money in the so-called War on Terror, (maybe you are, but I don't recall any thtreads about it) then I don't see how you can get your panties in a wad at a relatively benign school speech.....

Maybe I'm just not paranoid enough.

No, your level of paranoid is OK, it's just misdirected.

Again, you keep going back to argue what Bush did as if to justify Obama doing stupid shit is OK because Bush did stupid shit. You can see that is an invalid and pointless argument.

One small difference between your version of the patriot act and the real one... the real one was done to enable the capturing of criminals, people that were known to be dirty but because of our protectionist laws, were unable to be caught. (I still don't agree with a lot of what the patriot act is, but that is beside the point). Plus, I would agrue that if any administration were more likely to do something like what you describe, it would be the Obama administration. It would be couched in phrases like "for your own safety" and "to protect the poor and the weak", etc.

When are you finally going to stop listening to the wonderful cadence of his voice and start listening to the meaning? If you really do, then you'll hear the same things you proport to have heard coming from Bush, only worse. They are both worthless politicians, but Obama has way more of an agenda and way more power than Bush ever had. That's a dangerous combination.

Like I said before, the school speech probably turned out mostly benign because of the uproar that happened. He still slipped in zingers about needing to stay in school so you can help poor people, etc. But other than that, it was fine.

[iX-treame]

What'd you think about it?

I gotta talk to my brother about it when he gets home from work.

I thought it was a waste of my time, his time and money.

[Old'n'Slow]

To Trent:

Most of the things I see, understand, or believe in, I have thought about myself -- and then when I am in the car I turn on Rush/Hannity/Savage and they happen to be discussing the issue in the same way that I feel about it.

...And getting paid handsomely to stir the pot, I might add. Paid-for political opinions are always suspect because it would be career suicide to admit in even the slightest degree that they are in agreement with anything someone they are more-or-less contractually bound to oppose says. They must demonize the opposing view(s) and aggrandized themselves, or else they're out of a job.

It is quite an interesting concept to understand things on your own level first. I think all the people who ate the "hope" and "change" are starting to realize that the thought process they possessed was incorrect.

Let's not even bother with the gross generalization you just made, but many of us do not believe the President is without flaw. However, given the tack taken by many members of the GOP, who supported questionable actions including massive government intrusion into the daily lives of American citizens, mistreatment of military men and women returning from extended deployments, and the extended waffleswaffleswaffleswaffleswaffles-footing over immigration reform, many were willing to try something else.

Alkasquawlik:

What you refer to as a curriculum is merely a set of suggestions for classroom activities. Teachers may or may not participate. Their choice.

This is a curriculum. You either teach it, or lose your Federal funds.

See the difference? :up:

Oh, and let's not forget Hallen:

One small difference between your version of the patriot act and the real one... the real one was done to enable the capturing of criminals, people that were known to be dirty but because of our protectionist laws, were unable to be caught.

Uhhh, the real one still tramples all over the Constitution because it subjects American citizens to actions that the Constitution is designed to protect them from. Do you not get that under the Patriot Act, if you are suspected, for whatever reason, of any activity that so much as raises a flag on some TSA/DHS bureaucrat's computer, that your rights under the Constitution can be suspended indefinitely? You can be held, without reason given. Your religious affiliation can be held against you, not to mention the books you chose to read. We were conned into giving up those liberties because the gov't did a great job of keeping people scared! Where's the list of all the dirty people who are now safely behind bars? I'd like to see it! And protectionist laws? Like the ones that prevent your local cops from rolling you because they don't like the way your car looks? Please!

Plus, I would agrue that if any administration were more likely to do something like what you describe, it would be the Obama administration. It would be couched in phrases like "for your own safety" and "to protect the poor and the weak", etc.

WTF? It was the Bush administration! The Patriot Act is law, unlike Alkasquawlik's curriculum.

[Alkasquawlik]

Alkasquawlik:

What you refer to as a curriculum is merely a set of suggestions for classroom activities. Teachers may or may not participate. Their choice.

This is a curriculum. You either teach it, or lose your Federal funds.

See the difference? :up:

Shoot me for using the wrong word choice
Regardless of what you want to call it, the fact that he tried to implement it was wrong.

[kishg]

looks like someone has the case of egg on his face :rofl:

[Alkasquawlik]

This is a moot point by now, but considering that Obama was talking to the kids, shouldn't that kids themselves, be deciding if they wanted to do the "suggestions for classroom activites", not the teachers?

[Old'n'Slow]

Also, while we're at it, some have suggested that public outcry caused Obama to revise his planned speech. Do you have a draft of the earlier, more incendiary version, or are you just guessing?

Also, FYI, GWB once addressed the kiddies. Did you freak out then, too?

From what I can find out, Sec of Ed sent a letter urging schools to have their students watch, but I couldn't find any chatter about whether they tracked participation. And you guys must have been freaking out about this one:: Bush laid out goals — to increase the graduation rate, improve student competency and better prepare students for entering school — and said, “Let me know how you’re doing. Write me a letter. I’m serious about this one. Write me a letter about ways you can help us achieve our goals.”

Sound familiar?

[kishg]

This is a moot point by now, but considering that Obama was talking to the kids, shouldn't that kids themselves, be deciding if they wanted to do the "suggestions for classroom activites", not the teachers?

next you will be suggesting that kids decide which classes they go to and what they get taught.. how about letting them smoke pot and drink too?

[Old'n'Slow]

This is a moot point by now, but considering that Obama was talking to the kids, shouldn't that kids themselves, be deciding if they wanted to do the "suggestions for classroom activites", not the teachers?

You're right! The kids should decide what they pay attention to, and when. Hmmmmmm......

You sure you don't have closet liberal tendencies? :-p

J/K!

[mrsleeve]

From what I can find out, Sec of Ed sent a letter urging schools to have their students watch, but I couldn't find any chatter about whether they tracked participation. And you guys must have been freaking out about this one:: Bush laid out goals — to increase the graduation rate, improve student competency and better prepare students for entering school — and said, “Let me know how you’re doing. Write me a letter. I’m serious about this one. Write me a letter about ways you can help us achieve our goals.”

Yeah the no child left behind act. Yeah that has done wonders for the public education system. Its done nothing but cause Curriculum to be dummed down to the lowest common denominator, or to just cause kids too be passed on up the line, when they need to be held back at a much greater rate than before. Or the teachers get the blame for it, not because little jhonny refuses to do his work and fails thats the teachers fault under the no child left behind act.

You keep putting your foot in your mouth hole, You keep blaming "W" for all of BHO's short comings and radical agenda. The more you talk on this topic the more you show how little you understand about it.


GO talk to some public school teachers about how the system is now, and not some 20 something thats been out there for 4-6 years talk to the veterans that have been in the class room for 20 years or more. I really think you would be surprised at the answers you get.

[Old'n'Slow]

Yeah the no child left behind act. Yeah that has done wonders for the public education system. Its done nothing but cause Curriculum to be dummed down to the lowest common denominator, or to just cause kids too be passed on up the line, when they need to be held back at a much greater rate than before.

Ahh, the irony of someone with poor written communication skills lamenting the "dumming (sic) down" of the public education system.

You keep putting your foot in your mouth hole, You keep blaming "W" for all of BHO's short comings and radical agenda. The more you talk on this topic the more you show how little you understand about it.

A class act to the last.

Not blaming, really just wondering where all you guys were when GWB was openly flaunting his own shortcomings and equally radical agenda. Drinking the special GWB blindness-inducing Kool-Aid from the looks of it, I'd say. Did you really miss this one???:

Abu Mazen, Palestinian Prime Minister, and Nabil Shaath, his Foreign Minister, describe their first meeting with President Bush in June 2003.

Nabil Shaath:"President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, "George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan." And I did, and then God would tell me, "George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq …" And I did. And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, "Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East." And by God I'm gonna do it.'"

These are inarguably the words of a deluded man. Where was the outrage then? Hannity/Rush/et. al.? Really, that's all I'm asking. Do you hear yourselves? "BHO said X, but what he really means is Y". Wait-is God talking to you too?

[Alkasquawlik]

Also, while we're at it, some have suggested that public outcry caused Obama to revise his planned speech. Do you have a draft of the earlier, more incendiary version, or are you just guessing?

it was public outcry that caused Obama to fall back so fast. parents of the children didn't want their kids to listen to it, and it got picked up by the media.
but no, i do not have the first draft of his speech.

Also, FYI, GWB once addressed the kiddies. Did you freak out then, too?

like i've said numerous times in this thread, i dont have a problem with any President speaking to children about important topics, as long as there isn't a political agenda behind it.

next you will be suggesting that kids decide which classes they go to and what they get taught.. how about letting them smoke pot and drink too?

In a way, kids do choose what classes they would like to take. Somewhat in high school, and moreso in college.
It's their choice if they want to smoke and drink too, I don't care what they decide to do with their bodies.

You're right! The kids should decide what they pay attention to, and when. Hmmmmmm......

You sure you don't have closet liberal tendencies? :-p

J/K!

Contrary to popular belief, I'm not a die hard conservative, I do have some liberal tendencies on certain topics.

Kids already decide what they want to listen to and when. You can force them to sit in a room and lecture them, but it's up to the kid to take the intiative to learn. If they don't want to listen, that's their choice, they just won't go far in life, but I don't think you should ram shit down their throats if they don't want to listen. Teachers should cater to the kids who actually want to learn.
I slept all through my senior year classes because I didn't care about the ridiculous subjects I had to take, got voted most likely to fall asleep in class lol