does faith make you a better person?

[Mr Two]

You're right, there is a difference between "Theory" and "Hypothesis". Apologies for using the wrong word.

I guess whichever side of the table you're sitting on depends how you view the other. I'm not one to dismiss the big bang except for the lack of actual fact, the same as some dismiss the presence of (a) God due to a lack of factual evidence of said God.

I don't see how ID is not a rational idea in terms of the Scientific realm. Care to explain your dismissal of a possible avenue of reasoning in science that current hypothesis' cannot explain? No more so than "crystals" that spawned a certain genetic structure via molecules lining up juuuuust right to create the first cell. Rinse and repeat. How is that not laughable in the slightest. Give me one idea of where it all started at.

When did I say the planet was created in seven days? My issues with the Big Bang are not the Big Bang part. It's the illusion of what preceded the Big Bang. All these researches and studies done on it and not one can point in any GENERAL area (that's not hysterical) of where it all began. I'm not trying to argue Christianity Vs. Atheism, or anything else of that nature.

I'm not against the Big Bang. Just the conclusions that it's where everything began. Logically, this doesn't follow as there was obviously shit there to start the whole thing in motion.

For your first point - the difference here is Big Bang theory is backed by a lot of hard evidence, whereas your belief in god is backed by none. You're also making the mistake of thinking that Big Bang Theory explains the first cause, which it does not. It describes how our universe came into being, but not anything before that. Currently all we can do is speculate on that point. I can claim that a giant lizard being created the Earth in seven days, and it would have the same validity as the claim that it was god. You cannot prove what I said was wrong - but it is illogical to believe in such a claim simply because an extraordinary claim requires extraordinary evidence - something neither religion nor the lizard hypothesis I just whipped up have.


ID is not scientific. At all. It has no place in a science classroom. Go read up on the Stokes case. As far as the formation of life, go look up the Miller Urey experiment. We were able to create amino acids in conditions thought to be like those on early Earth. Amino acids are the basic building blocks of life. As far as evolution is concerned, look at Nylonase. There is a strain of bacteria that evolved to be able to digest Nylon, which is man made. The evidence for evolution is overwhelming.

Does there have to be a first cause? If one claims that god was the first cause, who created god? Where did he/she/it come from? If the answer is "god always was", why can't the same arguement be applied to the universe? Anyway, if you're interested in the origins of the universe, watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ImvlS8PLIo


@Ral - Hitler saw religion as a tool for control. With all the violence caused by religious beliefs - the Crusades, the conflicts between Jews and Muslims in the Middle East, the Inquisition, ect, ect. I mean fuck, Bush thought the war in Iraq was a holy war that he was waging on behalf of Christianity - the only conclusion you can make is that humans are violent, and religion does nothing to change that.

[Wh33lhop]

I rest my case.

[Nic01101011]

the devils a mothafuckin liar.. so you know i aint worried BEEYOTCH

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwsWskgKe5E

[Ral]

here's something to think about. A large majority of charities were founded, and continue to be run, by religious organizations. Religious conservatives are the highest-donating segment of our society. It provides a morality structure while younger, and a direct incentive to strive to be a better man. In short, it provides a framework for those who would choose to have faith to communicate with and honor a God they believe in. While most on this board would decry the very idea of "missionary" work, many third-world countries are better off today because religious groups came and brought not only their religion but modern technology and methods.

Religion is not the end-all-be-all of faith. Think of it like a training program, or lattice for a vine to climb. If men were perfect, it would not be needed. But, because men are not perfect, it is needed. So, why would you decry the structure for men to use because men themselves fall short, or use it to their own ends? To draw a parallel, Government in itself is a good thing, but in the wrong hands or used the wrong way it is destructive. Don't blame the idea of Government, but those who fall short of the ideals of it.

For those who think that religion is the cause of, or major contributing factor to, violence throughout history, look at communist/fascist societies that did away with te idea of "religion" or changed it to place themselves at the pinnacle: the Holocaust, the tragedies that occurred during Stalin and Lenin's takeover of Russia, Chinese civil rights violations, etc. People are naturally violent. Religion (generally) provides a buttress to that.

[markseven]

Can someone explain this to me?

If you are tempted by the devil, and you do right by him... why are you punished by him when you get to hell?

Cause he's a liar!

[dirty30]

Can someone explain this to me?

If you are tempted by the devil, and you do right by him... why are you punished by him when you get to hell?

[Massive Lee]

.. there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...

Is that a reference to the comedy "The invention of lying"?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oc79ho-PzeE

[ACMF74]

the bible/commandments are trying to teach people how to live morally and w/o sin. if you don't like it fine, leave it and don't bash it.

[Scotaku]

man always has to be right, and he is willing to kill the other motherfucker that is arguing with him about it.

See just about any Internet forum on any subject for evidence; r3v, 'vortex, you name it.

[s0urce]

I like the way George Carlin put it...

"Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it, religion has actually convinced people that there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...who watches every thing you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten special things that he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever 'til the end of time...but he loves you ...and he needs money! He's all powerful, but he can't handle money!"

i love this

[phreshkid]

if no one else believe in jesus, i still will.

[E30Kaiser]

I for one believe faith is an extremely personal thing, and I don't even really go to church that often anymore because of that belief.

Despite that let me just respond to the whole "Religion has caused the world untold agony!" argument commonly used. Whether religion was here or not, whether people believed in God or not, the world would still suck and be fucked up. People bring up the Crusades and Spanish inquisition as atrocities caused by religion and the like, however while evil things have been done in the name of religion, it is just a symptom of the evil of man and the way he likes to cover it up with words. For all of these non-secular atrocities committed by people and states, you have plenty of equal or greater examples of agony on the secular side. Communism and the numerous purges and wars fought in its name, same thing for anti-communist movements. There are just as many good deeds done in the name of secular and non-secular ideals as well.

The point is that it isn't religion that is evil, but the fact that man always has to be right, and he is willing to kill the other motherfucker that is arguing with him about it.

As a person of faith I look up to many people of faith as well, such as Ayrton Senna and Ghandi(who was killed partially for believing in religious freedom) and I look up to just as many people of no faith such as Bruce Lee.

As for Charles Darwin...he was a racist, people need to stop hyping him up so much. Evolution is fine, but that isn't exactly just what he was preaching.

[hoveringuy]

I like the way George Carlin put it...

"Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it, religion has actually convinced people that there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...who watches every thing you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten special things that he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever 'til the end of time...but he loves you ...and he needs money! He's all powerful, but he can't handle money!"

[E30Nova]

I believe that to have faith is to understand that there is a fundamental order underlying everything in the universe. At some point in the distant past this order was set into motion by what can only be described as God. No amount of religion or science will unlock all the secrets of this order and explain it in terms that can be understood by our feeble minds. No matter what you do, whether you bring world peace, or murder 6 million Jews, this was all determined by forces that are much greater than yourself. Once you realize this and also that there is no possible way to avoid any of it, you can have faith and give yourself up to God so to speak.

That's not faith, that's fate.

Like someone else said, religion is a crutch.



Matt

[ForcedFirebird]

I like the way Albert Einstein put it...

"If you don't believe in a god, and there is no god, what have you lost? Although, if you don't believe and there is such an existence, what do you stand to lose?"

I also find it strange that the self proclaimed "Christians" etc will be the first to go against moral ethics (even though that is my faith, and certainly don't push it on others).

One's relationship with any spiritual being is up to the individual, no one should get in the way of one's beliefs and that is the very reason the Pilgrims colonized the US in the first place.